Dissecting Khaos Deck Wins and How to Play It (Updated)

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Khaospawn
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Dissecting Khaos Deck Wins and How to Play It (Updated)

Postby Khaospawn » Thu Mar 28, 2013 6:16 pm

I posted my deck in the MTGS Sligh thread one day and this was the response I got:
Looks really good Khaos ~ can you give me some data on your key matchups when you get some testing done? We're pretty similar 75, with some notable differences, wouldnt mind seeing how it works.
That quote is from none other than the great zemanjaski.

Since you asked for it, Z, you’re gonna get it. And maybe a little bit more than what you bargained for.

Enjoy, everyone!

Section One: The Cards I’m Playing:

I first want to state that I don’t play on MTGO or Cockatrice (though I probably should). I play all of my games IRL and I bounce around playing at 3 different gaming stores, all of which have a sizable and diverse base. All of my experience, information, and decisions come from playing in my meta. The majority of
the players in my area are no slouches, and there are a lot of “top tier” decks to be found. Whether or not I’m qualified to give an “official” deck tech for the community remains to be seen. But anyway, without further ado, here is my deck.

[Deck]Creatures (30)
4 Rakdos Cackler
4 Stromkirk Noble
3 Stonewright
4 Ash Zealot
4 Gore-House Chainwalker
3 Lightning Mauler
4 Pyreheart Wolf
4 Hellrider

Burn (8)
4 Pillar of Flame
4 Searing Spear

Land (22)
1 Hellion Crucible
21 Mountain

Sideboard
3 Bonfire of the Damned
4 Mizzium Mortars
2 Zealous Conscripts
2 Frostburn Weird
2 Hellion Crucible
2 Hound of Griselbrand[/Deck]

Rakdos Cackler: A 1-Drop 2/2 is just what the doctor ordered. The fact that he can’t block doesn’t mean much when I’m always turning him sideways. Cackler is great in the early game but lackluster as the game progresses. With that said, I still want 4 in my deck so I can see him in my opening hand.

Stromkirk Noble:[/b:
621lqqsm] This guy is a beast and has the potential to just run away with a game. There are many decks that play Humans so his evasiveness is pretty relevant. He’s actually pretty good in the mirror considering that Lightning Mauler, Stonewright, Gore-House Chainwalker, and Ash Zealot are Humans. Against a Control player, multiple Nobles can be a nightmare if they cannot answer him. Ideally, Stromkirk Noble will always be my first turn play. He’s just so good against a variety of decks. At the very least, he’ll eat a removal spell that should’ve been aimed at a Hellrider. As great as he is, however, he suffers the same fate as the Cackler in that his usefulness dwindles when you’re in late game topdeck mode. Still, he’s a must include as a set.

Stonewright: We should all know by now how good ole Stoney can be. Whether he’s buffing a First Striker for efficient blocks or acting as a game winning mana sink, Stonewright is one of the three synergistic components that hold the deck
together. However, if he’s so strong, then why do I only play 3? Well, Stonewright is one of those cards that you always want to see during the game but don’t want to topdeck multiples consecutively. In my experience, 3 is the magic number for our little Earth-bending human.

Gore-House Chainwalker: Two mana for a 3/2 creature that can’t block doesn’t seem like a likely candidate as a 4-of auto-include, but within the confines of the current Standard, the Chainwalker fits the curve just nicely. His 3 power means he will trade with a Thragtusk/Beast Token, kill an Auger of Bolas or Vampire Nighthawk, and make the controller of Garruk, Relentless think twice before fighting him off for a flip. Chainwalker is your go-to guy to get into the Red Zone; his sole purpose is to attack, attack, and then attack some more. Who cares if he can’t block? He can hold his own without Stonewright, but when paired with a friend, he can be a complete crusher.

Ash Zealot: I’
m in love with this girl. Ash Zealot is quite possibly the best 2-Drop in Red ever made. She definitely joins the ranks of Hellspark Elemental, Keldon Maurauders, and Plated Geopede, in my opinion. But, in Standard she IS the best Red 2-drop and she is a must have in every Red Sligh deck. For 2 measly Red you can have a 2/2 First Striker with Haste and some Flashback hate. Sign me up!

Lightning Mauler: Controversial in some circles and applauded as an all-star in others, Lightning Mauler usually sits on that edge of being very good or very lackluster. I had my doubts about this card at the beginning of this season but I always said that Mauler could be very good in a deck that played Pyreheart Wolf. And I was right. Some people like to play Mauler over Chainwalker (or vice versa) but I think that’s a mistake. Play both. Mauler actually has several good things going for him. For one, he’s a Human, which makes him synergistic in a themed deck or even when just playing Cavern of
Souls. Two, I really like his mana cost: having only one Red Mana in his cost is important when running Hellion Crucibles – getting color screwed on T2 can be pretty bad. Third, he can play the part of a Shred-Freak against Control or help recover from a boardwipe by (windmill) slamming him on the table and then casting/pairing with a Chainwalker to swing for 5. What Mauler brings to the game is extra speed during games where speed will make all the difference, especially when he bonds with Pyreheart Wolf. As good as he is 3 are the most I’ll play of Mr. Mauler. He’s good but I don’t want to see him as often as an Ash Zealot.

