Rx Burn
Moderator: LP, of the Fires
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(View: POSTS_VIEWTOPIC /POSTS_VIEWTOPIC_INTO) - Joined: Sun Oct 20, 2013 12:49 pm
Lost horribly to Delver tonight (I ran Cruise/Revelry burn). Guys stabilized at 1–4 life and drowned me in card advantage. I missed a way to clear their graveyard to nerf Delve spells.
Newfangled Affinity build running 4 scissors wrecked me too. Guys, what's your answer to second turn 5/5 lifelinker?
Newfangled Affinity build running 4 scissors wrecked me too. Guys, what's your answer to second turn 5/5 lifelinker?
- Platypus
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- Khaospawn
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(View: POSTS_VIEWTOPIC /POSTS_VIEWTOPIC_INTO) - Joined: Tue Mar 12, 2013 4:55 pm
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Honest question here, but how? When playing VD, I seemed to have a bit of luck with just the Delver player either taking 4 or being forced to deal with the 4/3. I'm all for trying to gain an edge against the deck. Can you explain to me as if I was a small child?Going back a bit ~ Swiftspear is infinitely better vs. Delver than Vexing Devil which is a major consideration right now.
In a pinch, Khaos' beard can help turn this around.
I rarely skip a Khaospawn wall of text because I know there is always piss at the end of the rainbow.
- LaZerBurn
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(View: POSTS_VIEWTOPIC /POSTS_VIEWTOPIC_INTO) - Joined: Thu Oct 03, 2013 11:21 am
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I dropped Revelry for Smash and I'm ing the list dude!This was what I was jamming on all last week. I've been doing okay with it. I've had nights where I'll literally win back-to-back-to-back 8-Mans, and then some nights where I can barely win a Round. But the field is literally nothing but Burn, U/R, and UWR Control. At least, that's all I've been facing in the last couple weeks.
It's really heavy on the creature kill.
[deck]
Creatures 12
4 Goblin Guide
4 Eidolon of the Great Revel
4 Vexing Devil
Spells 26
2 Forked Bolt
4 Lightning Bolt
4 Lava Spike
4 Rift Bolt
1 Shard Volley
3 Searing Blood
4 Searing Blaze
4 Skullcrack
2 Flames of the Blood Hand
Land 20
4 Arid Mesa
4 Scalding Tarn
2 Wooded Foothills
8 Mountain
2 Stomping Ground
Sideboard 15
4 Destructive Revelry
4 Molten Rain
2 Relic of Progenitus
2 Combust
3 Dragon's Claw
[/deck]
I'm probably going back to Mono Red though.
Thanks to NerdBoyWonder for the awesome sig
- Khaospawn
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(View: POSTS_VIEWTOPIC /POSTS_VIEWTOPIC_INTO) - Joined: Tue Mar 12, 2013 4:55 pm
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Nice.
I was playing with Swiftspear and Treasure Cruise last night. I feel dirty.
[deck]
Creatures 12
4 Goblin Guide
4 Monastery Swiftspear
4 Eidolon of the Great Revel
Spells 28
2 Forked Bolt
4 Lightning Bolt
4 Lava Spike
4 Rift Bolt
4 Searing Blaze
4 Skullcrack
2 Flames of the Blood Hand
4 Treasure Cruise
Land 20
4 Arid Mesa
4 Bloodstained Mire
2 Scalding Tarn
8 Mountain
2 Steam Vents
Sideboard 15
4 Smash to Smithereens
4 Molten Rain
4 Searing Blood
3 Dragon's Claw
[/deck]
I was playing with Swiftspear and Treasure Cruise last night. I feel dirty.
[deck]
Creatures 12
4 Goblin Guide
4 Monastery Swiftspear
4 Eidolon of the Great Revel
Spells 28
2 Forked Bolt
4 Lightning Bolt
4 Lava Spike
4 Rift Bolt
4 Searing Blaze
4 Skullcrack
2 Flames of the Blood Hand
4 Treasure Cruise
Land 20
4 Arid Mesa
4 Bloodstained Mire
2 Scalding Tarn
8 Mountain
2 Steam Vents
Sideboard 15
4 Smash to Smithereens
4 Molten Rain
4 Searing Blood
3 Dragon's Claw
[/deck]
In a pinch, Khaos' beard can help turn this around.
I rarely skip a Khaospawn wall of text because I know there is always piss at the end of the rainbow.
- Khaospawn
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(View: POSTS_VIEWTOPIC /POSTS_VIEWTOPIC_INTO) - Joined: Tue Mar 12, 2013 4:55 pm
- Location: Largo, Florida
Next time, I'm probably going to jam something close to this:
[deck]
Creatures 12
4 Goblin Guide
4 Monastery Swiftspear
4 Eidolon of the Great Revel
Spells 28
4 Lightning Bolt
4 Lava Spike
4 Rift Bolt
4 Searing Blaze
4 Skullcrack
4 Boros Charm
1 Shard Volley
3 Treasure Cruise
Land 20
4 Arid Mesa
4 Bloodstained Mire
2 Scalding Tarn
4 Mountain
4 Sacred Foundry
2 Steam Vents
Sideboard 15
3 Wear // Tear
2 Smash to Smithereens
3 Molten Rain
2 Tormod's Crypt
3 Searing Blood
2 Dragon's Claw (or Kor Firewalker)
[/deck]
Boros Charm is so powerful that I don't think I can continue to NOT play it. The cool thing is that splashing White opens up so much cool sideboard tech, like Kor Firewalker.
