[Primer] Boros Burn

[BlakLanner]

After my matches yesterday, I have made the following changes

Maindeck
-1 Mutavault, -1 Warleader's Helix, +1 Temple of Silence, +1 Stoke the Flames

Land is to support sideboard change, I have found that I prefer Stoke over Helix since I race less often and want to lighten my reliance on white mana.

Sideboard
-2 Propehetic Flamespeaker, -2 Banishing Light, -3 Firedrinker Satyr, +4 Toil/Trouble, +2 Wear/Tear, +1 Satyr Firedancer

I simply don't like Flamespeaker. It is nullified by Caryatid, Jace, Fleecemane Lion, and most removal. Cutting Banishing Light may be wrong but I have never managed to get it to work. Firedrinker Satyr gets cut for Toil/Trouble since I am seeing a lot more Celestial Flare and Azorius Charm to shut it down. I missed Wear/Tear badly last event so they are coming back in. the 4th Firedancer comes in since I use that as my primary removal against GW and Mono Blue.

[Elricity]

I simply don't like Flamespeaker. It is nullified by ... Fleecemane Lion

Explain.

[BlakLanner]

You cannot attack into one, nor profitably block one. It costs less mana as well.

[Elricity]

You cannot attack into one, nor profitably block one. It costs less mana as well.

You can't be serious.

[NotARobot]

Eh I finally got a chance to play flamespeaker against GW agro last night and it was a house. First strike puts every single one of our spells in kill range, the only thing that gets out of hand is unflinching courage, but they don't run the hexproof stuff so its not too hard to find an answer.

And lions are KOS if you have one go monstrous you are in a bad spot

[Elricity]

Ok, I should calm down. This argument came up from DTR a lot when I first brought up the card so it's a pet peeve.

I can appreciate not wanting to use the creature because of play style, being bad against monsters, and difficult to use against control. Each person has to sideboard for their style of play.

However, Flamespeaker has first strike and trample. Couple with burn, it can attack or block through anything with 5 or less toughness and forces your opponent to commit blockers first. It runs the same principle as ash zealot. Even Polukranos or wurms are not a threat to Flamespeaker. They just aren't.

[Elricity]

Eh I finally got a chance to play flamespeaker against GW agro last night and it was a house. First strike puts every single one of our spells in kill range, the only thing that gets out of hand is unflinching courage, but they don't run the hexproof stuff so its not too hard to find an answer.

But seriously though, what is the chance that you draw 2 of your 25+ removal spells to make this happen by turn 4?

Ok, sure, it's 97.5% but do you really want to depend on those kind of odds to base your strategy around it?

[Elricity]

On a related tangent, has anyone had any success with Hushwing? If green already got hated out, then that just leaves blue or BW for my playstyle I want to use it which probably isn't worth the space since I never play either deck online. That said, if someone's used it as extra skullcracks against black, I'm curious there too.

Pillar has already killed a couple of Gary to zero out their devotion so I'm happy with the card being versatile in the control role for me.

[NotARobot]

Haven't been able to watch the pt at all. Anyone representing burn there?

[BlakLanner]

On a related tangent, has anyone had any success with Hushwing? If green already got hated out, then that just leaves blue or BW for my playstyle I want to use it which probably isn't worth the space since I never play either deck online. That said, if someone's used it as extra skullcracks against black, I'm curious there too.

Pillar has already killed a couple of Gary to zero out their devotion so I'm happy with the card being versatile in the control role for me.

I have had some luck with Hushwing shutting down Master of Waves. I bring it in against Mono Black as well but haven't gotten to spring that trap yet.

4-0 tonight at FNM with the new list beating GW, UWR control, Jund Midrange and lucked my way through Hexproof.

[magicdownunder]

hang-on the GW your facing are not MD'ing Witchstalkers? That seems like an odd choice in a removal heavy metagame.

[BrainsickHater]

Hushwing has been most useful against monoblue for me. It's the only matchup where I find myself being able to run it out confidently before they play a creature with ETB triggers.

Against monoblack, you have to hold it, which is fine, just not stellar.

