Primer: Mardu Midrange

[dauntless268]

Played three online tourneys over the weekend. One DE (3-1), two Khans of Tarkir Championship Qualifiers (first 1-2 drop, second 4-1 qualifying for the finals next WE).

I cut Swiftspear in one of the events, but find the deck curves MUCH better with it included. Mardu Midrange is lacking the individual card quality of Abzan Midrange and Sultai Reanimator, so I'd rather stay on the Aggro side of things.

[Lightning_Dolt]

Mardu Midrange is lacking the individual card quality of Abzan Midrange and Sultai Reanimator

I strongly disagree with this statement.

I split another win a box after beating the mirror twice.

Got another 3 fetches, dig, rhino, butcher (my 10th), Pearl Lake Ancient, Empty the Pits etc.

I ended up with $150 at my LGS, and sold a bunch of other stuff.

Weekend cost me $100 when the dust settled.

I foiled out a bunch of EDH decks etc. though. Good weekend.

[Pedrobear]

Mardu Midrange is lacking the individual card quality of Abzan Midrange and Sultai Reanimator

I strongly disagree with this statement.

The only thing I have in mind is when you have to cast Butcher to save your ass and he does nothing cause you no longer have board presence. Compared to Rhino, the struggle is real.

[dauntless268]

Hmm, maybe you're right and I should have said "late game power" rather than "individual card quality". Fighting through Whip powered Hornet Queens /Sidisis or multiple lifegaining Wingmate Rocs isn't exactly easy with this deck. Closing out games before these engines get going is pretty important, I feel.

[poppa_f]

Did you guys see Brad Nelson played 4-colour midrange at the SCG thing over the weekend? Deck looks sweet, you can jam 9 planeswalkers in post-board for when you want to out-control other midrange decks.

[deck]Brad Nelson 4-colour midrange[/deck]

I've got quite a lot of surplus tickets on MTGO at the moment, so going to try building it online and see how it plays

[Lightning_Dolt]

Yuck.

[Christen]

Mardu is picking up a lot of steam here in our local meta. MD Anger of the Gods is also good in my matches so far.

[Jamie]

Why does looking at a decklist with 4 colors and seige rhino bring up such feelings of disgust?

[Lightning_Dolt]

Why does looking at a decklist with 4 colors and seige rhino bring up such feelings of disgust?

The mana is super clunky and it just looks awful. All those double mana symbols. There is such a thing as too greedy.

[DXI-Edge]

After trialling with Thoughtseize and Hero's Downfall, I can conclude that they are in fact rather clunky.

I am testing the following version this week, if it doesnt feel right I'm moving back to my "stock" list.

[deck]
3 Seeker of the Way
4 Goblin Rabblemaster
4 Butcher of the Horde
2 Ashcloud Phoenix
2 Stormbreath Dragon

1 Sarkhan, the Dragonspeaker
2 Sorin, Solemn Visitor

3 Chained to the Rocks
4 Lightning Strike
1 Magma Jet
4 Crackling Doom
4 Hordeling Outburst
1 Murderous Cut

2 Battlefield Forge
4 Bloodstained Mire
3 Caves of Koilos
6 Mountain
4 Nomad Outpost
1 Swamp
2 Temple of Silence
3 Temple of Triumph

Sideboard
2 Magma Spray
1 Glare of Heresy
2 Anger of the Gods
3 Read the Bones
2 Chandra, Pyromaster
1 Utter End
2 End Hostilities
2 Elspeth, Sun's Champion
[/deck]

IMO there are only 4 flex slots for my deck: the 2 Ashclouds, 1 Magma Jet and 1 Murderous Cut.

[eldub]

Why does looking at a decklist with 4 colors and seige rhino bring up such feelings of disgust?

The mana is super clunky and it just looks awful. All those double mana symbols. There is such a thing as too greedy.

The only double mana is Courser and 5/6 drops. The deck has 29 mana sources and 2 wayfinders, it's really not unreasonable.