[deck]
Creatures 12
4 Goblin Guide
4 Monastery Swiftspear
4 Eidolon of the Great Revel
Spells 28
4 Lightning Bolt
4 Lava Spike
4 Rift Bolt
4 Searing Blaze
4 Skullcrack
4 Boros Charm
1 Shard Volley
3 Treasure Cruise
Land 20
4 Arid Mesa
4 Bloodstained Mire
2 Scalding Tarn
4 Mountain
4 Sacred Foundry
2 Steam Vents
Sideboard 15
3 Wear // Tear
2 Smash to Smithereens
3 Molten Rain
2 Tormod's Crypt
3 Searing Blood
2 Dragon's Claw (or Kor Firewalker)
[/deck]
Boros Charm is so powerful that I don't think I can continue to NOT play it. The cool thing is that splashing White opens up so much cool sideboard tech, like Kor Firewalker.
In a pinch, Khaos' beard can help turn this around.
I rarely skip a Khaospawn wall of text because I know there is always piss at the end of the rainbow.
- Toddington
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(View: POSTS_VIEWTOPIC /POSTS_VIEWTOPIC_INTO) - Joined: Tue Jan 07, 2014 4:36 pm
- Location: Yorkshire, England
Anyone working with something better than this?
[deck=Corey Baker - 16th Place at StarCityGames.com Premier IQ on 11/30/2014]
Creatures (12)
4 Eidolon of the Great Revel
4 Goblin Guide
4 Monastery Swiftspear
Lands (20)
3 Arid Mesa
4 Bloodstained Mire
4 Mountain
2 Sacred Foundry
2 Steam Vents
1 Stomping Ground
4 Wooded Foothills
Spells (28)
4 Boros Charm
4 Lava Spike
4 Lightning Bolt
4 Rift Bolt
4 Searing Blaze
4 Skullcrack
4 Treasure Cruise
Sideboard (15)
3 Destructive Revelry
4 Lightning Helix
2 Molten Rain
2 Searing Blood
2 Smash to Smithereens
2 Volcanic Fallout
[/deck]
http://sales.starcitygames.com//deckdat ... ckID=76786
The sideboard seems a little off to me, and I wonder whether Destructive Revelry is worth the Stomping Grounds. I could see the 1st Shard Volley over the 4th Treasure Cruise (maindeck spells a la Khaos above).
@Khaos, did you get around to running that list?
[deck=Corey Baker - 16th Place at StarCityGames.com Premier IQ on 11/30/2014]
Creatures (12)
4 Eidolon of the Great Revel
4 Goblin Guide
4 Monastery Swiftspear
Lands (20)
3 Arid Mesa
4 Bloodstained Mire
4 Mountain
2 Sacred Foundry
2 Steam Vents
1 Stomping Ground
4 Wooded Foothills
Spells (28)
4 Boros Charm
4 Lava Spike
4 Lightning Bolt
4 Rift Bolt
4 Searing Blaze
4 Skullcrack
4 Treasure Cruise
Sideboard (15)
3 Destructive Revelry
4 Lightning Helix
2 Molten Rain
2 Searing Blood
2 Smash to Smithereens
2 Volcanic Fallout
[/deck]
http://sales.starcitygames.com//deckdat ... ckID=76786
The sideboard seems a little off to me, and I wonder whether Destructive Revelry is worth the Stomping Grounds. I could see the 1st Shard Volley over the 4th Treasure Cruise (maindeck spells a la Khaos above).
@Khaos, did you get around to running that list?
- BlakLanner
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(View: POSTS_VIEWTOPIC /POSTS_VIEWTOPIC_INTO) - Joined: Sat Mar 30, 2013 3:51 am
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Given that there are so many artifacts and enchantments in Modern right now, Revelry seems a reasonable call. I am more of a Wear/Tear guy myself but I can easily understand the allure of damaging your opponent while acting as removal as well.
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- Purp
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- Toddington
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dat Mutagenic Growth tho
- Khaospawn
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(View: POSTS_VIEWTOPIC /POSTS_VIEWTOPIC_INTO) - Joined: Tue Mar 12, 2013 4:55 pm
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I did, and it's great!@Khaos, did you get around to running that list?
Been too busy to play for the last week or so, but there's very little I'd change at this point. Though, I am willing to try the Mutagenic tech right now since Delver is just absurd online.
In a pinch, Khaos' beard can help turn this around.
I rarely skip a Khaospawn wall of text because I know there is always piss at the end of the rainbow.
- Khaospawn
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- hamfactorial
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- Khaospawn
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- Valdarith
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I'm going to FNM for the first time in two months tomorrow and my LGS will be running Standard and Modern side-by-side. If the Modern event is sizable enough I'm considering getting away from UR Delver and shuffling up my Mountains once again. I've actually never played pure Burn in Modern so I'm itching to exercise my foil Lava Spikes, Lightning Bolts, Searing Blazes, etc. This is what I'm considering:
[deck]Jeskai Burn[/deck]
As big a fan I am of Grim Lavamancer, I can't deny the power of Treasure Cruise. I mean, who doesn't love Ancestral Recall? This deck is designed to be a fair bit more grindy postboard. My meta is full of UWR Control, Tron, Affinity, and Splinter Twin so the sideboard was built with those matchups in mind. People love their hate cards like Kor Firewalker around here, and Shrine of Burning Rage provides a nice out to the card as well as to Etched Champion and control decks. My only snag right now is whether or not I should be running Lightning Helix in the main, perhaps at the expense of Skullcrack.