Against green, if you're on the draw, their Nylea's Disciple will usually come down before hand, and oftentimes you'll find yourself without enough untapped mana to "counter" a Hornet Queen or Primordial since they have you spending mana to keep tempo on most turns.

[BrainsickHater]

hang-on the GW your facing are not MD'ing Witchstalkers? That seems like an odd choice in a removal heavy metagame.

Witchstalker is bear for 3, and not even a 3 that's easy to cast. What makes GW powerful is that they get an insane rate on almost all their creatures. They're not in the business for overcosted dudes, even if they have hexproof.

[BrainsickHater]

I'm also off Flamespeaker for the time being. I really did enjoy the card, but the controlling playstyle doesn't suit me very well. As soon as I switched back to being more aggressive and tempo-oriented my win rate shot up considerably.

For me, the deck runs best when I'm hurtling through turns, constantly chipping away at my opponent's life total and maneuvering through their plays to keep them off-step until I close it out with a flurry of damage. Pretty much tapping out to play something that isn't connecting this turn, or maybe not ever, really breaks that up and pushes me in a direction that I personally don't want to be in.

[magicdownunder]

3/3 Hexproof bear is quite good when you can create alphas with walkers and auras - but if they all believe its horrible more power for us.

[BrainsickHater]

Is it a 3/3? If so then yeah that doesn't seem bad.

GG is a super real cost in the deck tho

[magicdownunder]

I've done a lot of playing vs the Naya version that was out a while back so here's my experience with walker decks in general plus the one whole match and theorycraft I played vs Jund last night.

Sideboarded magma spray from them makes the matchup quite a bit more difficult. You kind of want to keep your phoenixes because you know all your burn wants to go up if possible. Use shocks to counterspell spray if at all possible.

Young Pyromancer sucks lots of ass vs Chandra. Normally YP grinds out Jund but not when against that card advantage engine. Chandra is easier to ignore if she's not killing your cards. Chains are obviously inferior since they only hit one good creature and they pack so much enchantment removal. So, I recommend cutting one or the other for
things like mortars and/or pillar or maybe just bring in more burn if you have Trouble on the play.

I disagree that you can ignore an early Xenagos. Multiplicative damage is going to race you too fast unless your hand is all boros charms. You can ignore a single token for sure, but an unchecked Xenagos is a 4 turn clock at 20 life. It takes an impressive burn hand that can actually win turn 7.

Rakdos Returns punishes you for durdling. You can't afford to keep slow hands (like my 5 lander after getting upset mulling each game in the match).

Solid post this is indeed the steps towards victory

@BrainsickHater: I'm glad going aggressive has worked out well for

@BlakLanner: Much needed victory at last, I never manage to PM you anything because I ruined my computer and lost
all my data

[Kyarie]

Played in FNM last night using a mainboard list the same as MDU mk2 on page 174 with the following sideboard:

[deck]2 x Chandra, Pyromaster
3 x Prophetic Flamespeaker
2 x Hushwing Gryff
2 x Pillar of Light
1 x Stoke the Flames
2 x Banishing Light
3 x Mizzium Mortars[/deck]

Rnd 1 was vs MonoGreen Devotion - win die roll - steam roll with 4 damage burn spells and double young 'mancer. Loved the fact that he attacked into a board of 2 tapped 'mancers and untapped mana with a fatty and midling and I boros charm him, create 2 elementals, block with them, tap them to cast stoke with my remaining 2 lands for 4 more to his face and replacement tokens. Overall, went 2-1. 2nd game he just got too many big fatties to quick and I wasn't seeing my removal that wasn't burn. Sided in Hushwings and Pillars siding out 2 skullcrack, 2 shock. Didn't see any boarded cards either game.

Rnd 2 was vs UW
Control - lost die roll - he was sleepy from being up since 3am and flying into Texas from upstate New York. I put pressure on, waited for tap out (rev or elspeth) and skullcrack or lethal burn. He didn't play his best and was making some tired errors. Overall, went 2-0. Sided out 4 chains and in 2 chandra and 2 flamespeaker. Have known this opponent for a while and he really likes creature-light builds though one day he might surprise me.