Here's the list I'll be playing in this weekends local IQ:

[DECK]
Land (25)
3x Bloodstained Mire
2x Forest
3x Mana Confluence
3x Mountain
2x Nomad Outpost
4x Sandsteppe Citadel
1x Swamp
4x Temple of Plenty
3x Wooded Foothills
Enchantment (2)
2x Chained to the Rocks
Creature (16)
2x Butcher of the Horde
4x Courser of Kruphix
2x Satyr Wayfinder
4x Siege Rhino
4x Sylvan Caryatid
Instant (10)
4x Crackling Doom
4x Lightning Strike
2x Murderous Cut
Sorcery (1)
1x Crater's Claws
Planeswalker (6)
2x Elspeth, Sun's Champion
2x Sarkhan, the Dragonspeaker
2x Sorin, Solemn Visitor
Sideboard
4x Anger of the Gods
1x Chandra, Pyromaster
2x End Hostilities
1x Glare of Heresy
3x Thoughtseize
2x Utter End
2x Xenagos, the Reveler
[/DECK]

I've updated the mana base slightly and added Sorin since I've been very happy with him so far. He seems to fit the plan and provide more life gain for your tougher agro match ups. Sarkhan has felt very strong in this she'll with so many stout blockers to protect him, he might be worth playing 3x. The list honestly is more an Abzan four color variant than Mardu but Crackling Doom continues to shine as it has all season. I'll provide an update Sunday.

[Lightning_Dolt]

I think people are trying too hard to reinvent the wheel here. I really think the deck is a pretty much finished deck annd you guys are looking for something you aren't going to find.

The only card that's up for debate in my mind is Chained to the Rocks because it has become much worse recently.

[poppa_f]

Check out the decklists from the £10k I played in last weekend:
http://www.darkchallenge.com/decks.php?e=18

5 out of top 8 were Mardu Midrange. Top 4 + Winner (Fabrizio Anteri) were all playing Mardu Midrange.

Seems like we've hit peak Mardu in London.

RE the 4-colour, I actually agree with you guys. The thing I liked about the original Brad Nelson list was the gameplan of snowballing an early threat. The 4-colour is more like a classic midrange deck, lots of premium removal and big late-game threats. I'd rather be applying pressure early and only switching to a control plan to either wrong-foot an opposing midrange deck or if I'm against an aggro deck. I'm an aggro guy at heart and want to be smashing face as plan A.

I'm thinking about going the other way and playing Craig Wescoe's 2-colour RW tokens deck. I've started testing on MTGO and deck is really fun to play. Am happy to do a primer if folks are interested.

[Zooligan]

I'm thinking about going the other way and playing Craig Wescoe's 2-colour RW tokens deck. I've started testing on MTGO and deck is really fun to play. Am happy to do a primer if folks are interested.

Heck yeah. More is better with decklists and primers.

[Purp]

Wescoe has a primer on tcg. The RW token deck can't beat control.

[eldub]

I didn't mean to derail the conversation here, but LD is likely correct in that the Mardu list is pretty fixed and a *very* solid contender for best deck in the format. I personally think Wingmate Roc is solid in the list but honestly any of our 5 drops are pretty interchangeable.

Brad's 4-color 'good stuff' list is indeed a closer cousin to Abzan than Mardu. It's likely not quite as strong/consistent as either one over a long GP weekend, but is certainly powerful and can win shorter events like FNM and/or IQs if piloted well. It has the highest density of powerful threats in the format and will out-topdeck anyone in the room if they don't get run over by agro early. That's one of the reasons I've added Sorin to the list above to provide a bit of lifegain cushion.

The mana base is not any more painful than Mardu (3 confluence / 6 fetch / Courser vs 5 pain / 4 fetch) nor does it have many hiccups in my initial playtesting. With a Courser or Caryatid in play it's a joke how easy the mana becomes and having 8 top-deck shuffle-type effects let's you influence your draws a ton. One interesting tidbit from my first foray with the list is that Sarkhan has felt even stronger in the 4-color setup as you often have quite a few blocker to protect him. My gut tells me this will become a Rhino + Superfriends deck as people begin to tune it a bit more. Butcher is not nearly as powerful without Rabble/Outburst.

[dauntless268]

IDK, I find this "finished deck" concept rather disturbing - it seems hard to imagine that any top deck can't be tweaked in reasonable ways. This is especially true with well known Tier 1 decks and with a Meta that's constantly adapting like the current one.

Mind you that Chessplayers have managed to find strong innovations in the opening theory even after thousands and thousands of games had been played.

Look at for instance Zem and MDU playing burn last season - that was an impressive display of constant innovation and adaptation. If I stick with an unchanged deck for a longer period of time it's because it's easier to learn and master how to play for an average player like me, not because I believe it can't be improved anymore.