[deck]Jeskai Burn[/deck]
As big a fan I am of Grim Lavamancer, I can't deny the power of Treasure Cruise. I mean, who doesn't love Ancestral Recall? This deck is designed to be a fair bit more grindy postboard. My meta is full of UWR Control, Tron, Affinity, and Splinter Twin so the sideboard was built with those matchups in mind. People love their hate cards like Kor Firewalker around here, and Shrine of Burning Rage provides a nice out to the card as well as to Etched Champion and control decks. My only snag right now is whether or not I should be running Lightning Helix in the main, perhaps at the expense of Skullcrack.
Check out my stream! http://www.twitch.tv/valdarith
- Toddington
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(View: POSTS_VIEWTOPIC /POSTS_VIEWTOPIC_INTO) - Joined: Tue Jan 07, 2014 4:36 pm
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I'd be super interested to hear how the Shenhar list tests, someone will probably get round to it before I can. I'm a huge fan of Geist, seems about the sweetest thing to board into. If the Growth plan isn't good, it seems easy enough to put the Cracks and Blazes into the maindeck and free up some board slots.
- Valdarith
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Yeah, Geist is pretty good. I am actually considering swapping out the Shrines for Geists. It allows me to play around Kor Firewalker a bit as long as I can keep the other side of the board relatively clear, and is even more of a nightmare for UWR Control. It leaves me a bit weaker vs Etched Champion but my strategy in that matchup should be to keep the board relatively clear and kill Plating on sight. I don't think Shrine does much else in the matchup besides being an expensive removal spell.
Check out my stream! http://www.twitch.tv/valdarith
- Khaospawn
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- Valdarith
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(View: POSTS_VIEWTOPIC /POSTS_VIEWTOPIC_INTO) - Joined: Thu Mar 28, 2013 3:48 pm
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Thanks, Khaos. I came to the same conclusion a few hours ago but definitely appreciate the advise. It confirms I'm not crazy. Plus I really want to make people rage with Geist tonight. Hopefully we have enough people in the event so I'm not forced to play Standard.
Check out my stream! http://www.twitch.tv/valdarith
- Khaospawn
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(View: POSTS_VIEWTOPIC /POSTS_VIEWTOPIC_INTO) - Joined: Tue Mar 12, 2013 4:55 pm
- Location: Largo, Florida
Been itchin' to get a damn game in on MTGO with this monster, but I'm, having trouble connecting. Once I play this, I'll post details.
[deck]
Creatures 12
4 Goblin Guide
4 Monastery Swiftspear
4 Eidolon of the Great Revel
Spells 28
4 Lightning Bolt
4 Lava Spike
4 Rift Bolt
2 Forked Bolt
3 Searing Blaze
4 Skullcrack
4 Boros Charm
3 Treasure Cruise
Land 20
3 Arid Mesa
2 Wooded Foothills
3 Bloodstained Mire
2 Scalding Tarn
4 Mountain
4 Sacred Foundry
2 Steam Vents
Sideboard 15
3 Wear // Tear
2 Smash to Smithereens
4 Molten Rain
4 Kor Firewalker
2 Volcanic Fallout
[/deck]
Another sideboard choice is Everlasting Torment, but right now, it seems that the majority of decks online are U/R Delver, Burn, Pod, and Scapeshift, so I really just want to attack that. I suppose I can maybe cram a Combust in there, but Twin seems to be on the decline (at least in my expereince) and I just want to cram some damn games in to know for sure.
[deck]
Creatures 12
4 Goblin Guide
4 Monastery Swiftspear
4 Eidolon of the Great Revel
Spells 28
4 Lightning Bolt
4 Lava Spike
4 Rift Bolt
2 Forked Bolt
3 Searing Blaze
4 Skullcrack
4 Boros Charm
3 Treasure Cruise
Land 20
3 Arid Mesa
2 Wooded Foothills
3 Bloodstained Mire
2 Scalding Tarn
4 Mountain
4 Sacred Foundry
2 Steam Vents
Sideboard 15
3 Wear // Tear
2 Smash to Smithereens
4 Molten Rain
4 Kor Firewalker
2 Volcanic Fallout
[/deck]
Another sideboard choice is Everlasting Torment, but right now, it seems that the majority of decks online are U/R Delver, Burn, Pod, and Scapeshift, so I really just want to attack that. I suppose I can maybe cram a Combust in there, but Twin seems to be on the decline (at least in my expereince) and I just want to cram some damn games in to know for sure.
In a pinch, Khaos' beard can help turn this around.
I rarely skip a Khaospawn wall of text because I know there is always piss at the end of the rainbow.
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Is 14 white sources enough for WW?Been itchin' to get a damn game in on MTGO with this monster, but I'm, having trouble connecting. Once I play this, I'll post details.
[deck]
Creatures 12
4 Goblin Guide
4 Monastery Swiftspear
4 Eidolon of the Great Revel
Spells 28
4 Lightning Bolt
4 Lava Spike
4 Rift Bolt
2 Forked Bolt
3 Searing Blaze
4 Skullcrack
4 Boros Charm
3 Treasure Cruise
Land 20
3 Arid Mesa
2 Wooded Foothills
3 Bloodstained Mire
2 Scalding Tarn
4 Mountain
4 Sacred Foundry
2 Steam Vents
Sideboard 15
3 Wear // Tear
2 Smash to Smithereens
4 Molten Rain
4 Kor Firewalker
2 Volcanic Fallout
[/deck]
Another sideboard choice is Everlasting Torment, but right now, it seems that the majority of decks online are U/R Delver, Burn, Pod, and Scapeshift, so I really just want to attack that. I suppose I can maybe cram a Combust in there, but Twin seems to be on the decline (at least in my expereince) and I just want to cram some damn games in to know for sure.