Rnd 3 was vs Jund Planeswalkmonsters - lost die roll - this was a pretty good amalgam deck that was mostly Jund Planeswalkers main that would transform into monsters game 2. I boarded out 4 chains and brought in 2 pillar and 2 banishing light (showed me PolyK game 1 and lots of walkers as well as golgari charm). Had to shift to bring chains back in along with hushwing (stupid disciple). Game 3 could have gone either way and was a lot of fun. Pulled it out with lethal the turn before he could have had it - 2 phoenixes swing and 5 burn for lethal. Overall, went
2-1 so 3-0 in rounds now.

Rnd 4 was vs Small Red Aggro - lost die roll - I just assumed control roll burning creatures and stabilized at 8 life and then managed to stick young 'mancer and burn creatures, swing with 'mancer and tokens to win. Sided out 4 skullcrack and stoke to bring in 3 flamespeakers and 2 chandra. The flamespeakers did work. Exiled 6 cards off flamespeaker triggers when we hit topdeck mode: burn and a land twice and 2 lands once - awesome. Overall 2-0 with a 4-0 for the night.

For some reason blue devotion and black devotion are almost never played at my LGS - everyone seems to love green (mono, jund, junk, bug, naya) , UW control or aggro builds.

Just want to say a heartfelt thanks to you all who test and work so hard on these decklists. I really get to play once a week, twice if I'm lucky and reading your experiences and more importantly watching your streams and videos has made me a much more competent and confident player. Channeled MDU on my last game last night. 1
temple of malice, 3 lightning strikes, 1 magma jet, 1 chained to the rocks and 1 boros charm for the opening hand. "land! land! land! - got there."

Cheers

[Kyarie]

I really want to thank all of you who contribute to this thread and DTR. I get the chance to play Magic once a week and maybe twice if I'm lucky. I lurk here and read what you all are doing and more importantly watch the videos you all post and that has made me a much better player over the course of this season.

Played in FNM last night. Went 4-0 playing against:

Rnd 1 MonoGreen Devotion - 2 to 1
Rnd 2 UW Control - 2 to 0
Rnd 3 Jund Planesmonsters - 2 to 1
Rnd 4 Small Red Aggro - 2 to 0

I played MDU's mk2 list from page 174 with the following sideboard

[deck]2 x Chandra, Pyromaster
3 x Prophetic Flamespeaker
2 x Hushwing Gryff
2 x Pillar of Light
1 x Stoke the Flames
2 x Banishing Light
3 x Mizzium Mortars[/deck]

MonoGreen was tough when he ramped fatties out quickly game 2 and I just didn't draw answers. Brought in hushwing and pillars but didn't see
them.

UW control was against a friend who had been up and traveling long distance and he played sleepy. Pressure and then hurt him when he would have to tap out for rev or elspeth. He really doesn't like creatures much in his builds so I took out 4 chains and brought in 2 flamespeaker and 2 chandra.

Jund Planesmonsters was a cool deck taking a mostly planeswalker approach game 1 with a transform to monsters in game 2. I boarded out 4 chains and in 2 pillars and 2 banishing light game 2 - he showed PolyK and Golgari Charm in addition to the boatload of walkers game 1. Switched it up game 3 to bring back my chains and bring in hushwing for those annoying disciples. Game three was close but phoenixes and burn for the win.

Small Red Aggro was pretty easy. Control the board with burn and kill with 'mancer and elemental tokens game 1. Game 2 I boarded out 4 'cracks and stoke and brought in chandra and flamespeaker. Flamespeaker was great drawing me 6 cards when we fell into a topdeck war.
Awesome.

And finally, I channeled MrMDU on my last game of the night. Kept a one land hand with temple of malice, 3 lightning strikes, magma jet, chained to the rocks and boros charm. Found myself thinking in an Australian accent "land! land! land! got there..." as I drew a mounting for my first draw.

[Kyarie]

Damn, sorry for the double post. The browser crashed and I didn't think it went through.

*edit: <sigh> triple post

[HK1997]

And finally, I channeled MrMDU on my last game of the night. Kept a one land hand with temple of malice, 3 lightning strikes, magma jet, chained to the rocks and boros charm. Found myself thinking in an Australian accent "land! land! land! got there..." as I drew a mounting for my first draw.

