[Primer] Boros Burn

[NotARobot]

Purp what list are you running currently?

[Lightning_Dolt]

4 mutavaults is usually fine. I got bit by it once today (0-4 at first FNM) but I blame that on the cold streak I'm experiencing, not the deck (MDU's deck, different manabase).

[Elricity]

Depends on how much you're trying to get value out of the lands. Sure, you can do the 11 r/w dual with only 4 scry but I'd rather dump the redundant manland for 2 extra scry.

[NotARobot]

MJ apparently 4-0'd with this deck yesterday. http://www.mtggoldfish.com/deck/236307

[NotARobot]

MJ apparently 4-0'd with this deck yesterday. http://www.mtggoldfish.com/deck/236307

Should be 2 wear/tear in the sideboard as well, not showing up for some reason.

[Elricity]

Congrats on him for dodging UWx control?

[Lightning_Dolt]

Yasooka's build.

[amcfvieira]

[deck=MDU's Ideal land Base]8 Mountain
4 Sacred Foundry
4 Temple of Triumph
3 Mutavault
2 Boros Guildgate
1 Temple of Malice
1 Temple of Silence[/deck]

More scry equals more decisions which equals more chance too improve the situation.

This exactly the mana base I use since I drop Ash and play with Young Pyromancer (since Born of the Gods), and I'm pretty happy. Since Journey I consider add a Mana Confluence and another Red temple and drop the White temple and a Mountain. The reason is I want to keep 6 scry lands and don't have any chance of don't get double red when I need and didn't have because of the white temple. What do you think about that guys?

I try Flamespeaker but I didn't find a matchup that I get enough
from it. Against Esper he died so quick and against the mirror it's the same. Maybe against Monoblue or another deck with few removal flamespeaker will give us many free spell, or maybe I didn't play well with the card. Can Anyone give me some advices about the card.

[Elricity]

The benefits of mana confluence over boros guildgate right now are incredibly, incredibly small and the downside is huge.

Any heavy removal deck is going to give flamespeaker trouble with our low creature count. I really wanted to make it work but Carytid ruined the green matches where I really wanted it.

[Lightning_Dolt]

First feature match from the Canadian Magic Cup... still waiting for top 8 videos.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8hZ_-PrjLFM

[magicdownunder]

Great game (I wished the camera showed the players hands or at least have it popped up somewhere)

While it doesn't matter this game, I strongly believe its best to maximized damage against attrition decks (since they usually go for the long haul) thus I felt that missing the Muvault swing for Boros Charm G1 one was incorrect (you can always play BC later but vs black that window of worth for vault is small). The other point is try and cast spells on your Opp. turn if it can be helped since that turn when your Opp. used devour flesh to same himself, you could have used your WLH on his upkeep (if your worried he'll topdeck a flesh) or cast it in response too his Gary.

[dpaine88]

How many white cards is too many to keep in a hand with no white source?

[Nezeru]

Depends on the matchup, if you need to Chain something it's pretty bad I think.

Top 8'd a GPT even though I dropped after the 4th round of 5 in Swiss, that's my accomplishment for today. Punted a match because it was paper and I didn't wait for my Searing Blood to resolve before casting another one for lethal, and died to him killing his own Reckoner.

Round 1 2-0 Mono-R Devotion - easy peasy matchup
Round 2 2-0 Naya Monsters - also easy.
Round 3 1-2 Boros Burn - he played Tablet of the Guilds and rode it to victory g2, and I punted with communication issues g3 as I mentioned above
Round 4 2-0 Dredge, it's still a bye.

Deck: normal stuff, 1 maindeck Mortars, 2 Searing Blood, 3 Shock, 3 Chain, 4 YP, manabase 1 each of BW and BR temples, 4 RW temple, 1 Guildgate, 1 Mana Confluence, 3 Mutavault, 4 Sacred Foundry and 8 Mountain
Sideboard:
3 Toil//Trouble
3 Eidolon of the Great Revel
2 Keening Apparition
2
Mizzium Mortars
1 Chandra
1 Reprisal
1 Fated Conflagration
1 Banishing Light
1 Chained to the Rocks

Apparently I was 8th after dropping and not playing round 5, so the 9th guy got my spot in top 8.