- Valdarith
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(View: POSTS_VIEWTOPIC /POSTS_VIEWTOPIC_INTO) - Joined: Thu Mar 28, 2013 3:48 pm
- Location: Southeast AL
Ran the list above at FNM without Geists. My friend couldn't find them in time for the event, so I had to play my Shrines instead. Meta had the following makeup:
1 Bloom Titan (friend)
2 Angel Pod
1 Burn (me)
4 Affinity
6 Delver
I anticipated Delver to be a lot more popular, but not by this much, and certainly not this many Affinity decks. I love Burn as a choice in this meta, but unfortunately I caught a couple of bad breaks in my Affinity matchups and went 2-2.
Match 1 vs Chalice Affinity: opponent is on the play and I mull to six. He poops out most of his hand on turn one. I play a Goblin Guide and attack. Opponent reveals Chalice of the Void. I stare at my hand of Lava Spikes and Lightning Bolts. Game actually ends up being closer than expected but I still lose. Game two was much closer but I ended up stuck on two lands for eight turns while my opponent was able to resolve two Etched Champions and kill me over the course of a few turns.
Match 2 vs Affinity w/ Master of Etherium: game one I mull to six and keep a sketchy four-land hand because it has Searing Blaze and Lightning Bolt. I proceed to draw four more lands and lose. Game two is closer but I don't draw any action and flood out in the end.
Match 3 vs UR Delver: this matchup feels unlosable. Eidolon with eight Searing effects postboard can only be beaten by multiple Dragon's Claws. I actually beat a single Dragon's Claw game two with ease. We played more games after concluding our match and came very close to beating two in play before he was finally able to clear my last creature threat and stabilize.
Match 4 vs UR Delver: against one of the better players at my LGS, but again, easy pickings.
In retrospect, I feel like I made some suboptimal deckbuilding choices if I was expecting UR Delver and Affinity to rise in popularity. I attribute this both to my lack of experience with Burn and a slight underestimation on the potency of Affinity. The choices I'm talking about are the following:
1) Boros Charm over Lightning Helix - If I were expecting Delver and Affinity to be more popular, running Boros Charm seems like a greedy choice to be making. Helix is much more interactive, and my tendency to play the control role in a lot of matchups lends to Helix being the better choice for my style of play anyway. I think I was conditioned into running Boros Charm since control used to be so popular before Treasure Cruise was printed.
2) Shrine of Burning Rage over anything - Seems great against control decks, but is entirely too slow to be playing against Affinity. It was actually taunting me in game two of my first match since I played it but couldn't activate it to kill an Etched Champion until I hit my third land on turn nine. This could be results-oriented thinking, but I'd much prefer to be running Pyrite Spellbomb if I'm looking for this type of effect (and it's just as effective against Kor Firewalker which is a rather popular sideboard option these days).
3) Molten Rain over Blood Moon - The latter is much more widely applicable but unfortunately I was not able to track down Blood Moons before the tournament. In fact people flat out refused to trade them to me a few months ago because they know me as "the red guy that wins a lot" so I wouldn't be shocked to find out that there's a gentlemen's agreement locally to not trade any to me.
4) Dragon's Claw over Kor Firewalker - I could easily support Kor Firewalker postboard, and it would be yet another card to beat UR Delver with. Even though that matchup is hard to lose, it does give me a foil to opposing Dragon's Claw so I don't have to board in potentially dead Wear / Tear.
5) No Path to Exile in the sideboard - This actually seems like the card I want to be playing instead of cute stuff like Shrine of Burning Rage and Pyrite Spellbomb. It doesn't kill Etched Champion but it's reasonable to side in against Affinity anyway. It's also good against any creature deck, especially ones I expect to play Kitchen Finks, Siege Rhino, and Kor Firewalker.
Now for the cards I liked:
1) Wear / Tear - great card vs Affinity, and nice to side in against Splinter Twin, Bogles, Ascendency, and other random decks I would face in a real metagame.
2) Searing Blaze/Searing Blood - I felt this was the best deckbuilding decision I made. Searing Blaze is hardly ever dead, and being able to side into eight Searing effects increases your percentages dramatically in so many matchups. Getting around Chalice is just a bonus.
3) Monastery Swiftspear - this card allows you to play a little subgame with your burn deck which I find pretty entertaining. Do I go ahead and fire off this Lava Spike in my hand or do I sandbag it for a possible topdecked Swiftspear? I'm not convinced that this card is better than Goblin Guide, but it's certainly not worse either. I will say I think it's interesting that it doesn't die to your own Volcanic Fallout if you decide to go that route (and I've considered building a Fallout deck for my next FNM).
On Treasure Cruise: my experience was skewed based on my pairings, but the card was either too slow (Affinity) or a winmore (Delver). Is it necessary to even run this card? I actually think this is a meta call. I would have much preferred Grim Lavamancer last Friday over Treasure Cruise, and I think that would apply had I played against Pod and control too.
With all of this in mind, this would be my revised 75.
