Dies to Removal

Posted: **Sun Sep 15, 2013 10:22 pm**

I got about 400 white UltraPro sleeves back in January for $2 per 50 pack. I picked white because pretty much nobody else uses white, and they do look pretty boss. However, it turns out that these white sleeves were a lot harder (less supple in both directions; more plastic where the two sheets that make up the sleeve meet) than my red or black UltraPros. They are much worse for shuffling, and a successful riffle&bridge is almost impossible. When you do try to riffle shuffle, it takes some bending to get the cards straight again. With states coming up soon, I felt that it was time to get some new sleeves. I like both my DragonShields and KMCs better than even the red or black UltraPros, but they're much more expensive. What do you guys use?

Posted: **Sun Sep 15, 2013 10:54 pm**

I use KMC supers or Matts most of the time. It's well worth it over Ultra pros which are poo

Posted: **Mon Sep 16, 2013 2:23 am**

I use Dragon Shields exclusively now. They're worth the extra money.

Posted: **Mon Sep 16, 2013 2:37 am**

KMC matte.

Posted: **Mon Sep 16, 2013 2:39 am**

KMC matte.

Since when does MODO use sleeves?

Posted: **Mon Sep 16, 2013 2:54 am**

occasionally i feel the desire to remind my local shops that i am still the king

Posted: **Mon Sep 16, 2013 3:13 am**

Dragon Shields or bust.

Although, TBH, if I were a heavy tournament grinder, KMC Mattes would be my sleeves of choice.

Posted: **Mon Sep 16, 2013 3:25 am**

Dragon Shields or bust.

Although, TBH, if I were a heavy tournament grinder, KMC Mattes would be my sleeves of choice.

Why is that?
I have Dragon Shields on all of my EDH decks, because it's much harder to shuffle using anything else.
I picked up a set of KMC Mattes at a tournament once. They do shuffle nicely, but the backs got scratched up/turned whiteish really fast. Maybe that's just because they're black.

Posted: **Mon Sep 16, 2013 6:29 am**

Dragon Shields or bust.

Although, TBH, if I were a heavy tournament grinder, KMC Mattes would be my sleeves of choice.

Pretty much this.

Posted: **Mon Sep 16, 2013 1:47 pm**

Because, for the short term, KMC mattes are just perfect. But they don't hold up for casual formats and cubes like dragon shields Dom So, for heavy tournament grinders who already want to replace their sleeves often, kmc mattes are the way to gom

Posted: **Mon Sep 16, 2013 10:32 pm**

Makes sense.

Posted: **Tue Sep 17, 2013 3:36 am**

started using KMC's after I kept getting dragonshield boxes that were poorly cut.

Although unlike Dragonshields, there is a lot more variance in quality, the Matte Blue/Black are great, brown is okay and the matte red is complete horseshit, mash shuffled a deck with them 5 times and half the corners were bent.

That and I use KMC perfect fits, so there is that.

Posted: **Tue Sep 17, 2013 4:51 am**

Pearl White KMC is alright.

Posted: **Tue Sep 17, 2013 1:28 pm**

Dragon shields are awesome, but it is very well known that they suffer from uneven cutting of the sleeve height.

The problem is so serious with my ocd that I even bought a paper cutter so I could cut them back into the proper shape

Posted: **Tue Sep 17, 2013 7:00 pm**

i use the first dragon red and... that weird color, fusion maybe? ... dragon shields i bought as default drafting sleeves. i use KMC on constructed decks. i've noticed KMC sleeves generally get dirtier than dragon shields, though, while dragon shields pick up nicks and marks that are more noticeable (because the plastic is thicker i'd imagine).

both sleeves shuffle very nicely, though KMC tends to lose its slide to a much greater degree than dragon shields i've noticed (i have a set of orange KMC i've had for a while that slide less well while riffling than dragon shields i've had longer than those). i've also had more kmc sleeves split on me than dragon shields.

kmc are cheaper and marginally less durable than dragon shield, but dragon shields can be marked as a result due to table wear and tear and also have the inconsistent cutting (though you should always shuffle your sleeve before use anyway).

Posted: **Thu Sep 19, 2013 7:57 pm**

I've been thinking of trying out Dragonshield as my KMC's get scuffed up too easily for my liking, but I'm worried about Dragon Shield because I've heard they can bend/curve your cards if sleeved for too long.

Is there any truth to this?

Posted: **Thu Sep 19, 2013 9:31 pm**

I've never noticed at all

Posted: **Thu Sep 19, 2013 9:32 pm**

I've never had a problem with Dragonshields bending my cards.

Posted: **Thu Sep 19, 2013 10:13 pm**

They did a top/bottom curve on my Twin deck before I switched to KMC

Posted: **Thu Sep 19, 2013 10:17 pm**

Nah. I actually switched to Dragonshields to remedy the bending problem.

Posted: **Thu Sep 19, 2013 10:38 pm**

the mystery thickens

Posted: **Thu Sep 19, 2013 11:02 pm**

I honesty think the quality of DragonShields may vary from pack to pack. I've had some cut perfect, some askew; some barely bent, some bent worse than UltraPro. It's like a lottery.

Posted: **Thu Sep 19, 2013 11:03 pm**

All in all, a bad pack of DragonShields is usually better than a good pack of anything else, so, whatever.

