Dies to Removal

What if he were a mason or innocent child, for instance?

We should always at least take the time to let people present their claims, and if they're signalling intent to make a full defense, hear them out.

Well, if he's an innocent child, I'll just walk myself to the gallows I guess. I didn't even consider that at all, but point well taken.

As far as I was concerned, we'd gotten the defense - he's 60% town!

That wasn't intended as a defense. I just can't understand why I'd be the Wagon with all that's already revealed about my cards.

There's no way scum would resort to that as a defense. Real failure by everybody to read intent on that one. I was just trying to figure it all out.

They might if they felt desperate. You even flipped it around to attack imopen even though he'd have at least that same 60% chance.

Which cards did you have specifically? Why does you claiming those particular cards clear you as town but not imopen? Both of you claimed unique cards, so I don't see how that's any different or how that makes you town.

Like, the way that you're defending yourself now that you've already been lynched leads me to believe that you're town, but there's not much else in this thread that points to that.

Anyway, it doesn't matter now. You've said that imopen and Azrael are scum. How do you read the others? Give your read on me assuming I don't just win today after lynching you (I won't).

You know better than to hammer like that. If you're not lyncher then I doubt you're town aligned, but that leaves a wide field.

I don't know what's going in anymore.

Twilight I think.

We've already had a twilight. Don't tell me there's another governor our there. I can't handle three lynches in one day.

Raspy, you're the latest casualty in Azrael's quest to browbeat townies to an early grave. He did the same shit to me last game.

I'm going to spend some time reading into how this day ended, because it feels dirty.

Is Azrael a gimmick or just a new poster I don't know? Has anybody asked him for meta from other sites?

We've already had a twilight. Don't tell me there's another governor our there. I can't handle three lynches in one day.

I have no actions I can take

Is Azrael a gimmick or just a new poster I don't know? Has anybody asked him for meta from other sites?

Nvm. Old poster I somehow don't know.

Maybe people think I'm scummy because of the necro skulls in my sig.

Raspy, you're the latest casualty in Azrael's quest to browbeat townies to an early grave. He did the same shit to me last game.

I'm going to spend some time reading into how this day ended, because it feels dirty.

Bitter much? Come on, Ham.

Intent to hammer. I will re-read raspy's posts and see if his lynch seems appropriate, then cast a vote.

It's early so I'll wait a bit to catch objections.

Pedit: nath'd by Stardust

I mean, come on. ^

You were about to hammer him, but now you're trying to throw me under the bus for making the initial case?

If I had been online when you and Stardust were considering the hammer, I'd have said to hold off. If I'd been on when he was pushed L-1, I would have unvoted for discussion. I'm not used to playing in an environment that doesn't have the same conventions about lynching and claiming, though, so I didn't anticipate this going as fast as it did.

That's how we usually do it, though. Which makes Stardust's hammer stand out that much more.

We've had ten pages of discussion. We've already caught scum for tomorrow. This Day has already been a resounding success, apart from the probably lynching a townie thing. I have no regrets, but will certainly ask for a claim in the future.

Az:

I would have hammered him if his ISO gave me reason to, but I announced my intention and would have held off for discussion.

I have a huge confirmation bias against you personally, so I'm going to assume malice or incompetence every time you're part of a mislynch.

ham, Azrael lynched you because he thought you were scum. He was wrong. Can't you just leave it at that?

New game.

Votecount 1.5

rcwraspy (5): Azrael [297], imopen2 [306], Dechs Kaison [327], Rednihilist [329], Stardust [257]
imopen2 (1): rcwraspy [284]

Not Voting (3): Hamfactorial [142], WitchHunt [257], Jamie [257]

That's a lynch! It is now twilight.

Jamie cannot be lynched today.

-----

We've had ten pages of discussion. We've already caught scum for tomorrow. This Day has already been a resounding success, apart from the probably lynching a townie thing. I have no regrets, but will certainly ask for a claim in the future.

Apart from that. Ok, cool.

Az:

I would have hammered him if his ISO gave me reason to, but I announced my intention and would have held off for discussion.

I have a huge confirmation bias against you personally, so I'm going to assume malice or incompetence every time you're part of a mislynch.