Keep on surprising your opponents!

[Toblakai]

I think Brad was dicking around with that 4-color list, you know, just to see who would copy his idea.

[poppa_f]

Dauntless: I think "finished" in this context means the core deck (lands, major cards) is finished; same as burn was, some cards are mandatory 4-ofs (YP, phoenix, burn spells) and then you have a few flex slots + sideboard for tweaking vs current meta. If you look at the top 8 I posted, the 5 Mardu decks are consistent across 65-70 odd cards, but then have small variations. It was the same with that SCG open where some decks had Elspeth main, some had Wingmate vs Stormbreath Dragon etc, but bulk of deck is the same.

Purp: I've not played against control yet, I'm not too worried about that match up as hardly anyone plays it in my local meta. I agree that it is a terrible match-up, I think the only way you could win is to get chain some outbursts and stokes to try and goldfish them and pray they don't draw any Bile Blights.

[Zooligan]

I think Brad was dicking around with that 4-color list, you know, just to see who would copy his idea.

Just dicking around into the top 8 of a SCG Open!

Of course, he might be the caliber of player who could make his way into the top 8 with a pile of coupons clipped from the Sunday paper...

[Lightning_Dolt]

What I mean when I say finished is that the hive mind has found the optimal 75. There are a few flex slots you can play with to adapt for local meta, but other than that, you are just playing a worse version if you stray from the normal 75.

That of course, only holds true if the meta does not shift.

[Lightning_Dolt]

One such shift that punished me last weekend is people sideboarding more enchantment hate to better deal with Ascendancy and our Chains taking the splash damage. What I wouldn't do for Go for the Throat, Dismember, Path or the opposite of Ultimate Price.

I got caught 3 times in two sideboarded games where the line of play was:

Chain your Rhino, Reclamation Sage your Chain, ETB triggers again...

FFFFFUUUUUUUUUUUUUUU!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Also played against a guy who had 12 sideboard cards, just for us. Well played, but how do you beat anything else?

[dauntless268]

So he surprised you, huh?

Thanks for explaining. I think maybe my difficulty is your definition of "Deck" then. Which deck is finished? Mardu? Or Mardu Midrange? Or the Mardu Midrange Variant that plays a certain 55 cards? I guess you see where this is getting...

Quite honestly, I'd rather agree with Brian Kibler's latest SCG article where he considers Mardu as a deck that has a fascinating variety of variants how you can build it.

[Lightning_Dolt]

I can agree with that.

It's not that I was surprised as much as it was him having Sage each and every time I cast Chain. I suppose I was a little surprised to see Sage over Erase.

I think maybe we just have to accept the risk, since we need premium removal desperately.

[dauntless268]

Just played an 8-man and won the finals against Shaheen Soorani. Was chatting with him after the match: He said he beat Mardu Midrange 3 times at the open and thought it was a very good matchup for him (apptly he's got some new SB tech to make the matchup even better...)

EDIT: Semifinals was vs. Brad Nelson's new 4-colour midrange. Not really convinced about that deck but I can see how it may have an edge over some of the other midrange decks

[Christen]

My list hasn't changed much with UB or rogue blue-based control decks being the hardest matchup. Any attempt to increase the win rate game 1 hurts my other matchups so it's a necessary sacrifice and just hope to win game 2 and 3.

[deck]
Creatures
3 Seeker of the Way
4 Goblin Rabblemaster
4 Butcher of the Horde
2 Wingmate Roc

Spells
3 Chained to the Rocks
4 Lightning Strike
2 Anger of the Gods
4 Hordeling Outburst
4 Crackling Doom
1 Murderous Cut

Planeswalkers
2 Sorin, Solemn Visitor
2 Sarkhan, the Dragonspeaker

Lands
4 Nomad Outpost
2 Caves of Koilos
2 Temple of Silence
3 Temple of Triumph
3 Battlefield Forge
4 Bloodstained Mire
1 Swamp
6 Mountain

Sideboard
2 Erase
2 Thoughtseize
3 Read the Bones
1 Anger of the Gods
2 Chandra, Pyromaster
1 Utter End
2 End Hostilities
2 Elspeth, Sun's Champion
[/deck]

I'm looking at going to 3 Thoughtseize and 2 Read the Bones in the board. I'm still checking if I can afford cutting 1 Hordeling Outburst in the main.