THanks for report mate! Keep it up

[BlakLanner]

@BlakLanner: Much needed victory at last, I never manage to PM you anything because I ruined my computer and lost all my data

Well, it wasn't a daily, just an FNM. It is a step in the right direction though. What did you do to your rig? I am an IT guy, maybe it is fixable.

[Elricity]

And finally, I channeled MrMDU on my last game of the night. Kept a one land hand with temple of malice, 3 lightning strikes, magma jet, chained to the rocks and boros charm. Found myself thinking in an Australian accent "land! land! land! got there..." as I drew a mounting for my first draw.

THanks for report mate! Keep it up

I tried it on a mull to 6 and then didn't see a land in my next 5 draw steps. Which oddly means the mulligan was the correct call? Shrug.

[Jamie]

Is there anything to increase chances of lucking a win vs hexproof decks? Maybe a boros reckoner is the only way this deck has

[densetsushun]

Hey guys, new to posting to this forum but not new to this archetype. I'm going to attend GP Utrecht and I'd like to hear what you all think of my list and gameplan.
[deck]
8 Mountain
4 Sacred Foundry
4 Temple of Triumph
1 Temple of Silence
1 Temple of Malice
3 Mutavault
2 Battlefield Forge

4 Shock
4 Magma Jet
4 Lightning Strike
4 Skullcrack
4 Boros Charm
3 Warleader's Helix
2 Stoke the Flames
4 Young Pyromancer
4 Chandra's Phoenix
4 Chained to the Rocks
Sideboard
3 Banishing Light
2 Chandra, Pyromaster
2 Pillar of Light
3 Mizzium Mortars
1 Warleader's Helix
2 Assemble the Legion
2 Toil // Trouble
[/deck]
Let me start with my reasoning for -1 Helix main and 2 Stoke the Flames main: I want to have 2 mainboard answers to BBoV and Stormbreath. I don't know if this is right, it hasn't failed me in testing yet and this setup has led me to have only 4 dead cards against UW preboard.

I'm
not quite sure about the exact sideboard composition, I used to run 1 less Banishing Light and a singleton Wear//Tear, but I find that I'm not missing the W//T. I am considering 1 less Banishing Light and a 3rd T//T. Given the current 75, this is the sideboard plan I've come up with:

Sideboard plan

---

Against monoblack devotion: -4 Skullcrack, -4 Shock, -1 Boros Charm, +1 Helix, +2 Pillar of Light, +2 Assemble the Legion, +2 Banishing Light, +2 Chandra. I like the plan of ignoring their lifegain and embarrassing them with Assemble the Legion and Chandra.
Against BW Midrange: -4 Shock, -Skullcrack, +1 Helix, +2 Pillar of Light, +2 Toil // Trouble, +3 Mortars. I want more answers to Demon, BBoV and Obzedaddy while hopefully I can maintain pressure and a high density of large damage spells.
Against monoblue devotion: -4 Chandra's Phoenix, -4 Shock, -2 Stoke the Flames, +3 Mortars, +2 Toil // Trouble, +3 Banishing Light, +2 Chandra Pyromaster. Phoenix is bad against their
fliers, Mortars come in as extra removal and potentially as boardwipe, Banishing Light as extra answers to Master, Chandra is a bit more difficult for them to deal with and the advantage is great for grinding them out. Monoblue should be trying to play tempo against us postboard so T // T should do some damage if I can resolve it.
Against Jund Monsters: -4 Skullcrack, -2 Shock, +1 Helix, +2 Pillar of Light, +3 Mizzium Mortars. Bring in more answers to their fatties and race them.
Against UW Control: -4 Chained, -4 Shock, +1 Warleader’s Helix, +3 Banishing Light, +2 Chandra, Pyromaster, +2 Toil // Trouble. Toil // Trouble does so much work here, I think I want one more if only for this matchup. Chandra could be powerful here if it resolves but I think it'll eat a removal pretty quickly. I want Banishing Light against Elspeth, D-Sphere or Archangel if it's brought in.
Against Esper Control: -4 Chained, -4 Shock, +2 Toil // Trouble, +3 Banishing Light, +3 Mizzium Mortars. Pretty similar to the
previous one except I bring in Mortars for BBoV and NVS instead of Helix and Chandra.
Against Monogreen devotion: I'm honestly just lost in this matchup, I think it's right to slow down their devotion, answer fatties as much as possible and race at the same time, but I'm at a loss as to what I can do if they go off and puke their hand.

