[Primer] UR Delver

[zemanjaski]

I 4-0'd a small event with 3 Dig Through Time; the conclusions everyone has been reaching are obviously true: there's a tipping point where selection is better and which card you should choose depending upon your consideration of at what turn that point occurs; if you feel Cruise comes online at 4 but Dig at 6; then Cruise is much better ~ but if you think it's like Turn 4 vs Turn 4.5; well then the high power ceiling of Dig is worth consideration.

Two other factors:
- Dig *can* better preserve your GY
- Dig is only good if there's a large difference on power between the cards in your deck ~ the more homogenous your deck is the weaker Dig is; but after sideboard it typically operates at the height of it's power

Games do slow down after SB much of the time however.

TLDR:
Slow meta ~ dig
Fast meta ~ cruise

[zemanjaski]

Oh, for a laugh, my embarrassing SB for the next round of the Melbourne Modern League:

3 Dispel
4 Dragons Claw
1 Electrickery
4 Flame Slash
1 Negate
2 Vedalken Shackles

Potential opponents (x-1 to undefeated):
- 3 Burn
- 5 Delver
- 1 Scapeshift
- 1 Affinity
- 2 Zoo

Flame Slash is a concession to Zoo; makes that MU WAAAAYYYY better.

[Valdarith]

That board is hilarious.

[Sasky]

TLDR:
Slow meta ~ dig
Fast meta ~ cruise

I have to disagree with this. The meta doesn't matter - we are a fast deck in terms of filling the gy so the difference between cruise and dig is negligible. You could even argue that Dig comes online faster because it only requires delve-6.

Just some food for thought about your sb (I understand that it's not really a serious sb on your part, but just my 2 cents regarding some of the cards for people trying to build a sb):

I found the burn matchup pretty ok without dragon claws. I played 10 post-board matches with my burn opponent after our game and I won all but one game (where I did not draw any threat). The key to winning this matchup is to land YP and then counter and kill stuff. My sb plan was -3 Remand -1 Eletrolyze + 2 Negate +1 Dispel +1 Counterflux.

You might want more negates than dispels considering that you have a scapeshift opponent.

Izzet Staticaster is better than Electrickery imo.

[zemanjaski]

I think the best thing about Dig is that the deck can easily support 3 and Snapcaster, which is just great.

[zemanjaski]

I don't know why I said meta (not enough sleep); it's the pacing of your deck ~ Dig suits the slower versions that are happy to draw go much better.

[zemanjaski]

Wrapter says Dig Through Time and no Swiftspear.

[DXI-Edge]

Hm....

I guess its time to play Dig Through Time tomorrow. Imma try 3 over Treasure Cruise.

Where did you hear him say that?

[DXI-Edge]

So thinking of playing this tomorrow:

[deck]
4 Delver of Secrets
4 Young Pyromancer
4 Snapcaster Mage

4 Lightning Bolt
1 Burst Lightning
1 Pillar of Flame
1 Electrolyze
2 Vapor Snag
4 Remand
2 Mana Leak
2 Spell Snare
1 Spell Pierce
4 Serum Visions
4 Gitaxian Probe
3 Dig Through Time

5 Island
1 Mountain
4 Steam Vents
4 Scalding Tarn
4 Polluted Delta
1 Bloodstained Mire

Sideboard
1 Electrickery
3 Magma Spray
2 Dispel
2 Blood Moon
1 Negate
1 Counterflux (may cut this for a vandal blast)
2 Dragon's Claw
1 Vandal Blast
1 Combust
1 Vedalken Shackels
[/deck]

Any other changes?

I am listening. I need to win this tourney tomorrow, I wanna prove my worth here!

Sideboard plans (not set in stone obviously)

vs. Mirror
-2 Mana Leak
-2 Vapor Snag
1 Electrickery
2 Dispel
1 Vedalken Shackels

vs. Affinity
-4 Remand
-2 Vapor Snag
1 Vandalblast
1 Vedalken Shackles
1 Electrickery
3 Magma Spray

vs. Burn
-2 Vapor Snag
-4 Remand
1 Counterflux
2 Dispel
2 Dragon's Claw
1 Negate

vs. Pod
-4 Remand
-2 Vapor Snag
-1 Spell Pierce
3 Magma Spray
2 Blood Moon
1 Vedalken Shackels
1 Electrickery

vs. Jund
-1 Forked Bolt
-2 Vapor Snag
2 Blood Moon
1 Vedalken Shackels

vs. Splinter Twin
-1 Electrolyze
-1 Pillar of Flame
-2 Vapor Snag
-1 Burst Lightning
2 Dispel
1 Counterflux (if i cut for vandal blast, keep in the electrolyze)
1 Combust
1 Negate