Pyreheart Wolf: Ah, the reason why our deck can fully exist. Granted, Mono Red Sligh was still a strong deck before we discovered this gem, but the addition of the Wolf put Red over the top on the competitive stage. Pyreheart is the second component of a winning Mono Red Sligh list because he allows us to go around other decks’ larger creatures such as
Thragtusk, ensuring we can maximize our damage in a shorter amount of time. I play 4 because I always want to see this guy. He even makes for a great blocker in certain match-ups; his Undying is very relevant.

Hellrider: The third and final component to the deck and our main finisher. Hellrider takes advantage of the large mass of creatures Sligh plays and perverts that to the extreme. In fact, I always feel dirty when I have 2 on the field; it’s just not fair to the opponent. But hey, maybe that’s what they get for not answering all the creatures I’ve played. Hellrider tops our curve out at 4 and I must say, a full set of this Devil is mandatory. Hell, I’d play 8 in my deck if I could.

Pillar of Flame: The bane of Zombie decks everywhere, Pillar is actually quite useful in the mirror match (or basically against any other aggro deck you may face). The fact that it’s a sorcery speed Shock isn’t what makes it so good. Its
strength is not only in its ability to turn off Undying (such as on an opposing Pyreheart Wolf or Geralf’s Messenger), but also in its lone Red Mana in the casting cost. I favor a full set of this card in my deck for these reasons. Playing 4 means I’m always ready to take out any Undying creatures I may face, and I can maximize my mana in the early game by burning away an opposing critter and then playing one of my own. Besides, in the G/x match-up, nothing makes me happier than when I can turn my opponent’s elf into a pile of ashes.

Searing Spear: The best burn spell we have in Standard. Why wouldn’t we play a full set?

Mountain: Hands down the most powerful card in our decks. It allows us to cast things like Hellrider and burn spells. It’s so good that I play 21 of them. Nothing beats Mountain. Except for maybe another Mountain.

Hellion Crucible: This card is responsible for winning topdeck wars. This is your late game
mana sink when you don’t have a Stonewright. When facing a Control player, you have an uncounterable creature at your disposal. Hellion Crucible, simply put, wins games. I’d play more than 1 in the main if I could, but I desire consistency overall and I can’t afford the T2 color screw that can happen sometimes.

Sideboard:

Hound of Griselbrand: Against slower decks, this dog is a massive bomb. For one, he’s very hard to get rid of. Dies to Pillar you say? Well, most people don’t expect the Hound and instead use their Pillars on other threats such as Ash Zealot and Pyreheart Wolf. The Hound laughs in the face of Supreme Verdict and just comes back stronger. And don’t even get me started on how great he is when paired with Stonewright. Oh the humanity! The Hound is my extra fuel for the Fire to make it into the late game. If I could fit 4 in the board I would, but for now 2 will do just fine.

Hellion Crucible: I need more mana
sources to justify bringing in the Hounds/Bonfires and the Crucible just adds to my late game backup plan.

Mizzium Mortars: This is your answer to other aggro decks such as G/x Aggro, Mono Red Sligh, Dos Rakis, Naya Aggro, and anything else you may encounter. The fact that it deals 4 damage is important when you’re facing Smiters and the Overload ability can be just devastating for your opponent. Four of this card is a must.

Zealous Conscripts: The answer to dealing the last few point of damage against Reanimator once they get going. It’s also useful in the G/x match-up. Steal a Sublime Archangel or Wolfir Silverheart? Don’t mind if I do!

Frostburn Weird: This guy is your man when you’re up against those pesky hyper aggro decks. He blocks for days and when you swing in for the kill, it’s like he’s already paired with a Stonewright!

Bonfire of the Damned: This could easily be Flames of the
Firebrand, but I have a soft spot for this card. There have been many games I’ve won that I shouldn’t have simply due the explosiveness and unpredictability of this card. At times, I’ll hardcast for 3 and it’ll do the same thing Flames of the Firebrand would’ve done (if not better, when there are 4 or more Lingering Souls tokens on the field), and then there is the devastating Miracle option. During those games with gridlocked and complicated board states, a Miracle’d Bonfire can just turn things right around for you.

Section 2: The Top Cards I’m Not Playing:

Thundermaw Hellkite: This guy is the King of Red cards. So why am I not playing with him? He’s a big strong beater, yes, but he just doesn’t synergize well with the team of Red critters I’ve assembled. He’s more of a loner that can close out games, and while amazing, my postboard beater of choice will be the Hound of Griselbrand simply because he can come down a turn earlier.


Brimstone Volley:
5 damage for 3 mana is actually pretty good. The instant speed is also highly relevant – sometimes you have to kill that Silverheart target or Sublime Archangel on the spot. This is also the only burn spell that can kill an opposing Thundermaw Hellkite. So why don’t I play it? It’s conditional. I don’t want a conditional card. If I did, I’d play Vexing Devil too. I want a card that will always do what I want it to do when I draw it. I don’t want a bad Searing Spear when I can’t trigger Morbid. Granted, if I had a sac outlet like in Dos Rakis, I can see myself playing 2-3 copies. There are also times where I’m tempted to make an ill-timed attack just to trigger a Morbid activation. That’s just too risky for me.

Archwing Dragon: I’m just not a fan of this card. I don’t like that it doesn’t create board presence. I actually feel that it’s better in a deck that runs Cavern of Souls, which I don’t run here. True, it can be argued that it’s good against
certain Bant decks (and I can agree with that) but in my deck, it just underperforms.