[deck]
Creatures (15)
4 Goblin Guide
4 Monastery Swiftspear
3 Grim Lavamancer
4 Eidolon of the Great Revel
Spells (25)
4 Lava Spike
4 Lightning Bolt
4 Searing Blaze
1 Searing Blood
4 Skullcrack
4 Lightning Helix
4 Rift Bolt
Lands (20)
4 Scalding Tarn
2 Bloodstained Mire
4 Arid Mesa
3 Sacred Foundry
1 Plains
6 Mountain
Sideboard (15)
3 Path to Exile
3 Wear / Tear
3 Kor Firewalker
3 Searing Blood
3 Blood Moon
[/deck]
Comments/critique welcome.
1 Bloom Titan (friend)
2 Angel Pod
1 Burn (me)
4 Affinity
6 Delver
I anticipated Delver to be a lot more popular, but not by this much, and certainly not this many Affinity decks. I love Burn as a choice in this meta, but unfortunately I caught a couple of bad breaks in my Affinity matchups and went 2-2.
Match 1 vs Chalice Affinity: opponent is on the play and I mull to six. He poops out most of his hand on turn one. I play a Goblin Guide and attack. Opponent reveals Chalice of the Void. I stare at my hand of Lava Spikes and Lightning Bolts. Game actually ends up being closer than expected but I still lose. Game two was much closer but I ended up stuck on two lands for eight turns while my opponent was able to resolve two Etched Champions and kill me over the course of a few turns.
Match 2 vs Affinity w/ Master of Etherium: game one I mull to six and keep a sketchy four-land hand because it has Searing Blaze and Lightning Bolt. I proceed to draw four more lands and lose. Game two is closer but I don't draw any action and flood out in the end.
Match 3 vs UR Delver: this matchup feels unlosable. Eidolon with eight Searing effects postboard can only be beaten by multiple Dragon's Claws. I actually beat a single Dragon's Claw game two with ease. We played more games after concluding our match and came very close to beating two in play before he was finally able to clear my last creature threat and stabilize.
Match 4 vs UR Delver: against one of the better players at my LGS, but again, easy pickings.
In retrospect, I feel like I made some suboptimal deckbuilding choices if I was expecting UR Delver and Affinity to rise in popularity. I attribute this both to my lack of experience with Burn and a slight underestimation on the potency of Affinity. The choices I'm talking about are the following:
1) Boros Charm over Lightning Helix - If I were expecting Delver and Affinity to be more popular, running Boros Charm seems like a greedy choice to be making. Helix is much more interactive, and my tendency to play the control role in a lot of matchups lends to Helix being the better choice for my style of play anyway. I think I was conditioned into running Boros Charm since control used to be so popular before Treasure Cruise was printed.
2) Shrine of Burning Rage over anything - Seems great against control decks, but is entirely too slow to be playing against Affinity. It was actually taunting me in game two of my first match since I played it but couldn't activate it to kill an Etched Champion until I hit my third land on turn nine. This could be results-oriented thinking, but I'd much prefer to be running Pyrite Spellbomb if I'm looking for this type of effect (and it's just as effective against Kor Firewalker which is a rather popular sideboard option these days).
3) Molten Rain over Blood Moon - The latter is much more widely applicable but unfortunately I was not able to track down Blood Moons before the tournament. In fact people flat out refused to trade them to me a few months ago because they know me as "the red guy that wins a lot" so I wouldn't be shocked to find out that there's a gentlemen's agreement locally to not trade any to me.
4) Dragon's Claw over Kor Firewalker - I could easily support Kor Firewalker postboard, and it would be yet another card to beat UR Delver with. Even though that matchup is hard to lose, it does give me a foil to opposing Dragon's Claw so I don't have to board in potentially dead Wear / Tear.
5) No Path to Exile in the sideboard - This actually seems like the card I want to be playing instead of cute stuff like Shrine of Burning Rage and Pyrite Spellbomb. It doesn't kill Etched Champion but it's reasonable to side in against Affinity anyway. It's also good against any creature deck, especially ones I expect to play Kitchen Finks, Siege Rhino, and Kor Firewalker.
Now for the cards I liked:
1) Wear / Tear - great card vs Affinity, and nice to side in against Splinter Twin, Bogles, Ascendency, and other random decks I would face in a real metagame.
2) Searing Blaze/Searing Blood - I felt this was the best deckbuilding decision I made. Searing Blaze is hardly ever dead, and being able to side into eight Searing effects increases your percentages dramatically in so many matchups. Getting around Chalice is just a bonus.
3) Monastery Swiftspear - this card allows you to play a little subgame with your burn deck which I find pretty entertaining. Do I go ahead and fire off this Lava Spike in my hand or do I sandbag it for a possible topdecked Swiftspear? I'm not convinced that this card is better than Goblin Guide, but it's certainly not worse either. I will say I think it's interesting that it doesn't die to your own Volcanic Fallout if you decide to go that route (and I've considered building a Fallout deck for my next FNM).
On Treasure Cruise: my experience was skewed based on my pairings, but the card was either too slow (Affinity) or a winmore (Delver). Is it necessary to even run this card? I actually think this is a meta call. I would have much preferred Grim Lavamancer last Friday over Treasure Cruise, and I think that would apply had I played against Pod and control too.
With all of this in mind, this would be my revised 75.