vs. UWR Control
-1 Pillar
-1 Electrolyze
-2 Vapor Snag
-1 Burst Lightning
2 Dispel
1 Negate
1 Combust
1 Vedalken Shackles

vs. Jeskai Ascendancy
-1 Pillar of Flame
-1 Electrolyze
-2 Vapor Snag
2 Dispel
1 Negate
1 Electrickery

vs. Scapeshift
-1 Electrolyze
-2 Mana Leak
-1 Pillar of Flame
-2 Vapor Snag
2 Dispel
1 Negate
1 Counterflux
2 Blood Moon

vs. RG Tron
-2 Mana Leak
-1 Pillar of Flame
2 Blood Moon
1 Negate


vs Mono Blue Tron
-2 Vapor Snag
-2 Mana Leak
-1 Pillar of Flame
2 Blood Moon
2 Dispel
1 Negate

[zemanjaski]

Hm....

I guess its time to play Dig Through Time tomorrow. Imma try 3 over Treasure Cruise.

Where did you hear him say that?

Team picnic.

[DXI-Edge]

-_- you so funny

How are Austrailian Picnics. I want some Kangaroo meat

EDIT: Found the picnic

[zemanjaski]

Deck looks fine to me.

[DXI-Edge]

I kind of want to play Smelt so I can have instant speed artifact removal, but I think Vandalblast is just better

(I want the 2nd piece of hate just to make it easier, Affinity may be popular tomorrow)

[Sasky]

You should play smash to smithereens as your 2nd affinity hate as there is an emergence of decks, especially zoo, that play chalice on one to shut us out.

Also, it is pretty much necessary to play one sulfur falls so that you don't auto-lose to choke.

[DXI-Edge]

So cut a Steam Vents for a Sulfur Falls?

[Sasky]

Yes, 3 steam vents and 1 sulfur falls.

[zemanjaski]

I understand the want for a Sulfur Falls, but it gives you a higher mulligan rate (because you can't keep 1 land sulfur falls, absolutely can keep 1 land steam vents). I'm terrible at math; but I believe that's relevant 1 in 40 games ~ up to you whether that's important.

I've considered going down to 4 Island and adding a Steam Vents to really to really solidify hitting RR. I also want a Desolate Lighthouse. I'm an extremely greedy person it seems.

Thank you to Sasky and DXI-Edge for backing me up on Sally!

[zemanjaski]

Current list:

[deck]UR Delver[/deck]
Creatures
4 Delver of Secrets
4 Snapcaster Mage
4 Young Pyromancer

Instants
2 Burst Lightning
3 Dig Through Time
2 Electrolyze
4 Lightning Bolt
2 Mana Leak
4 Remand
1 Spell Pierce
3 Spell Snare

Sorceries
4 Gitaxian Probe
4 Serum Visions

Lands
4 Flooded Strand
5 Island
1 Mountain
1 Polluted Delta
4 Scalding Tarn
4 Steam Vents
[/deck]

[Mr. Metronome]

ooh, I like the look of that. I ended up losing in the quarters of my tournament yesterday, I'm going to get around to typing up a report tonight hopefully.

[DXI-Edge]

I think you should cut a blue fetch for a red fetch.

Helps keep your life total high and you need more red sources in my experience

[DXI-Edge]

Our lists are the exact same except I have one less snare and one less electrolyze for 2 Vapor snag but other than that it's exactly the same

[DXI-Edge]

Oh and 1 less burst lightning for 1 more pillar for the pod matchup since it's so popular here

Edit: I also hate how stupid the salvation forum is on the UR Delver forum

[zemanjaski]

They don't understand data or logic which makes discussion difficult.

[Jack]

Why do you still bother? Is it that important to get the zemanjaski brand out there?

[Calamity]

Oh and 1 less burst lightning for 1 more pillar for the pod matchup since it's so popular here

Edit: I also hate how stupid the salvation forum is on the UR Delver forum

fixed that for ya

Current list, it's pretty close to what I've been seeing around here
[deck]Creatures 12
4x Delver of Secrets
4x Young Pyromancer
4x Snapcaster Mage

Sorceries 8
4x Serum Visions
4x Gitaxian Probe

Instants 21
4x Lightning Bolt
2x Burst Lightning
2x Spell Snare
2x Vapor Snag
1x Spell Pierce
4x Remand
2x Mana Leak
3x Dig Through Time
1x Electrolyze

19 Land
3x Steam Vents
3x Scalding Tarn
3x Misty Rainforest
1x Arid Mesa
2x Flooded Strand
1x Sulfur Falls
1x mountain
5x island[/deck]
The sulfur falls is a concession to the fact that some people play choke around here. I also only have 3 tarns, obviously need to get another one and replace the mesa with it.