What is the collective DTR expert opinion on this 75 and plan? Should I bring back the 1-of W//T, should I go up a T//T? Is Hushwing Gryff worth playing over other sideboard cards? Anymore tips?

[BlakLanner]

Is there anything to increase chances of lucking a win vs hexproof decks? Maybe a boros reckoner is the only way this deck has

Wear/Tear or Banishing Light their critical enchantments, use Helix and YP tokens to help race. Those are your best options. I wouldn't use Reckoner to hedge here as we would be adding a few points on a miserable matchup. However, if these new "Rabble Red" decks increase in popularity, we might want to add it anyway.

[Lightning_Dolt]

I could see anger of the gods if rabble red is big.

[BlakLanner]

Seeing all the Red, BW and Mono Blue at the PT and the Open, I wonder if we might want to go back to Searing Blood.

[magicdownunder]

Seeing all the Red, BW and Mono Blue at the PT and the Open, I wonder if we might want to go back to Searing Blood.

Its what I did

Working on a new "truly #YOLO list" because Stoke the Flames is such a strong card its unbelievable.

[BlakLanner]

PM or chat me on MODO and we can put our heads together. I miss my Searing Bloods.

[magicdownunder]

PM or chat me on MODO and we can put our heads together. I miss my Searing Bloods.

I'll post it here despite the backlash I may receive

[deck=MDU's YOLO (work in progress)]Lands 24
4 Battlefield Forge
8 Mountain
4 Mutavault
4 Sacred Foundry
4 Temple of Triumph

Creatures 08
4 Chandra's Phoenix
4 Eidolon of the Great Revel

Enchantments 03
2 Chained to the Rocks
1 Banishing Light

Spells 25
4 Boros Charm
4 Lightning Strike
4 Shock
4 Warleader's Helix
3 Searing Blood
3 Skullcrack
3 Stoke the Flames

Sideboard 11
4 Satyr Firedancer
2 Chained to the Rocks
2 Chandra, Pyromaster
1 Searing Blood
1 Skullcrack
1 Stoke the Flames

nPlaceholder Cards 04
3 Toil // Trouble
1 Glare of Heresy[/deck]

All this is really is my way of saying "I'm sick of green and blue devotions decks online" the deck's key feature are the 24 lands, 4x Eidolon of the Great Revel (<-- what I like about this card is that people usually wait for you too make the first move so that they can get some value from removal effects - this is great because it buys times too draw additional lands) and the additional 4cc spells.

The four placeholder cards are for control but it seems unnecessary so I'm thinking about running 3x Prophetic Flamespeaker and 1x Decide inits slot but I'm not sure.

[BlakLanner]

Hmm. 24 lands and no Magma Jet makes me worry about flooding. Eidolon is fine if everyone is going faster, but I would really miss my pseudo-Fireblast (I was convoking left and right last night). Otherwise, it is a neat throwback to what we used to play. I stayed on the Eidolon version until Stoke became legal. Toil/Trouble vs FDS is a bit of a personal preference, I think. Trouble did better for me yesterday but FDS can swing through Caryatids. Might want Hushwings as extra Skullcracks and to make Mono Blue players cry.

With a bit of testing and tuning, it could be solid.

[Khaospawn]

Love that YOLO list.

[NotARobot]

I'm having trouble with UW today. Guess they saw the PT decks and all of the sudden its back to 4x fiendslayers and 4x flares postboard... very annoying v_v

My list is definitely weak to control, I wish I could shore up that matchup some more

[magicdownunder]

Toil/Trouble vs FDS is a bit of a personal preference, I think. Trouble did better for me yesterday but FDS can swing through Caryatids.

imo:

FDS is better for players trying to close the game quickly (it does requite luck since hitting FDS past T3 may as well be a self-discard spell), T//T is for the players who don't mind going the distance via forcing Revs or counters (less risk but arguably harder to archive).