Volcanic Strength: I don’t like this card for a couple of reasons. One, if your guy gets killed, then you just got 2-for-1’d. Two, it’s very easy to kill a guy enchanted with this card – Mizzium Mortars, Ultimate Price, Brimstone Volley, Dreadbore, etc. Besides, I feel very strong in the mirror match (or against any deck with Mountains in it) to begin with, and even better post board. Simply put, this card is not needed in my deck.

Flames of the Firebrand: If I didn’t already play Bonfire of the Damned I’d play at least 3 copies in my deck. It’s either one or the other when comparing these two cards and I’m going with the Bonfire (for personal taste).

Rakdos Shred-Freak: In a deck that plays Lightning Mauler, the Freak just isn’t needed. Besides, I do feel that the Mauler is a little bit more versatile than Mr. Razor Claws here.

[b:
621lqqsm]Reckless Waif:
A little too situational for my tastes. This is a card that is brought in against only a handful of decks and is only good when in your opening seven cards. Not to mention, you may end up flipping her back unintentionally. Not really my style.

Grafdigger’s Cage/Tormod’s Crypt: Both of these don’t provide any source of damage to my opponent. I want to do damage. That is how I win.

Vexing Devil: Bad card is bad. Bottom line: he never does what I want him to do. That, and only mouthbreathers play Vexing Devil. It’s a trap! Don’t fall into it.

Section 3 : The Evolution of Khaos Red

I’ve always been a big fan of going with what you know best. So when it came time to make a deck for the new Standard season, I knew my choice would be in Red. At some point, I literally went over to the Dark Side and played with Dos Rakis for States and for about a month afterwards. Eventually, I hit some
roadblocks, most notably some insane fluctuations of mana screw and mana flood. I played the worst FNM of my Red Mage career in which I lost every single game due some highly improbable draws in back-to-back-to-back games. I made next to no mistakes when deciding what hands to keep and what cards to play out, but it would seem that fate had decreed I play Dos Rakis no more. In fact I became so discouraged I dropped from the FNM in the 5th and final round, shelved my deck, and started drinking.

Then I had my epiphany. I had put so much pride and effort into building Dos Rakis and trying to prove to everyone how awesome and ahead of the curve it was that with each time it lost, I took it personal. Even when some of those losses were due to variance. In the end, it’s my happiness that matters. I decided that if I was ever going to have some piss poor losses in a game of Magic, I would go down losing with something I truly felt comfortable with and had fun playing no matter what. So I went back to Mono Red.
n
I wanted to play all the cards I’d bought and wasn’t using. I wanted to use all my Thundermaws and Bonfires. I was going to try this new Pyreheart Wolf card. And dammit, I was going to foil this whole deck out! I wanted something sleek and aggressive for the first game, but then I wanted something that would just control the hell out of an opposing Aggro deck like G/W and go over the top with an unstoppable monster. So that’s what I did. I made the fastest deck I could and then started the transformational sideboarding.

It was a success. And granted the deck is not quite the same as when it was built back at the end of November, but it has evolved into what it is now. Most of its evolution I owe to some of the people here. Some of it I just owe to myself saying “Screw what everybody else is doing. This is what I want.” Overall, it’s been a blast to play and watch it grow.

Eventually some of the changes I made were like wearing a badge of honor. When zemanjaski started testing Hound of Griselbrand,
I was intrigued. As one that is always preaching about Red’s consistency and tight curve, I loved the results Z was getting with the Hound. I quickly became enamored with the thought of my curve topping at 4 and yet still had a monster capable of going over the top. I took Thundermaw out and started rocking the Hound, much to the chagrin of my opponents. And I proudly tell people, I don’t need no stinkin’ Thundermaw in my deck to win.

As always, this deck is a work in progress. And while there is still room for improvement, I know I can’t do it without some of the feedback and support I get from my fellow Red Mages. Your thoughts and criticisms are always welcome and appreciated.

Section 4: How to Play This Deck

So now that you know the cards in the deck, how does it play? Well it’s quite simple. You want to swiftly bring your opponents life total to zero with a critical mass of cost efficient and aggressive creatures. The three main components of the deck are
Stonewright, Pyreheart Wolf, and Hellrider. These three creatures compliment the remaining creatures and turn the deck into an evasive, damage-dealing machine. The burn is used to clear a path for your creatures or to provide reach when closing the gap in the opponent’s life total.

This deck preys upon other decks that use ambitious mana bases and other creatures to make mana. When a deck stumbles, Mono Red will be there to take them down.

This deck wants to be the Beatdown deck. It is aggressive and all-in. There is no plan B for Game 1.

Going into Game 2 is a different story.

Depending on your position in Game 2 or 3 (on the play or on the draw), you may have to play the role of the Control Player. The sideboard change lets you do this by transforming into a midrange deck that will go over the top with Hound of Griselbrand or a sneaky theft from the Conscripts

If you are to remain the Beatdown player for Game 2 or 3, then you simply toolbox for an edge. For example, against Junk
Reanimator, you still want to be the Beatdown deck so it’s all a matter of siding in the Bonfires and Conscripts and removing some lower impact spells.

The strength of this deck, I’ve noticed, is in its blinding fast speed and its ability to sideboard properly against certain decks.

Section 5: Sideboarding

When I think back to the past seasons I’ve played in, I find it amazing that I ever won a game past Game 1. I literally knew next to nothing about sideboarding! At least, that’s how I feel now. I must say, I’ve learned a lot in the past few months about sideboarding, so when I look back it’s easy to see where I went wrong.