[Rhyno]

Depends on the matchup, if you need to Chain something it's pretty bad I think.

Top 8'd a GPT even though I dropped after the 4th round of 5 in Swiss, that's my accomplishment for today. Punted a match because it was paper and I didn't wait for my Searing Blood to resolve before casting another one for lethal, and died to him killing his own Reckoner.

This is frustrating, I had the same thing happen to me, I was extremely clear and even put the Searing Bloods in the graveyard before jetting his Obzedat. He downfalled in response to the jet and the inexperienced judge sided with him.

[magicdownunder]

Maybe Reckoner is a better choice right now than more mortars?

Starting too believe so, Reck is horrible vs Removals for sure but after being killed by RR so many times (RR for 3 damage is usually enough to clean my hand and with Ooze on board as well my Phoenixes become munchies) I'm starting too see the appeal - then again they're only running 2-3x RR its not like they'll always draw it

[Kaitscralt]

zem it's very rude to ignore private messages

[DerWille]

I got a chance to play burn again because I went to a different LGS for FNM.

[deck]Pretty Typical Rw Burn List with a Different Sideboard[/deck]

I was going into an unknown meta, so I tried to make a sideboard that would let me test out Eidolon of the Great Revel and be flexible (I'll let you decide if I succeeded or not). I went 4-0 for the night against
Jund, Bw Devotion, UWr Control, and Red Devotion. I don't remember the play by play.

I'm late to the discussion but I brought in Eidolon against Jund, Bw, and UWr. I figured that I want it in match ups the play a lot of removal but have relatively few creatures so I can get in for damage. I'm still mixed on him, but I swear this card has hidden rules text that says, "Provoke target opponent. This opponent must kill this creature as soon as they possibly can." I expected him to be a lightning rod for removal, but it went beyond that. More than 1 guy threw his turn 2 or 3 mutavault at my Eidolon. It's like he upgraded from a free shock to a free stone rain. I'm willing to say this is just people being stupid, but has anyone else had this experience?

@MDU - Thanks for posting all the videos of you piloting this archetype. It's helped me learn the ins and outs of the deck. In particular, your decisions for when to scry. They
helped me get a handle on how to best use the mechanic.

[Lightning_Dolt]

After I saw the temple I had a feeling I'd me seeing a rat, so I wanted shock up. Call it intuition. Or maybe it's just a misplay

In regards to the warleaders helix, it was likely just a misplay, but because he knew I had phoenix in hand, it kept him from attacking with the demon.

Edit: sorry, you meant in G2. In G2, I noticed a couple misplays.

I don't think it was correct to BL the whip when he has no threats and noting with haste in his deck. Game would have been easier if I hit 2x demons with 2x BL. The turn where I cracked him and sacced the YP$ token, I was at 16, I could have just taken the hit, but I think my thought process was that I wanted to make sure I wasn't taking the damage and it was tapped for my swing back. I think the main phase WLH was just me going for it. Yeah, he had the devour flesh, but if he didn't, I
just won. Not sure what difference my turn or his upkeep would have made really. Response to gary makes sense though.

[magicdownunder]

I'm still mixed on hRevel, but I swear this card has hidden rules text that says, "Provoke target opponent. This opponent must kill this creature as soon as they possibly can." I expected him to be a lightning rod for removal, but it went beyond that. More than 1 guy threw his turn 2 or 3 mutavault at my Eidolon. It's like he upgraded from a free shock to a free stone rain. I'm willing to say this is just people being stupid, but has anyone else had this experience?

Firstly well done In regards with tossing vaults at Eidolon I'll do the same if my hand is filled
with lands so I don't think its a silly play (they're still trading 1-for-1).