Hmm. 24 lands and no Magma Jet makes me worry about flooding. Eidolon is fine if everyone is going faster, but I would really miss my pseudo-Fireblast (I was
convoking left and right last night). Otherwise, it is a neat throwback to what we used to play. I stayed on the Eidolon version until Stoke became legal.

If you watch my videos I mostly chant "land, land, land" so I'm much more comfortable with flooding esp. if I'm running 4x vaults rather then missing that critical 4th land drop, in regards with the pseudo-Fireblast while it is GREAT it isn't that common against a T1 metagame so it shouldn't be the selling feature.

Love that YOLO list.

I figured you would

I'm having trouble with UW today.
Guess they saw the PT decks and all of the sudden its back to 4x fiendslayers and 4x flares postboard... very annoying v_v

My list is definitely weak to control, I wish I could shore up that matchup some more

Toil // Trouble and Eidolon of the Great Revel are strong vs control, Banishing Light, Glare of Heresy, Satyr Firedancer and Speaker are decent vs the FSP problem (I prefer Glare and BL the most here).

[NotARobot]

Ugh and then I run into hexproof. I hate when dailies start off so promising then it dumps you into your 2 worst matchups.

[BlakLanner]

3 interesting burn decks make Top 16 at SCG Dallas.

Top 8: http://sales.starcitygames.com//deckdat ... ckID=70846
Plays Phoenix, YP AND Eidolon all maindeck on 21 lands with 4 Helix and 4 Stoke. Possibly a case of run hot.

9th Place: http://sales.starcitygames.com//deckdat ... ckID=70823
Standard YP and Phoenix, Chains in Sideboard, 3 Shock, 3 Searing Blood, 4 Helix, 3 Stoke.

11th Place: http://sales.starcitygames.com//deckdat ... ckID=70851
Stormbreath and Chandra main, 22 lands. 3 Helix, 1 Stoke, Strike in sideboard.


Still waiting on the
PT Top 8 burn list to show up on the mothership for comparison.

[BlakLanner]

Looks like Sperling's list skipped Magma Jet altogether and put Chains in the side.

[deck]
Spells
4 Shock
3 Skullcrack
4 Lightning Strike
4 Searing Blood
4 Boros Charm
4 Stoke the Flames
4 Warleader's Helix

Creatures
4 Young Pyromancer
1 Eidolon of the Great Revel
4 Chandra's Phoenix

Land
4 Mutavault
3 Sacred Foundry
9 Mountain
4 Battlefield Forge
4 Temple of Triumph

Sideboard
1 Skullcrack
1 Eidolon of the Great Revel
1 Banishing Light
3 Chained to the Rocks
2 Glare of Heresy
4 Satyr Firedancer
2 Chandra, Pyromaster
1 Wear // Tear
[/deck]

[krose1313]

Mothership has updated Top 8 for PT. One burn list, playing a singleton Eidelon mainboard and another in the side...interesting. Looking forward to seeing it and the pilot in action..

[Platypus]

Here's the list:

[deck]Creature (9)
4 Young Pyromancer
1 Eidolon of the Great Revel
4 Chandra's Phoenix

Instant (27)
4 Shock
3 Skullcrack
4 Lightning Strike
4 Boros Charm
4 Stoke the Flames
4 Warleader's Helix
4 Searing Blood

Land (24)
4 Mutavault
3 Sacred Foundry
9 Mountain
4 Battlefield Forge
4 Temple of Triumph

Sideboard (15)
1 Skullcrack
1 Eidolon of the Great Revel
1 Banishing Light
3 Chained to the Rocks
2 Glare of Heresy
4 Satyr Firedancer
2 Chandra, Pyromaster
1 Wear // Tear[/deck]

Some interesting choices. 4 Stoke the Flames and 4 Searing Blood maindeck, no Chained to the Rocks. Satyr Firedancers in the SB.

EDIT: Apparently I can't see that the same deck has been posted two messages ago...