With that said, I think two posts I made a month back makes a pretty good introductory point about sideboarding.
Sideboarding properly is a highly underrated skill. I feel like I'm just now beginning to grasp the bigger picture.

At first, when we sideboard, we just find things to side in that improve our game against
certain match-ups. For example, back in the day when Mono Red had to face Kor Firewalker, we Red players sided in Unstable Footing so it wasn't an auto-loss for us.

Later, we learn to "tool box." Sometimes we have certain SB slots to improve our games and sometimes we have slots to just completely hose other decks. A good example of this is siding in several Pithing Needles against Super Friends (the earliest Planeswalker Control deck) or just siding in Kor Firewalker against Mono Red (if you were playing White Weenie). This is what the majority of people do when they sideboard. Their SB is just a big toolbox of answers for everything.

The next step is transforming. I've seen combo decks take out its key pieces and sideboard in 15 little creatures and become an Aggro deck. Doing something like this can really "next-level" your opponent. When they go to their toolbox to side in combo-hate they end up getting blown out by creatures, since they took out
all of their creature removal. In our meta, it's hard to "next-level" someone when transforming in Red, but it can happen.

Sometimes you might struggle trying to build a solid 60. I struggle with my 15. And even then, I wrack my brain constantly trying to get things right, and even second guessing myself. When you sideboard correctly, it makes games so much easier. When you're wrong, not so much. But you learn. And then you get better. :)

Edit:

Sideboarding gets even crazier when you get into Game 3. Questions to ask are:

Are you on the draw or on the play?

Do you need to be the aggressor or the defender?

Is your opponent going to "next level" you by transforming?

Will your opponent possibly go back to their Game 1 plan?

Will you try to "next level" you opponent?


Sometimes it can be a total mindfuck trying to answer these questions on the fly
or in a tight match. Eventually though, it will get easier.
In regards to testing, sometimes I'll just focus on my Game 2 and 3 games by playing as if I'm already sideboarded. If I'm already confident in my Game 1 Aggro Sligh deck, for example, I'll play game after game in my midrange version so I have a better feel for it. When you transform, you're playing a completely different deck. It helps to get used to playing that deck too, along with your main one.
Sideboarding isn’t always a simple process. Each deck you face will dictate what you’ll have to change in order to gain an advantage in the match.

However, it’s always a good idea to have a starting point when thinking about the possible decks you’ll face. What I’ll do next is list my plan of action against some of the decks I’ve encountered so far.

Section 6: Match-ups

VS Hyper Aggro:

You definitely want to all-out transform
here. The key is to survive your opponent’s initial wave with removal and blocking until he/she is exhausted. Then open the floodgates and mop up with a finisher.

Out: -4 Stromkirk Noble, -4 Rakdos Cackler, -4 Gore-House Chainwalker, -3 Lightning Mauler

In: The whole freakin’ sideboard.

VS Control Strategies (Bant Control/Esper/RWU)

The key is to not overextend. Lean heavily on Chainwalker, since he can plow directly into an Auger, and on Stonewright. Sandbag you creatures and don’t be afraid to bait them with an extra one to incite a board wipe if it means reestablishing a more menacing presence afterwards.

Out: -4 Pillar of Flame, -4 Rakdos Cackler

In: +2 Zealous Conscripts, +2 Hound of Griselbrand, +2 Frostburn Weird, +2 Hellion Crucible

Note: If the player is on the Lingering Souls plan, then don’t be afraid to sub in Bonfires instead of the Frostburn Weird. In some cases, swap your Spears out for the Bonfires.

VS Midrange Strategies (Naya/Jund/
Junk)


Midrange can be very difficult to face since their threats are usually pound for pound larger and better than our creatures. Fortunately, our main strategy is to still go around these threats with the Wolf and Company. The key is to find the right balance of removal and threats postboard.

Against decks like Naya and Junk, I propose going for the full transformation plan since Mortars and Bonfires are very effective against this style of deck because of the abundance of large creatures.

Against Jund, however, I prefer to stay on the aggressive side. Mortars are still valuable since they can kill the nefarious Olivia Voldaren.

Out: -4 Rakdos Cackler, -4 Pillar of Flame, -1 Stromkirk Noble, -1 Gore-House Chainwalker

In: +2 Hound of Griselbrand, +2 Zealous Conscripts, +2 Hellion Crucible, +4 Mizzium Mortars

VS Junk Reanimator

This is probably Mono Red’s most difficult matchup. And why wouldn’t it be? Junk Reanimator has access to life gain and
giant critters. On one hand, they can play aggressively and on the other, like a Combo deck.

I’ve had results adhering strictly to the Aggro plan as well as resorting to the midrange transformation. One thing is important: use the Zealous Conscripts. Originally my deck just ran 4 Hound of Griselbrands, but sometimes I’d get locked out by the Angel of Serenity when my opponent was at less than 10 life. Swinging with that stolen Angel can mean the difference between winning and losing.

Pillars are actually pretty good in this match-up because you can burn away a mana dork and set them back a turn. I like having 1-2 Bonfire in the deck for added security – it’s my “Hail Mary” play that may just steal me the win.

Out: -4 Rakdos Cackler, -4 Stromkirk Noble

In: +2 Zealous Conscripts, +2 Hound of Griselbrand, +2 Hellion Crucible, +2 Bonfire of the Damned

Section 7: Conclusion

I don’t claim to be a master of Red. Nor do I claim to have all the answers to the format. I
even don’t claim to have the best deck.

