Dies to Removal

https://www.washingtonpost.com/world/no ... story.html

So, to anyone who doesn't want to click the link: This kid, 21 year old Otto Warmbier, was in North Korea with a college group and was convicted of stealing a propaganda banner from his Pyongyang hotel. He was sentenced to 15 year hard labor in prison for it. US State Dept is working with Swedish diplomats and North Korean officials to try to negotiate his release.

There are some friends of mine that are abhorred by the harsh sentence and urging people to DEMAND Mr. Warmbier be released. I've been made to feel heartless for stating the obvious: if you break a law in North Korea, expect some HARSH punishment. I mean, for God's sake, they're starving their own people because they refuse to ask for help! (Don't get started on this. I know there's more to it.)

My argument against DEMANDING they release him is simply this: what, exactly, do we have that the North Korean government wants enough to give us leverage in a bartering situation for this guy's freedom? DEMANDING they release him, in my opinion, will only lead to them absolutely NEVER doing so because...why the fuck should they?

AND DISCUSS.

I agree.

Shouldn't have stolen that poster bro.

But honestly, this is just North Korean kidnapping some US citizen because reasons for later using him as a bargaining chip.

Which begs the question: why are people so stupid that they risk going to countries like this one in a time of diplomatic and military escalation, its obvious he was gon' get lynched. Next time plan your holidays in Syria

Wanted the cool story. That's why he stole the poster.

Basically the Dept. of state should point out that it is not a so good idea to travel to places like this and that you are on your own should you get in trouble despite previous warnings.

But honestly, this is just North Korean kidnapping some US citizen because reasons for later using him as a bargaining chip.

Which begs the question: why are people so stupid that they risk going to countries like this one in a time of diplomatic and military escalation, its obvious he was gon' get lynched. Next time plan your holidays in Syria

Seriously. There's no amount of money that would EVER get me to agree to go to North Korea. South Korea, yeah, I'm good, as long as I can stay faaaaaaaar away from the DZ. But there's no fucking way in hell I'm EVER going to North Korea. Not unless their entire government structure were to change, nope. FUCK that.

Basically the Dept. of state should point out that it is not a so good idea to travel to places like this and that you are on your own should you get in trouble despite previous warnings.

I'm going to have to agree with this 100%. I actually think it's ridiculous that they're trying to get him back. Based on our own government's reaction, I'm now positive NK did exactly what Scumbag said (lynching the American because reasons) simply so they could "negotiate" or, in other words, get whatever the hell they want, for the most part. Even if it's just that they want to be seen as "reasonable" or "kind-hearted" as opposed to the bat shit insane mother fuckers they truly are, they're getting what they want by us coming to them searching for a compromise for our stupid fucking cunt of a citizen who can't behave himself while in another country.

Damn, I'm getting more and more heartless the more I talk about this.

If i learned anything from travelling a bit around the world it's: don't do stupid shit in weird countries.

If i learned anything from travelling a bit around the world it's: don't do stupid shit in weird countries.

Absolutely agree. For example, everytime I travel to Russia I keep a very very low profile until I am back on the return plane.

yeah any countries that have had histories of secret police/gulags/work camps, it's generally a good idea not to make waves.

I saw this news this morning. I was wondering what the hell were they doing in North Korea. Do you have more info about that ?

Edit : Ok it was organized by a tour operator and it was part of his studies.

I still don't understand why you should visit North Korea for study reasons but they're more people to blame about this case (parents, teachers, tour organizers etc.) How reckless have they been to let him/them go there.

It's probably the worst country to visit currently.
For work reason I was supposed to go to Iran or Russia recently, I won't move a little finger in a country like that (even if I totally disagree with them).

well to be fair he's 21, so he is totally responsible to make his own travel decisions. i think the only reckless person is himself, assuming that he was actually stealing something and this isn't some conspiracy plot for more propaganda.

i don't think i'd ever go back to the middle east ever again. maybe dubai again, but i think they've cracked down and are more strict since i last went.

The worse part is that there is a lot of papertrail of very similar situations of US tourists getting arrested on bogus charges because at the time the NK regime needed bargaining chips on the negotiation table so I mean...

It's absolutely possible that he was framed, though his own statements seem to lean towards he did do it, possibly as a prank, and the NK government didn't think it was funny.

I'm not sure what they want bargaining chips for, though. Like, a co-worker said they want WalMart. Well, maybe the NK people want WalMart, but I highly doubt the NK government wants anything to do with the chain. Therefore...there won't be a WalMart.

I'm just having a hard time thinking of anything we have that they want. They being the NK government.

Well their leader certainly likes western good, he has a lot of liquor and other shit imported quite often. he digs Hennessy IIRC

Well their leader certainly likes western good, he has a lot of liquor and other shit imported quite often. he digs Hennessy IIRC

I get that, but he doesn't need us to get the western goods he wants, does he? I mean, for instance, Hennessy's not made in America, right?

Well their leader certainly likes western good, he has a lot of liquor and other shit imported quite often. he digs Hennessy IIRC

I get that, but he doesn't need us to get the western goods he wants, does he? I mean, for instance, Hennessy's not made in America, right?

yeah bad example, but i guess he also likes johnny walker, and dennis rodman. both of which are american exports.

That's true.

He can have Rodman, though. Not sure any of us want him anymore.

yeah i think america was done with him after the buls

There's something morally corrupt NK officials love above everything else. Good old Dollars. It turns out 'Murica has plenty of them and NK doesn't have enough. Hence, they have to ask for ransoms when people are dumb enough to wander into their realm.

maybe he stole the poster, maybe he didn't. It's irrelevant. He might as well have been arrested for stealing the soap bar from his hotel room, the endgame is forced labour untill Murica pays for the ransom.

It will happen eventually, but I sure hope that some US official will pimp slap the guy once he is in a plane back to his homeland. Might get some sense back in him.

Yeah there is another white dude in NK prison right now for doing some other stupid shit. they made him read the usual 'confession' about how he was trying to ruin the glorious leaders country or whatever. it's kind of funny they expect people to believe that these people wrote it themselves, when it sounds like it came right out of a CCCP propaganda machine.

Yeah there is another white dude in NK prison right now for doing some other stupid shit. they made him read the usual 'confession' about how he was trying to ruin the glorious leaders country or whatever. it's kind of funny they expect people to believe that these people wrote it themselves, when it sounds like it came right out of a CCCP propaganda machine.

Non-American White? Is anyone trying to get him out?

I'm sure this dumbass will be released sooner rather than later. I still proclaim the best way to deal with this is...to stay the FUCK out of North Korea. We have no business being there. None of us. They don't want us there, and we don't need to be educated by ANYTHING that goes on there.

We (Americans) do NOT have to save everyone, dammit.

i'm a solid 70% sure he's american, the video of his confession was a pain inducing cringe fest, i'll see if i can track it down

oh wait my bad it's the same dude