[DerWille]

Even if it means a significant tempo hit? I'd consider the trade if it were turn 4 or 5 and I had a back up land in hand. That's no different than attacking with a mutavault when your opponent is showing removal mana. This was swinging in on turn 3 and they would throw their mutavault at him going down to 1 or 2 land!

[magicdownunder]

From the perspective of the mirror, I'll happily trade vaults for revel (if I know I can do it safely, e.g. have enough extra lands and the opp. is tapped out - I should note this doesn't happen often ) because taking two damage and losing a spell imo is worst for the race (unless that spell is chains or blood) with my current list I'm actually running extra lands post board so its not a huge loss.

Vs Jund they have ramp so I don't think they mind that early trade I can't say the same for Bx Devo or Control though.

[Elricity]

zem it's very rude to ignore private messages

Maybe he left you for a prettier dude?

[dpaine88]

Fuckin christ...

2 of the first 4 rounds in SCG Open against Hexproof.

What luck... Turn 1 Hexproof, turn 2 hex, turn 3 courage, turn 4 boros charm +rampager.

Tiltin hard..

[dauntless268]

Went 8-1 in 3 SE's last night, beating Sam Pardee (Smdster) in the last final.

He voiced his frustration after realizing that he was just lost to a million YP tokens in G3. He told me that I "fundamentally don't understand the matchup" because I had SBed out all 8 non-interactive spells and brought in the usual anti agro package. According to him I ***should*** have SBed out Helix (which matches up poorly vs. Dispel and Familiar) for extra CTTR / BL /MM and that's basically it. My opinion is that his proposed strategy is only good when you have Firedancer in the board, but too risky when we only have YP. What do you guys think/do?

[Rhyno]

Went 8-1 in 3 SE's last night, beating Sam Pardee (Smdster) in the last final.

According to him I ***should*** have SBed out Helix (which matches up poorly vs. Dispel and Familiar) for extra CTTR / BL /MM and that's basically it. My opinion is that his proposed strategy is only good when you have Firedancer in the board, but too risky when we only have YP. What do you guys think/do?

I'm not following your logic here, why would CTTR/BL/MM be better with Firedancer on the board rather than YP$?

[NotARobot]

Went 8-1 in 3 SE's last night, beating Sam Pardee (Smdster) in the last final.

He voiced his frustration after realizing that he was just lost to a million YP tokens in G3. He told me that I "fundamentally don't understand the matchup" because I had SBed out all 8 non-interactive spells and brought in the usual anti agro package. According to him I ***should*** have SBed out Helix (which matches up poorly vs. Dispel and Familiar) for extra CTTR / BL /MM and that's basically it. My opinion is that his proposed strategy is only good when you have Firedancer in the board, but too risky when we only have YP. What do you guys think/do?

What list are you on?

in other news, I finally gave in and bought my burn deck on MTGO to get
some extra practice. Getting crushed in this first SE I'm doing though, drawing 6 lands after scrying 5 to the bottom is brutal v_v

[Elricity]

Went 8-1 in 3 SE's last night, beating Sam Pardee (Smdster) in the last final.

He voiced his frustration after realizing that he was just lost to a million YP tokens in G3. He told me that I "fundamentally don't understand the matchup" because I had SBed out all 8 non-interactive spells and brought in the usual anti agro package. According to him I ***should*** have SBed out Helix (which matches up poorly vs. Dispel and Familiar) for extra CTTR / BL /MM and that's basically it. My opinion is that his proposed strategy is only good when you have Firedancer in the board, but too risky when we only have YP. What do you guys think/do?

I'm not familiar with what he plays but it sounds like blue devotion? And he was upset that you
did not side out helix? Or was he more upset about other things you brought in like Chandra?

[dauntless268]

Stupid me Yes, he was MonoU

@ Elricity: He was upset about Helix (which I didn't side out) and Hammer (which I brought in).