I’m simply trying to do the best job I can with what I’ve got, as well as trying to have as much fun as I possibly can.

Again, all of my board notes and match-ups (other than the rogue decks I’ve face, which I’ve omitted) are from personal experience in my local meta. These decks and choices do not reflect any playing or testing done on MTGO.

Any thoughts, opinions, and advice on the deck are most welcome. In the meantime, keep turning critters sideways and light your opponent's up! :flame:
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Postby Pyreheart Bezerra » Thu Mar 28, 2013 8:14 pm

This has to be one of my favorite reads. Especially the sideboarding part. Everytime I do so, I feel I become a better Red player. Thanks, a bunch. I don't think I saw any gatecrash cards in there, any thoughts or changes made to the deck not listed yet?
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Postby Khaospawn » Thu Mar 28, 2013 9:52 pm

Actually, I opted not to add any GTC cards. I tried Reckoner but I really need all four Wolves in there.
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Postby Pyreheart Bezerra » Thu Mar 28, 2013 11:15 pm

Oh, i see So your plan is to swing around opposing reckoners? Very nice. Has the deck been performing as well as it was Pre-GC?
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Postby Khaospawn » Fri Mar 29, 2013 1:18 am

Better actually, since GTC brought about a certain amnesia amongst most of the players. People forgot good cards like Crucible and Pyreheart and have to be reminded about them. Pillar of Flame is practically nonexistent so my undying guys have more value. Lastly, people have actually dismissed mono Red as a viable deck at the moment so they actually get sideswiped by the Stonewright/Wolf/Hound interactions.
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Postby Pyreheart Bezerra » Fri Mar 29, 2013 8:06 am

Sounds awesome. I get what you mean, I currently run 3 Hounds of Griselbrand MB in my R/g build. And almost everytime I cast him the other player picks it up to read it. He gets pillared maybe one every other round it seems.
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Postby Khaospawn » Fri Mar 29, 2013 1:22 pm

When he sticks he's an absolute house.
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Postby Calamity » Mon Apr 15, 2013 2:00 am

I'm going to take this deck minus bonfires with flames of the firebrand in their place to FNM now...too much midrange and control for all in mono red to work.

Travis woo turbo fog is sorta a thing in my meta so I've considered skullcrack but i don't think it's worth it since it doesn't help your board position at all and is pretty much only usable in that matchup anyway.
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Postby Kazekirimaru » Tue Apr 16, 2013 7:21 pm

So, does Zealous Conscripts always beat out the Hellkite for the SB slots? Would it be acceptable to replace the former with the latter in not-so-creature-heavy metas?
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Postby Bhikku » Tue Apr 16, 2013 8:01 pm

that sideboarding part was a must read, great write up
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Postby Khaospawn » Tue Apr 16, 2013 8:38 pm

So, does Zealous Conscripts always beat out the Hellkite for the SB slots? Would it be acceptable to replace the former with the latter in not-so-creature-heavy metas?
For right now, I would play the Conscripts over the 'Maw for a couple of reasons -

(1) It's "our" answer to the "their" 'Maw. We can't deal with big fliers like that unless we're maybe playing Brimstone Volley and making an unfavorable attack to attempt to 'morbid' trigger the Volley to kill the 'Maw. It's usually better to just steal the damn thing and swing with it to put us ahead in the race.

(2) The deck wins by maximizing its damage output. What hits harder? A 5/5 in the air or a 3/3 with[/i:
1m4q0evo] a 5/5 in the air? Since we're playing Pyreheart Wolf, the Conscripts actually synergize pretty well considering we're taking a potential blocker and swinging with it.

(3) The few games I've lost to Junk Rites ended with them at about 6-8 life and I had little to no board presence. When trying to calculate my outs, I was always wishing I had access to a Conscripts to steal the Angel of Serenity and crack back for lethal. Now I never leave home without it.

that sideboarding part was a must read, great write up


Thanks man. I haven't been playing much in the last month so I'm afraid I may be a little behind on the meta changes, but I enjoy the deck immensely. And it still performs really well. The only thing that crosses my mind from time to time is whether or not I want to switch out Wolves for Reckoners.
If my meta shifts to where I see nothing but fields of Naya Blitz then I would definitely put the Reckoners in. As it stands, I'm completely comfortable with the maindeck and I seem to have a little wiggle room with the board.

I'm glad this has helped. :)
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Postby MattC » Wed Apr 17, 2013 7:55 pm

Khaos, what does your current list look like? I'm prepping a similar deck for WMCQ/PTQs this weekend.

What about Boros Reckoner? I've come to the conclusion that it's significantly worse than Pyreheart Wolf in this style of red deck. I could be wrong though.


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Postby zemanjaski » Thu Apr 18, 2013 12:03 am

^ Reckoner is worse vs a midrange / reanimator / control...so unless the field is very heavy aggro, I agree.
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Postby Jack » Thu Apr 18, 2013 12:40 am

Khaos, what does your current list look like? I'm prepping a similar deck for WMCQ/PTQs this weekend.

What about Boros Reckoner? I've come to the conclusion that it's significantly worse than Pyreheart Wolf in this style of red deck. I could be wrong though.