Posted: **Fri Sep 20, 2013 1:13 am**

Out of three packs of Dragonshields, I've never had any issues with them being cut at different lengths.
The thing about Dragonshields is that they get grimy really easily. Even when I washed my hands every time before using the new sleeves (not even playing a game, just sleeving cards and goldfishing) they started to get a bit of gunk on them after three days. The grimiest sleeves I've ever seen were a guy's two month old DragonShields.
That being said, they shuffle like a dream for a very, very long time, and the card inside them stays very clean.

Posted: **Fri Sep 20, 2013 3:38 pm**

I've seen some dragon shields do this, but it really depends on your shuffling method, I think. I've resleeved my cube in Dragonshields multiple times, I have all 11 of my EDH decks and 20 of my casual decks in Dragon Shields. I can't recommend them highly enough.

Posted: **Fri Sep 20, 2013 3:53 pm**

I think Boxer is correct. If you only rifle shuffle, then I don't think you're in for any problems with 'Shields.

Posted: **Fri Sep 20, 2013 5:13 pm**

I don't riffle shuffle... That damages cards.

Posted: **Fri Sep 20, 2013 5:36 pm**

Yeah, I didn't mean riffle shuffle. I thought it meant something completely different. Comprehension fail.

Posted: **Fri Sep 20, 2013 5:59 pm**

I pile shuffle into that...one shuffle where you fan the stack in each hand and kinda smash em together...whatever that is...

Posted: **Fri Sep 20, 2013 6:58 pm**

Half-assed riffle?

Posted: **Fri Sep 20, 2013 7:05 pm**

It's better because it doesn't bend the cards. Mhmm.

Posted: **Fri Sep 20, 2013 9:20 pm**

I bet I can make all of you cringe.

I've been using UltraPros for like a decade. I STILL use them. Why? Because they're functional, and if they break they literally cost like nothing to replace. I will never understand nerds that need to spend like twenty bucks to sleeve a deck that can be sleeved for $4.

I have been buying the blue UltraPro sleeves for years. My cube is sleeved in them, all of my decks are sleeved in them, and I have a few sets of different colored ones for Commander decks so that they're easy to tell apart.

I've used DragonShields and Mattes in the past while playing other people's decks. Those damned things turn your cards into panzer tanks, and they just feel like cheap plastic. No thanks, I really don't need that level of protection, almost none of the cards that I will actually play in my deck are worth enough to merit that, and if they are I simply double sleeve them in Ultrapros.

Posted: **Fri Oct 04, 2013 7:33 am**

I bet I can make all of you cringe.

I've been using UltraPros for like a decade. I STILL use them. Why? Because they're functional, and if they break they literally cost like nothing to replace. I will never understand nerds that need to spend like twenty bucks to sleeve a deck that can be sleeved for $4.

I have a more cringe worthy habit. I have several decks that I play unsleeved. They are mostly stupid casual decks, but I can literally see people cringe when I bridge shuffle, like fingernails on chalkboard cringe. I remember in 9th/CoK/RaV standard I had a gwb goodstuff deck (with shocklands, painlands, jittes, and a ton of other money cards) that I played sleeveless (on purpose) at an fnm and somebody actually bought me a set of
dragonshields.

But I have been using blue ultrapros because they are so easy to replace, and just got a pack of legions to try that I am using as my limited sleeves (I had never heard of the brand and they had a Guy Fawkes mask on them so I couldn't resist). They seem pretty good so far.

Posted: **Fri Oct 04, 2013 6:24 pm**

I riffle underground seas

/drops mic

Posted: **Fri Oct 04, 2013 6:30 pm**

Still not as baller as Kpaca's "I threw DCI Swords to Plowshares in the trash. Bitch. /dropmic"

Posted: **Fri Oct 04, 2013 6:36 pm**

This is true.

Buddy of mines step dad used to talk about playing at a tournament where they have out the promo wastelands.

People proceeded to use them to record life totals

Posted: **Fri Oct 04, 2013 8:34 pm**

I riffle underground seas

/drops mic

You got me there, best i've done is badland.

Posted: **Fri Oct 04, 2013 8:46 pm**

I bet I can make all of you cringe.

I've been using UltraPros for like a decade. I STILL use them. Why? Because they're functional, and if they break they literally cost like nothing to replace. I will never understand nerds that need to spend like twenty bucks to sleeve a deck that can be sleeved for $4.

I have been buying the blue UltraPro sleeves for years. My cube is sleeved in them, all of my decks are sleeved in them, and I have a few sets of different colored ones for Commander decks so that they're easy to tell apart.

I've used DragonShields and Mattes in the past while playing other people's decks. Those damned things turn your cards into panzer tanks, and they just feel like cheap plastic. No thanks, I really don't need that level of
protection, almost none of the cards that I will actually play in my deck are worth enough to merit that, and if they are I simply double sleeve them in Ultrapros.

it's no more nerdy to use good sleeves than it is to play mtg, so nobody earns any bonus nerd points in this discussion. last year I tried going back to ultra pro because they have some great color options, and in my first tournament i knicked a Huntmaster when a sleeve split. that was the end of that experiment.

Posted: **Fri Oct 04, 2013 9:24 pm**

it's no more nerdy to use good sleeves than it is to play mtg, so nobody earns any bonus nerd points in this discussion.

You are assuming he is using the term nerd derisively, which is far from clear. It could have been roughly the same as "I will never get people who spend a lot of money on sleeves" but with nerd as a fill in for people, since, like you said, playing mtg is guaranteed nerdity.

Posted: **Fri Oct 04, 2013 9:36 pm**

I use Japanese Ultrapros. They're made differently than the american ones, and I have used the same set of 99 for 3 years, constantly, and just now retired them.

Dies to Removal

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