[Lightning_Dolt]

Just played an 8-man and won the finals against Shaheen Soorani. Was chatting with him after the match: He said he beat Mardu Midrange 3 times at the open and thought it was a very good matchup for him (apptly he's got some new SB tech to make the matchup even better...)

EDIT: Semifinals was vs. Brad Nelson's new 4-colour midrange. Not really convinced about that deck but I can see how it may have an edge over some of the other midrange decks

What deck was Soorani on?

[Lightning_Dolt]

My list hasn't changed much with UB or rogue blue-based control decks being the hardest matchup. Any attempt to increase the win rate game 1 hurts my other matchups so it's a necessary sacrifice and just hope to win game 2 and 3.

[deck]
Creatures
3 Seeker of the Way
4 Goblin Rabblemaster
4 Butcher of the Horde
2 Wingmate Roc

Spells
3 Chained to the Rocks
4 Lightning Strike
2 Anger of the Gods
4 Hordeling Outburst
4 Crackling Doom
1 Murderous Cut

Planeswalkers
2 Sorin, Solemn Visitor
2 Sarkhan, the Dragonspeaker

Lands
4 Nomad Outpost
2 Caves of Koilos
2 Temple of Silence
3 Temple of Triumph
3 Battlefield Forge
4 Bloodstained Mire
1 Swamp
6 Mountain

Sideboard
2 Erase
2 Thoughtseize
3 Read the Bones
1 Anger of the Gods
2 Chandra, Pyromaster
1 Utter End
2 End Hostilities
2 Elspeth, Sun's Champion
[/deck]

I'm looking at going to 3 Thoughtseize and 2 Read the Bones in the board. I'm still checking if I can afford cutting 1 Hordeling Outburst in the main.

Do you find is awkward with Anger and Rabble in the main?

[Christen]

It's awkward when you really have to pull the trigger, but usually that comes up when your Rabble or Seeker is in a position where they can't attack anyway. Main deck anger is mainly because of GB decks appearing left and right in our local meta (plus a good amount of aggro).

[dauntless268]

The Esper Control Deck that he took to a second place at SCG Richmond.

[Self Medicated]

Mardu midrange takes first place at GP San Antonio.

[Lightning_Dolt]

Having trouble finding coverage.

[Lightning_Dolt]

Knew we'd get there eventually.

[DXI-Edge]

I won my local Prestige Tournament with the following list, now looking forward to the PreTQ coming up on Saturday:

[deck]
3 Seeker of the Way
4 Goblin Rabblemaster
4 Butcher of the Horde
2 Ashcloud Phoenix
2 Stormbreath Dragon

1 Sarkhan, the Dragonspeaker
2 Sorin, Solemn Visitor

3 Chained to the Rocks
4 Lightning Strike
2 Stoke the Flames
4 Crackling Doom
4 Hordeling Outburst

2 Battlefield Forge
4 Bloodstained Mire
3 Caves of Koilos
6 Mountain
4 Nomad Outpost
1 Swamp
2 Temple of Silence
3 Temple of Triumph

Sideboard
2 Magma Spray
1 Glare of Heresy
2 Anger of the Gods
2 Read the Bones
2 Chandra, Pyromaster
1 Utter End
1 Erase
2 End Hostilities
2 Elspeth, Sun's Champion
[/deck]

The deck felt incredible and I felt almost unwinnable all day. Lost to an Abzan deck with Raksasha Deathdealers and Bow of Nylea. Had to Utter End the Deathdealer to live, and didnt board in Erase so Bow of Nylea gained him like 15 life and made a Courser survive stoke.

Other than that, was insane all day. Stoke the Flames and Ashcloud Phoenix both won me games I had no right winning.

[Lightning_Dolt]

[deck] RYAN SCULLIN - WINNER, GRAND PRIX SAN ANTONIO 2014[/deck]

[Lightning_Dolt]

Guessing he dodged Ascendancy? Zero copies of Erase...

[Self Medicated]

Having trouble finding coverage.

http://magic.wizards.com/en/events/coverage/gpsna14

[Lightning_Dolt]

Then again, 3x Thoughtseize + Glare might be ok. I still think Erase > Thoughtseize because your lifetotal matters in that match up, but hey, I've never won a GP with this or any other deck.

[Christen]

It's a good thing he didn't face the Whip deck. I'm sure it would have been ugly.

[DXI-Edge]

His deck is poorly built and many pros agreed with that.