[deck]
Creatures (15)
4 Goblin Guide
4 Monastery Swiftspear
3 Grim Lavamancer
4 Eidolon of the Great Revel
Spells (25)
4 Lava Spike
4 Lightning Bolt
4 Searing Blaze
1 Searing Blood
4 Skullcrack
4 Lightning Helix
4 Rift Bolt
Lands (20)
4 Scalding Tarn
2 Bloodstained Mire
4 Arid Mesa
3 Sacred Foundry
1 Plains
6 Mountain
Sideboard (15)
3 Path to Exile
3 Wear / Tear
3 Kor Firewalker
3 Searing Blood
3 Blood Moon
[/deck]
Comments/critique welcome.
Check out my stream! http://www.twitch.tv/valdarith
- Valdarith
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I don't feel it's necessary to resolve on turn two, so my opinion is that 14 is enough.Is 14 white sources enough for WW?Been itchin' to get a damn game in on MTGO with this monster, but I'm, having trouble connecting. Once I play this, I'll post details.
[deck]
Creatures 12
4 Goblin Guide
4 Monastery Swiftspear
4 Eidolon of the Great Revel
Spells 28
4 Lightning Bolt
4 Lava Spike
4 Rift Bolt
2 Forked Bolt
3 Searing Blaze
4 Skullcrack
4 Boros Charm
3 Treasure Cruise
Land 20
3 Arid Mesa
2 Wooded Foothills
3 Bloodstained Mire
2 Scalding Tarn
4 Mountain
4 Sacred Foundry
2 Steam Vents
Sideboard 15
3 Wear // Tear
2 Smash to Smithereens
4 Molten Rain
4 Kor Firewalker
2 Volcanic Fallout
[/deck]
Another sideboard choice is Everlasting Torment, but right now, it seems that the majority of decks online are U/R Delver, Burn, Pod, and Scapeshift, so I really just want to attack that. I suppose I can maybe cram a Combust in there, but Twin seems to be on the decline (at least in my expereince) and I just want to cram some damn games in to know for sure.
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(View: POSTS_VIEWTOPIC /POSTS_VIEWTOPIC_INTO) - Joined: Tue Mar 12, 2013 4:55 pm
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Yes.
Is 14 white sources enough for WW?
Replies in bold, Val.
1) Boros Charm over Lightning Helix - If I were expecting Delver and Affinity to be more popular, running Boros Charm seems like a greedy choice to be making. Helix is much more interactive, and my tendency to play the control role in a lot of matchups lends to Helix being the better choice for my style of play anyway. I think I was conditioned into running Boros Charm since control used to be so popular before Treasure Cruise was printed.
Boros Charm works amazingly with Swiftie. The problem I've had with Helix is that I'm often "bolting" myself to play Helix, which makes it a bad version of Lightning Strike. Charm hits that sweet spot of 4 damage and will also protect your ground crew from Pyroclasm and whatever else. Also, you don't know the true joy of slamming a couple burn spells and then granting Swiftie double strike to deal 10 (or more, especially with Mutagenic Growth fwiw)
2) Shrine of Burning Rage over anything - Seems great against control decks, but is entirely too slow to be playing against Affinity. It was actually taunting me in game two of my first match since I played it but couldn't activate it to kill an Etched Champion until I hit my third land on turn nine. This could be results-oriented thinking, but I'd much prefer to be running Pyrite Spellbomb if I'm looking for this type of effect (and it's just as effective against Kor Firewalker which is a rather popular sideboard option these days).
In my experience, the Shrine was a lot better in the Heal list since you had a solid ground presence. You ultimately want a 2-prong attack to make the card worthwhile - the opponent kills the ground crew and you dome for lethal with Shrine, or they deal with shrine and you crack back with ground damage. In Burn, it's too slow. Burn is all about immediate gratification and unfortunately, it doesn't deal a lot early on. Burn needs a fast clock and most of the time, your wins come from the top. Any card that can deal damage when ripped is what you want to aim for.
3) Molten Rain over Blood Moon - The latter is much more widely applicable but unfortunately I was not able to track down Blood Moons before the tournament. In fact people flat out refused to trade them to me a few months ago because they know me as "the red guy that wins a lot" so I wouldn't be shocked to find out that there's a gentlemen's agreement locally to not trade any to me.
See my argument above for Blood Moon as well. It's a bad topdeck and doesn't deal any damage when you rip it. Like Shrine, it works best with the 2 prong attack. Granted, 12 creatures is sometimes enough to land an early presence, but in a deck like Heal's (strictly for example) that plays 20 creatures, Blood Moon really shines (see what I did there!? )
4) Dragon's Claw over Kor Firewalker - I could easily support Kor Firewalker postboard, and it would be yet another card to beat UR Delver with. Even though that matchup is hard to lose, it does give me a foil to opposing Dragon's Claw so I don't have to board in potentially dead Wear / Tear.
I like where your head is at. U/R Delver and Burn are both top tier decks and Firewalker is what you want to shut them down.
5) No Path to Exile in the sideboard - This actually seems like the card I want to be playing instead of cute stuff like Shrine of Burning Rage and Pyrite Spellbomb. It doesn't kill Etched Champion but it's reasonable to side in against Affinity anyway. It's also good against any creature deck, especially ones I expect to play Kitchen Finks, Siege Rhino, and Kor Firewalker.
Please, no. Path is not what Burn needs or deserves. No damage, my friend, and it also ramps your opponent.
Now for the cards I liked:
1) Wear / Tear - great card vs Affinity, and nice to side in against Splinter Twin, Bogles, Ascendency, and other random decks I would face in a real metagame.