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I don't play MTGO, but I play Reckoners in my KDW variant over Chainwalkers and I haven't lost in over 2 months. Then again, my meta is pretty much just aggro, control, and control-ish brews.
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Postby zemanjaski » Thu Apr 18, 2013 1:00 am

With all those 3 drops, don't you get an uncomfortable number of clunky draws?
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Postby Khaospawn » Thu Apr 18, 2013 12:26 pm

Matt- the current list is in the article (Frostburn Weirds and all)

As for Reckoner, I tried a 3/3 split with them and the Wolves, but I found the abundance of 3 drops kind of clunky (like Z said). With that said, if you see a lot of Blitz decks, then use Reckoner. I prefer Wolves since my goal is to annihilate the Control /Midrange /Reanimator strategies game 1 and Pyreheart is added resiliency. Granted, this leaves me a little slower in the aggro mirror, but hey, that's what my sideboard is for. If I get blown put to Blitz game 1 then games 2 and 3 I just play Control and can usually win.
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Postby lorddax » Thu Apr 18, 2013 7:01 pm

I'm glad to see this go up here, as before I fell outta the game in week 2 GTC I was running KDW but with 3/3 recokoner and no crucibles and flames over bonfire. I stopped playing as every other deck seemed to have a sweeper but it looks like you've just continued to tune it and tune it. Speaking of, with all the sweepers running around do you have a preferred number of on board damage you stop committing at?
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Postby Khaospawn » Thu Apr 18, 2013 10:37 pm

Against decks like Esper you really can't afford to over commit. I'm happy to just sit back on a Stonewright and a Chainwalker, honestly. You need to be fast early game, but you still need to sandbag your threats to play after the boardwipe.

You know when you're doing it right when the Control player has to sigh and say, "I guess I'll cast the Verdict." That means you've played enough guys to pressure the opponent, yet he feels like he's not getting enough value out of his card. After the boardwipe, I'll drop another 2-3 guys and ride them out. With each turn after that first boardwipe that your opponent doesn't boardwipe again, you're drawing more cards and hopefully keeping a creature or two in hand awaiting the next sweeper. Once their life total is withing range, you can usually win by dropping a Hellrider, Stonewright, or a couple of Spears.

Of course, this plan usually just works against the
Esper and U/W decks. U/W/R is a little tricky sometimes because you can either use the "Anti-Esper" plan I just outlined or they'll play an annoying tempo game, which turns the gameplan into a "tactical" battle. And honestly, there really is no cookie-cutter way to beat the tempo deck. You just have to play smart and know when to play around a counterspell. Sometimes the best plan of attack is to blitz them and other times you'll win by sandbagging a few dudes and riding out to victory with a Stonewright + Noble.

However, I can't stress enough the importance of Chainwalker in these match-ups. That 3 power makes all the difference when you see a T2 Auger.
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Postby LP, of the Fires » Sun Apr 21, 2013 3:01 am

Just a footnote. While I'm currently playing junk rites, I planned on going with red cards so I bought the Rakdos Event deck as I don't own cards anymore. Regardless, I play the event deck at the LGS before tourneys for fun and smash all manners of decks with it because Pillar of flame is ridiculously underrated. I was very surprised at how soft lots of decks are to 3 cheap dudes backed up by playsets of spears and pillars(with brimstone volley thrown in).

Now for something tangentially related. My friend is playing 21 land gruul agro, but for all intents and purposes we'll assume it's mono red as the only green cards are boar and Ghor-Clan. We play a match with me playing Junk rites. My list plays things like smiters, borderland ranger etc.

His other friends tell him the way he should have boarded is -4 stromkirk noble, -2 Legion Loyalist, +2 Mark of mutiny, +2 skullcrack, +2 Pillar. Does that seem right? His board
also plays 4 skullcrack(which we can argue is a bad card but lets run with it for a sec). Wouldn't this be the matchup where you want ALL the sullcracks? And another quirk of the deck is while boarding out noble is obvious and correct, I think you leave in loyalist since you can remove Tusk and ignore the beast with battalion triggers.
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Postby Link » Sun Apr 21, 2013 3:10 am

I only want all the skullcracks against tubro fog if I'm playing that card at all (I do in G/r lists)

Loyalist is should def stay against rites, do you run Lingering souls? First striking boars is also tech vs things.

Threaten effects is also good vs. you. Idk about pillars. Killing mana dorks is good, but idk if good enough for 4 pillars. I personally leave in nobles just because the chance to grow them is always there on the play, and you can bloodrush them through early smiters. I'd put in all pillars on the draw if I had to have them and nobles on the play.

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Postby Jack » Mon Apr 22, 2013 10:23 pm

To anyone playing this deck: are you going to change it at all with DGM? It looks like everything in the set would be useless in this deck, so it looks like I won't even bother with buying anything. They seemed to print more than a few cards that seemed to be made specifically for shutting this deck down, but I don't know if anyone really wants to use spots in their 75 for them. I was also looking forward to getting a 2-drop to replace mauler, but no such luck. Maybe we can get Stormblood Berserker back in m14? Here's hoping.
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Postby lorddax » Tue Apr 23, 2013 4:16 pm

Only thing I could see was making some concession for Legion's Initative to remove the weakness to sweeps. But thats changing 8 lands for Duals, and adding in 2-4 cards. Which may actually mess with the decks consistency.
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Postby Pyreheart Bezerra » Tue Apr 23, 2013 8:32 pm

How about Pyrewild Shaman. Its essentialy reusable burn. Could be this deck's GCR, the bloodrush common could also be good. He's basically a conditional giant growth for one red mana.
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Postby Link » Tue Apr 23, 2013 8:35 pm

I think the Maaka would be a funny "blowout" card to have for this list. Spear my ash zealot? Actually I have a Giant Growth in red, lol.