If it's any consolation, I'm now factoring that into all my reads on you, and it's almost certainly a big part of what threw me off on my read on you from last game.

ham, Azrael lynched you because he thought you were scum. He was wrong. Can't you just leave it at that?

Yes, I won't bring it up again.

It is now Night 1.

Do not post.

Please submit all night actions to me via PM.

Night will end 48-72 hours from now

It is now Day 2.

You may post once again.

Votecount 2.0

Not Voting (9): Hamfactorial [385], WitchHunt [385], Jamie [385], rcwraspy [385], Azrael [385], imopen2 [385], Dechs Kaison [385], Rednihilist [385], Stardust [385]

With 9 players alive it takes 5 votes to lynch!

-----

Oh, and RCW must have lied. There is no werewolf card he could have used to get a power that survives a lynch. I'm thinking he's a Judas or the other one.

Ok..wtf?

Vote: Jaime

I wish I could vote RCW too

Oh, and RCW must have lied. There is no werewolf card he could have used to get a power that survives a lynch. I'm thinking he's a Judas or the other one.

I don't see anything on the wiki but a Judas or Saulus that could have resulted in that. Anyone else?

Huh. No, I'd say you guys are pretty spot on. Isn't it also possible he had a false claim on the werewolf bit?

Vote: Jaime

Sticking to my guns here. What to do with Raspy comes next.

I'll happily fill you all in when I'm at a computer later today.

Conflicting reads on rcw. Not sure if he's Saul or Judas. Will explain more later.

I agree that Jamie is the best lynch today. Would like to get rcw's explanation before we end the Day though.

Yea, let's not rush this lynch. We know it's happening

Somebody unvote please, stat.

I was a Saulus. My three cards:

Mafia Reflexive Doctor
Werewolf Ninja
Saulus

Saulus doesn't come with a role, but for the purposes of claiming it's vanilla. So when I claimed my other discarded pieces were Werewolf Vanilla, it was the truth. I had chosen Saulus Ninja.

I played day 1 with the following mindset. I'm Vanilla Town. I'm hunting scum. If we lynch scum, I need to get myself lynched to switch my win condition to town. If we mislynch a few days in a row, I try to keep my Saulus win condition. But since Saulus doesn't know who the other Mafia aligned people are, I played it straight up thinking that I had a possibility of sliding into either win condition. Obviously I got lynched, which makes me Vanilla Town now.

This means that my reads in Day 1 were coming from a vanilla town mindset. That's why I was so frustrated when I got quick-lynched like that - in my head I was vanilla town so I couldn't understand what people thought was scummy about my posts (barring the stupid percentage thing, that was a mistake). I still read imopen2 as very scummy. I still think Stardust's hammer was questionable. Azrael is still leaning scum to me for what I see as buddying imopen, though his posts after the hammer read town.

One thing I want to bring up: There were no night kills. Is it safe to assume we only have one faction to worry about? I can't imagine two factions having their kill thwarted on the same night. Those are some long odds.

Unvote

Y'all happy? He's L-2 now.

I'd like to see defenses and full explanations from both. Jamie is right up there on my list, but the fact that I literally don't see any possibility for RCWraspy to not be mafia (either now or formerly) based on the game's setup is pretty compelling, and potentially outweighs even Jamie's problems.

PPE: Uh huh. And why wouldn't you have said that before you died?

I'm actually pretty happy with that explanation. I appreciate the clever way to not lie in his claim.*

Can we hang Jamie now?



*In WePick, I claimed I had a role that would target a player and reveal his role and alignment. Everyone assumed I was a cop. I was actually a vigilante. I hadn't lied, but I hadn't corrected anyone either.

Based on how you played that, I think you're far more likely to be a traitor. You were angry at being lynched - if you were a mafia agent who WANTED to play as townie instead, you'd be getting exactly what you wanted. So the anger doesn't really track. Hell, you might have been in the position of thinking about ASKING the town to lynch you, if you were already playing the game in a townie mindset. And a townie would have been looking to collaborate with the town, to spill his guts and share necessary information, instead of clamming up with the most important possible information you had to share before you "died".

It's like you were hoping we wouldn't be able to figure out what your non-death meant for your alignment.