2) Searing Blaze/Searing Blood - I felt this was the best deckbuilding decision I made. Searing Blaze is hardly ever dead, and being able to side into eight Searing effects increases your percentages dramatically in so many matchups. Getting around Chalice is just a bonus.
3) Monastery Swiftspear - this card allows you to play a little subgame with your burn deck which I find pretty entertaining. Do I go ahead and fire off this Lava Spike in my hand or do I sandbag it for a possible topdecked Swiftspear? I'm not convinced that this card is better than Goblin Guide, but it's certainly not worse either. I will say I think it's interesting that it doesn't die to your own Volcanic Fallout if you decide to go that route (and I've considered building a Fallout deck for my next FNM).
On Treasure Cruise: my experience was skewed based on my pairings, but the card was either too slow (Affinity) or a winmore (Delver). Is it necessary to even run this card? I actually think this is a meta call. I would have much preferred Grim Lavamancer last Friday over Treasure Cruise, and I think that would apply had I played against Pod and control too.
I think it's a mistake to NOT play it. Play the strongest cards available to you (and it doesn't get any stronger than a 1 mana, draw 3). When in doubt, leave it as a singleton. I've tried anywhere from 1-4. 3 is the sweet spot I prefer.
With all of this in mind, this would be my revised 75.
[deck]
Creatures (15)
4 Goblin Guide
4 Monastery Swiftspear
3 Grim Lavamancer
4 Eidolon of the Great Revel
Spells (25)
4 Lava Spike
4 Lightning Bolt
4 Searing Blaze
1 Searing Blood
4 Skullcrack
4 Lightning Helix
4 Rift Bolt
Lands (20)
4 Scalding Tarn
2 Bloodstained Mire
4 Arid Mesa
3 Sacred Foundry
1 Plains
6 Mountain
Sideboard (15)
3 Path to Exile
3 Wear / Tear
3 Kor Firewalker
3 Searing Blood
3 Blood Moon
[/deck]
Comments/critique welcome.
My advice? Play Boros Charm over Helix in the main. Trade the Blood Moons for Molten Rains and cut the Paths for any combination of Combust, Fallout, or Smash. Seriously, that's what I'd play.
In a pinch, Khaos' beard can help turn this around.
I rarely skip a Khaospawn wall of text because I know there is always piss at the end of the rainbow.
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My opinion could be skewed by local meta. I really did want Lavaman over Cruise last Friday which I would never have agreed to before that. I would definitely run Cruise online though.
Fair point on Molten Rain. One other upside is that it's better against Scapeshift.
I'm likely being too risk-averse with Path. I could see Pillar of Flame instead as a Pod hoser and a reasonable option vs aggro.
I actually have a playset of foil Kor Firewalkers and Volcanic Fallouts on the way to compliment the rest of my deck, but I'm not sure how I feel about Fallout in the deck. Are you typically siding out Guide and/or Eidolon when you bring it in?
Fair point on Molten Rain. One other upside is that it's better against Scapeshift.
I'm likely being too risk-averse with Path. I could see Pillar of Flame instead as a Pod hoser and a reasonable option vs aggro.
I actually have a playset of foil Kor Firewalkers and Volcanic Fallouts on the way to compliment the rest of my deck, but I'm not sure how I feel about Fallout in the deck. Are you typically siding out Guide and/or Eidolon when you bring it in?
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more bold replies.My opinion could be skewed by local meta. I really did want Lavaman over Cruise last Friday which I would never have agreed to before that. I would definitely run Cruise online though.
Lavaman is definitely a metacall, and I really think that the reason why a lot of people aren't playing it in paper is because they're looking at the online meta, which he is NOT good in.
Fair point on Molten Rain. One other upside is that it's better against Scapeshift.
Scapeshift is on the rise, especially after it's showing at Worlds. But beware - it can still beat you down as a midrange deck postboard and can still fight through a Blood Moon. Therefore, I still believe it's better to just be so much faster and have more direct damage at your disposal.
I'm likely being too risk-averse with Path. I could see Pillar of Flame instead as a Pod hoser and a reasonable option vs aggro.
Pillar is very good because it still goes upstairs. I can get behind that and would most definitely recommend that as an option over Path. The thing is, I think you want Path because it helps you deal with Twin combo, Ensouled artifacts, and maybe things like Finks in a pinch, but there are actually some very viable options with some added versatility, such as Combust and Pillar. I like your suggestion of Pillar very much.
I actually have a playset of foil Kor Firewalkers and Volcanic Fallouts on the way to compliment the rest of my deck, but I'm not sure how I feel about Fallout in the deck. Are you typically siding out Guide and/or Eidolon when you bring it in?
It just depends on the matchup. Against UR Delver, for example, I'll be taking out the Skullcracks and maybe some Eidolons for the Firewalkers and the Fallout.
In a pinch, Khaos' beard can help turn this around.
I rarely skip a Khaospawn wall of text because I know there is always piss at the end of the rainbow.
- Valdarith
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Your point on Path getting an Ensouled Artifact is why I like Wear / Tear so much. It's such a versatile card in that matchup especially since it hits Ensoul and artifacts. It's also awesome vs Twin since you can hit Splinter Twin and Spellskite with it (even at the same time despite how rare that would be).
Speaking as a UR Delver player, I personally would never side out Eidolon vs UR Delver. They are almost always behind in the matchup and that's exactly when I want it.
Speaking as a UR Delver player, I personally would never side out Eidolon vs UR Delver. They are almost always behind in the matchup and that's exactly when I want it.