Pyrewild Shaman's usefullness TBD. Sounds good on paper to be able to have a 2 turn clock after you've exhausted them with burn and have a hound+shaman in your hand.

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Postby lorddax » Tue Apr 23, 2013 9:52 pm

keep looking at Pyrewild but the opportunity cost is whats getting me, what are we possibly trading off to get the burn cycling? Does its VCA outweigh the VCA of other moves?
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Postby Link » Tue Apr 23, 2013 11:57 pm

What other card can you get back from the GY and re-use period in red?

I suppose you could be pumping with stonewright for more with the mana instead, so stony's probably the better card.

But if its board wiped time, you're in topdeck mode with 6 mana on the field, I think its pretty appealing.

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Postby lorddax » Wed Apr 24, 2013 4:29 pm

Pyrewild does 3 so everytime he connects he generates +1 VCA, his rush does 3 as well so if it connects he still gives +1 VCA to knock his card cost to 0. I think he might be worth testing in the GHC spot. GHC when pumped will generate +1 VCA when connecting with the downside of no blocks, Shaman has the same VCA without the unblocking down side. Factor in his recursion and he seems like a very good card against control as he has built in resistance to counters and sweepers as well as providing a pump source that can steal some games.

I think its worth testing based on his VCA value.
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Postby Khaospawn » Thu Apr 25, 2013 11:55 am

Pyrewild seems pretty good; it reminds me of Hammer of Bogardan in that it's a source of reusable damage. With that said, I don't know exactly how I feel yet about upping the count on 3-drops in this deck. He's definitely worth trying out though. I already ordered my set, although I don't know if he'll be worth playing as a 4-of in this build.
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Postby Khaospawn » Thu Apr 25, 2013 11:57 am

He may be pretty good in the SB against sweeper decks though.

Although I do know for a fact he'll be a strong card in any deck packing Rancor.
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Postby lorddax » Sat Apr 27, 2013 4:39 pm

2-0-1 for 3rd place and $10 store credit. Flames over bonfire ATM, upgrading with cred as I can. Detailed notes later but god damn esper! Turn 2 BlOb will really piss you off with triggers.

Sidenote: that was my draw match where the phrase "Yeah, I didn't have enough time to win!" Was coined to much laughter.
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Postby Midnight_v » Sat Apr 27, 2013 6:45 pm

I only want all the skullcracks against tubro fog if I'm playing that card at all (I do in G/r lists)

Loyalist is should def stay against rites, do you run Lingering souls? First striking boars is also tech vs things.

Threaten effects is also good vs. you. Idk about pillars. Killing mana dorks is good, but idk if good enough for 4 pillars. I personally leave in nobles just because the chance to grow them is always there on the play, and you can bloodrush them through early smiters. I'd put in all pillars on the draw if I had to have them and nobles on the play.
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Postby Link » Sat Apr 27, 2013 9:15 pm

It is satisfying isn't it?


The guy I played it against was like "ok I take 3"

And I was like (I had a domri emblem and a shit ton of creatures on board at the time, he had THAT many fog effects), "no, you take all this too."

He picked up the card again and read it, his expression was priceless.


Game 3 I topdecked an extra skull crack, swung in and double cracked him for lethal.

When its great, its freaking great, and its still not that bad against thragtusk lifegain either. My next achievement is skullcracking a cheese faithmender into Thrag combo

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Postby Khaospawn » Sun Apr 28, 2013 1:45 pm

2-0-1 for 3rd place and $10 store credit. Flames over bonfire ATM, upgrading with cred as I can. Detailed notes later but god damn esper! Turn 2 BlOb will really piss you off with triggers.

Sidenote: that was my draw match where the phrase "Yeah, I didn't have enough time to win!" Was coined to much laughter.
Good job, bro.

I actually find Esper an easier match-up than most people, since my meta was infested with it for a time. I've had plenty of experience playing against it and beating it, but it's still one of the grindiest match-ups you'll ever play.

Basically you can't over commit to the board - rely on 1-2 creatures to attack while sandbagging other threats. Stonewright is probably your best friend in that match-
up. Knowing when to draw out the boardwipe is crucial too because sometimes they'll think they have you on the ropes after wiping. That's when you puke 2-3 more guys out and commence the beatdown again. Also, I almost always pack in Zealous Conscripts (and Hound, obviously) just because some versions of Esper play Consuming Aberration as a wincon. Simply stealing it and attack is pretty much GG.
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Postby lorddax » Mon May 20, 2013 6:23 pm

3-0 place for second, 1st place went 2-0 all games compared to my tension filled mirror 3 game flame battle of fun.

R1 vs Junk Rites: 2-0
Aggro curve out for very quick game.
Haven't played in 2 weeks so not up on metagame, so wasn't really sure what to do for SB. I did see Fiend Hunters so treated it like Augurs and pulled all my dudes who couldn't punch through. Full swap.
Around turn 7 I realized I probably should have kept my fast dudes as I suddenly found out what a beast rites + resto + slime is, slowly ticking away at my 4 lands. Luckily I've been poking away with a lone Pyreheart to keep ticking down the life. I run out of mortars and land so Im starting to get hit with angel. Down to a lone mountain and 8 life on my end and wolf has valiantly poked opp down to 3 before finally dying to touch. I have one card in had, a spear. I have never been so happy to see a land in my life. I play the land holding spear
and then finally cast when opp taps out to play AoS. Realized after game that didn't need to hold as lands can't be blow up before adding the mana to pool, at least I think so.