@ Not a Robot: Standard YP version with 1 CTTR and 1 Searing Blood in the flex slots. SB pretty standard with 3 MM, no SFD

@ Rhyno: With Firedancer & YP, you could go something like -4 Helix -2 Skullcrack +3 SFD +1 MM +1 CTTR +1 BL because postboard you have 7 cards that wreck him, with only YP if you go e.g. -4 Helix -1 Skullcrack +3 MM +1 BL +1 CTTR and you don't draw YP you're likely pretty doomed...

[Elricity]

Well, I could see him tilting an eyebrow about hammer. Maybe he isn't used to playing with YP. from what I understand, some of the pros are still pretty snobbish about the card.

[magicdownunder]

@NotARobot: Make sure to request a clan invite on the the DtR Clan thread

@dauntless268: I agree with elricity that Hammer is a very unique choice but beside that I agree with boarding out Charms and Crack for extra removal - the MU is not race esp. now that we have "extra" chains for those troubling Masters, though T3 Hall into T4 master is very painful.

[dauntless268]

I agree, it is personal preference or "unique" as you say. Hammer of Purphourous is my tech against Control (takes the place of Chandra) in combination with 2 Keening Apparition and 1 Mutavault

Reasoning:

(1) a threat on t3 is MUCH easier to get through the phalanx of Control's counterspells than a 4-drop, especially when you have 6 2-drops
(2) it's a proactive card against FSP
(3) with 3 Enchantment removal (incl. 1 BL) I have a fair chance of recovering the Hammer if it get's D-Sphered / BanLighted...
(4) it is a natural "hedge" against flooding

That said, you have to be VERY careful with Hammer and most of the time you should really just make 1 token, replenishing it when it dies (I use this strategy also vs. Black Devotion)

[Elricity]

I understand that but against blue devotion,haste and 3/3's are...lackluster? But yeah, cutting helix is fucktarded

[rage_jl]

Most higher level players raise their nose at burn in general, whenever it is viable, they fail to see it playing any sort of a control role in a game. MonoU is the closest deck to playing itself in standard at the moment and he would sure in the hell keep a card which said: make an 8 point life swing or kill a critter gain 4 life. I would try to convince anyone against playing such a card against me as well.

[Elricity]

Well, yeah but don't bluff it as you're losing. Too late then.

[dauntless268]

I understand that but against blue devotion,haste and 3/3's are...lackluster?

Not when you are playing 25+ removal spells postboard Their cards are weak individually, remember that

[Aodh]

Took Creatureless to 3-1 at SNM. 2-0 against Bg, 2-1 against Little Kid Selesnya, 1-2 against Bg, 2-0 against Bant Control. Same pilot for the last round as the one who beat me last FNM. Manabase killed me again. Not sure why all the aggro draws.

[Valdarith]

Depending on your sideboard it is usually correct to board out 1-2 Helix against control. That being said, that's no excuse to go on a tirade and berate an opponent's decision when you lost. Sam was being a huge tool there.

[dpaine88]

Damn ended up 6-4 at SCG Open, was 6-3 but mulled to a bad 5 against MBD/ 2 duress game 3 round 10....

Maindeck felt AWESOME with 4 Chains/1 Mortors.

Beat these decks:

B/g Devotion
Mirror
Mirror
Junk Hexproof
Jund Monsters
4-color control

Lost to:

R/G monsters
Esper
Mono Black Devotion
Naya Hexproof

[Elricity]

Depending on your sideboard it is usually correct to board out 1-2 Helix against control. That being said, that's no excuse to go on a tirade and berate an opponent's decision when you lost. Sam was being a huge tool there.

Yes, but Sam was playing blue devotion. Sam was telling him to race devotion with lava spikes instead of the removal plan which is the exact opposite of what you should do.

People seem to confuse standard burn with legacy

[Rhyno]

Almost all of my losses in 8-man SEs on MTGO have been to W/U control, holy crap does that matchup frustrate me. I feel like every post board game comes down to a critical spell with Dispel to protect it and Toil//Trouble has been sucking too. I'm putting away the Toil//Trouble for Satyrs again.