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Position is everything. And also, depending on how aggressive the build in question is, you may not always want 4 on the draw.Your point on Path getting an Ensouled Artifact is why I like Wear / Tear so much. It's such a versatile card in that matchup especially since it hits Ensoul and artifacts. It's also awesome vs Twin since you can hit Splinter Twin and Spellskite with it (even at the same time despite how rare that would be).
Speaking as a UR Delver player, I personally would never side out Eidolon vs UR Delver. They are almost always behind in the matchup and that's exactly when I want it.
In a pinch, Khaos' beard can help turn this around.
I rarely skip a Khaospawn wall of text because I know there is always piss at the end of the rainbow.
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But also, Val, I do know exactly what it's like to be a big fish in a small pond, with people playing rogue decks and sideboarding specifically for me. Knowing the meta in any given area is extremely important - just look at the decks for Worlds! Worlds' decks were built to compete against 24 pro players, not the Alabama or MTGO meta.
Basically, if you feel that a certain card is going to trump or give you an edge going into any expected field, then DO it. Just because I disagree with something like Path or Helix doesn't mean that I'm right. You knew the meta better than I do, so go with your gut, mate.
Basically, if you feel that a certain card is going to trump or give you an edge going into any expected field, then DO it. Just because I disagree with something like Path or Helix doesn't mean that I'm right. You knew the meta better than I do, so go with your gut, mate.
In a pinch, Khaos' beard can help turn this around.
I rarely skip a Khaospawn wall of text because I know there is always piss at the end of the rainbow.
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What I'm playing this second...
[deck]
Creatures 12
4 Goblin Guide
4 Monastery Swiftspear
4 Eidolon of the Great Revel
Spells 28
3 Mutagenic Growth
2 Forked Bolt
4 Lava Spike
4 Lightning Bolt
4 Rift Bolt
1 Shard Volley
2 Searing Blaze
2 Skullcrack
3 Boros Charm
3 Treasure Cruise
Land 20
3 Arid Mesa
2 Bloodstained Mire
3 Scalding Tarn
2 Wooded Foothills
4 Mountain
4 Sacred Foundry
2 Steam Vents
Sideboard 15
3 Wear // Tear
2 Smash to Smithereens
2 Molten Rain
4 Kor Firewalker
2 Skullcrack
2 Searing Blaze
[/deck]
[deck]
Creatures 12
4 Goblin Guide
4 Monastery Swiftspear
4 Eidolon of the Great Revel
Spells 28
3 Mutagenic Growth
2 Forked Bolt
4 Lava Spike
4 Lightning Bolt
4 Rift Bolt
1 Shard Volley
2 Searing Blaze
2 Skullcrack
3 Boros Charm
3 Treasure Cruise
Land 20
3 Arid Mesa
2 Bloodstained Mire
3 Scalding Tarn
2 Wooded Foothills
4 Mountain
4 Sacred Foundry
2 Steam Vents
Sideboard 15
3 Wear // Tear
2 Smash to Smithereens
2 Molten Rain
4 Kor Firewalker
2 Skullcrack
2 Searing Blaze
[/deck]
Last edited by Khaospawn on Mon Dec 08, 2014 11:58 pm, edited 1 time in total.
In a pinch, Khaos' beard can help turn this around.
I rarely skip a Khaospawn wall of text because I know there is always piss at the end of the rainbow.
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Would probably play Fallout over Rain right now. Young Peezy is still very strong, even with a Firewalker.
To quote zemanjaski, "You cannot reasonably race a Young Pyromancer."
To quote zemanjaski, "You cannot reasonably race a Young Pyromancer."
In a pinch, Khaos' beard can help turn this around.
I rarely skip a Khaospawn wall of text because I know there is always piss at the end of the rainbow.
- Valdarith
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I always just killed YP$ on sight, but then again the new UR Delver pilots are trash and walk their Pyromancers right out to be burned with no counter backup.
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- hamfactorial
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Deck looks great. I'm still skeptical about the firewalkers. Hasn't it been established that we want 18-20 sources to get WW by turn 2 or 3 even? 14 seems like the amount I'd want for 6-drops with WW in their cost. Also, even if it is enough, she needs to see 3-6 red spells just to recover the life lost to cast her. That's especially a lot of spells to wait for if she's late to the party. I haven't played her, nor the mirror at my LGS, so this is theoretical. I know that once you add legs to a powerful effect (pyroststic pillar to Eidolon; now Dragon's Claw to Firewalker), it gets much better, but is it really the best way to fight the meta?
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Couldn't 1 Mountain become a Stomping Ground? That could painlessly cast Mutagenic, not that it matters much, but would also allow for Ancient Grudge from the board.What I'm playing this second...
[deck]
Creatures 12
4 Goblin Guide
4 Monastery Swiftspear
4 Eidolon of the Great Revel
Spells 28
3 Mutagenic Growth
2 Forked Bolt
4 Lava Spike
4 Lightning Bolt
4 Rift Bolt
1 Shard Volley
2 Searing Blaze
2 Skullcrack
3 Boros Charm
3 Treasure Cruise
Land 20
3 Arid Mesa
2 Bloodstained Mire
3 Scalding Tarn
2 Wooded Foothills
4 Mountain
4 Sacred Foundry
2 Steam Vents
Sideboard 15
3 Wear // Tear
2 Smash to Smithereens
2 Molten Rain
4 Kor Firewalker
2 Skullcrack
2 Searing Blaze
[/deck]
Thanks to NerdBoyWonder for the amazing sig!
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