R2 vs 100 Singelton Dimir: 2-0
Aggrod out both games in short order. Was playing against a kid who just started playing during the DGM prerelease. I almost felt bad that I was gonna stomp him, but then the best way to learn is to find out what doesn't work. I corrected some play mistakes along the way ie don't bounce the Ash Zealot but bounce the +4 Noble instead. Kid was surprised and happy to find out that cancel works on all cards after the match was over. I was going to offer to help him with his deck but he bounded away to watch the singelton game between his friend and little brother.

R3 vs Mono Red: 2-1
G1 race to 20, trading a burn spell or two here and there. I get there and we go onto game 2.
G2 I move into playing more control and bring in the board. Burn his dudes when possible and try to get in with mine,
who also keep getting burned. I've let a cackler survive for far too long and have taken 6-8 from it. Eventually I fall from 10 to 5 after getting smashed with a kite from the board. He's on 4 life and I have 7 lands and spear+mortars in hand with a zealot to keep his GHC at bay. I take the only line I can see and mortar spear his Maw as I'm 1 land short of the full clear. He pulls zealot of the top and alpha's showing the spear. I extend and go to g3.
G3 Same plan, outlast but wary of kite. I have to mull down to 5 but keep land SW Zealot Zealot Mortar. I thankfully see a mountain turn 2 and can start to play defense with my zealots. Having seen VS last game, I let the noble get in for 3 before mortaring it next turn. We spend a lot of tense turns attempting to attack. As the game nears its end I'm on 8 life which leaves me dead to kite + spear and he has a GHC with two cards in hand. He's at 10 and my board state is SW, Zealot, Zealot, and a fresh cracked Hellion. I swing with Zealot, Zealot,
Hellion. No blocks. Try to pump hellion, find out I never paired it with SW. Baited breath as he falls to 2 life and I have no cards in hand. With no action, I can still win. Slowly reaches for top card of deck, looks and flips Wolf. Extends showing 2 lands in hand. Was a great match and almost lost to my own play mistake.

I finish with a record of 3-0 and Game record of 6-1; taking second of 18players in standard and $20 in credit using $9 to buy 3 Hammer of BoGoblins. Not bad for free entry thanks to the membership program!

Deck has gone to 2 FNMs and has prized twice. I do love me some consistency!
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Postby Khaospawn » Mon May 20, 2013 7:21 pm

Awesome job, lorddax. I went 4-1 on Friday with the deck, only losing to my brother's Prime Speaker Bant deck (gaining 16 life off a single Thrag thanks to Tostani + Faithmender is just bad new bears).

At times this deck can be very thought intensive, and in a mirror match, mistakes can add up quickly. Fortunately, most people still ask me what Stonewright, Wolf, and Crucible still do, so more often the not, it's my opponents that are making the bigger mistakes.
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Postby LP, of the Fires » Mon May 20, 2013 8:15 pm

I've definitely had:

People fight pyreheart wolf with Garruk not knowing it had undying.

Mistake Hound of griselbrand for hellrider and get blown the fuck out.

Block something not named stonewright when stoney was the man causing all the mayhem.
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Postby Valdarith » Mon May 20, 2013 8:34 pm

People that have played me often now know that good 'ol Stonewright should always be the first to die. They also know to leave back a dude in case I've been sandbagging to play Stonewright next turn and swing for the win.
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Postby rcwraspy » Mon May 20, 2013 9:36 pm

People that have played me often now know that good 'ol Stonewright should always be the first to die. They also know to leave back a dude in case I've been sandbagging to play Stonewright next turn and swing for the win.
Other than just smashing face, sandbagging a Stonewright for the win really is one of my favorite things to do in M:tG.

Grats on all the great red results lately, guys!
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Postby Khaospawn » Mon May 20, 2013 10:06 pm

The best win I ever had was when a dude mini Fact or Fictioned with Jace before playing Verdict, which killed all my guys except for the Hound. He was pretty surprised about the undying (he must've misread the card) but passed the turn with about 6 or 7 mana up. I topdecked a Stonewright and cast it. In response he played Think Twice, huffed, flashed it back, sighed, and said that it resolves. Stoney resolves, I pair, and then move into attack step. He had two mana up and I was so sure my guy was gonna get charmed, but instead he just asks me how much was he taking. I turn the Hound sideways, and start counting my untapped Mountains.

"Let's see - 1,2,3,4,5,6,7,8. I'll give +8 to the Hound for 22 damage. I guess you're dead, right?"

My only regret was that I didn't shout "Hadouken!"
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I rarely skip a Khaospawn wall of text because I know there is always piss at the end of the rainbow.

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lorddax
Tire Aficionado
Posts: 669
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Joined: Sat Mar 30, 2013 1:16 am
Location: East Coast, US

Postby lorddax » Mon May 20, 2013 10:26 pm

This deck still punishes every deck that likes to hurdle durdle t1-3. I'm hoping that we get plenty of good replacements for the deck in Theros when only cackler, zealot and walker remain. I've been trying to pick up Stomping Grounds for possibly rebuilding deck as Rg with Chant.

But still plenty of face stomping time till then!
Some men just want to watch the planes burn. . .and most of them are here.
FoS resident designer/codemonkey
MTGO:lorddax Cockatrice:lorddax


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