SB is under construction but it's probably going to have the usual suspects. My local meta for modern is sort of random and it's difficult to predict what people are going to be playing, but recently the only things I've seen consistently the last couple weeks are twin and burn, so I'm gonna have 2 combusts and 2 [card]dragon's claw[/card]s at least. There's been some more delver too.

I want to try Izzet Staticaster over electrickery since it's reusable, since I only run one electrolyze so I think i can afford it mana curve wise.

Also, do you guys think something like batterskull is reasonable for the sideboard in grindier games, against stuff like UWR midrange? DTT lets you find it even as a singleton, and I can see games going long vs. a deck like that, and batterskull can help keep you out of reach from their burn. I know 5 mana is a lot for this deck, but I've had games where i get up to that much mana (hell that's why i have burst lightning, it does get kicked sometimes) Though I'll be packing dispel and negate for that matchup, and probably blood moon too. I dunno, just a thought.

Related to the UWR question, Geist of St. Traft is a card that has killed me more than once at my shop, are there any reasonable SB cards that deal with him? I honestly can't think of any besides pyroclasm besids just blocking but we're very creature light, so sometimes you just don't have a blocker. A resolved YP$ is obviously very good but sometimes you don't have enough time to get him out to make tokens while being able to leave up protection.

[zemanjaski]

Batterskull has seen play before and is always a consideration. It's retardedly OP.

Staticaster is awkward in the mirror when you run exactly the same creatures. You can only play around this so much.

The solution to GoST is to remember it's a card and/or blood moon them.

[Sasky]

Re. Sulfur Falls: The mulligan rate is 1 in 40. It's a pretty good rate, considering the amount of times it will save you the 2 life or 1 life you would pay for a second untapped land to hold up mana leak/remand.

Re. MTGS: Bunch of idiots. I gave up arguing with them. I don't bother with posting a list or tournament reports there as I don't even want to benefit people visiting that site.

Re. Zem's list: I don't think 3 spell snare is necessary, though you would know your meta better than mine (I always build with an open meta in mind). Snare is almost a complete blank in certain matchups (twin, pod, living end, tron, hatebears and merfolk when they land vial etc.), and that hurts. I am personally running a 1/1 md/sb split.

I personally prefer forked bolt to electrolyze, as it allows you to have the same effect and go t1 delver/visions, t2 countermagic, t3 YP + forked bolt or any other sequence involving YP. 3 mana is a lot in this deck.

Re. Calamity's qn's: All the sb options you have listed are reasonable choices. There's no real way to kill geist without hurting our game plan (anger of the gods). Your best bet is to always hold up countermagic for him or a snapcaster mage to block him (or race).

And my own updated list:

[deck]Creatures:12
4 Delver of Secrets
4 Snapcaster Mage
4 Young Pyromancer

Spells:29
2 Burst Lightning
2 Forked Bolt
4 Gitaxian Probe
4 Lightning Bolt
1 Pillar of Flame
4 Serum Visions
1 Spell Pierce
1 Spell Snare
2 Vapor Snag
2 Mana Leak
3 Remand
1 Electrolyze
2 Dig Through Time

Lands:19
1 Arid Mesa
4 Flooded Strand
4 Island
1 Misty Rainforest
1 Mountain
4 Scalding Tarn
3 Steam Vents
1 Sulfur Falls

Sideboard:15
1 Dispel
2 Magma Spray
1 Spell Snare
1 Vandalblast
2 Combust
2 Negate
1 Smash to Smithereens
2 Blood Moon
1 Counterflux
1 Izzet Staticaster
1 Batterskull[/deck]

[zemanjaski]

Why do you still bother? Is it that important to get the zemanjaski brand out there?

Believe it or not I do try to be helpful.

[zemanjaski]

Snare is mega gas vs Twin!

[zemanjaski]

Living End / Merfolk / Hatebears are byes anyway.

[Sasky]

Fair enough.

[DXI-Edge]

I also actually like it vs. pod. I counter voices all day everyday.

It's scary how similar our lists are. Is this as close to optimal as it gets? O.o

[DXI-Edge]

I went 4-1-1 today, then my burn opponent scooped to me in the final so I would get more points for our player of the year thing, and we split credit (he was on treasure cruise burn).

Played Pod 3 times, drew with burn, beat burn, and lost to grixis control to a misplay game 1 that didn't matter (probably) because I drew 12 of my 19 lands but it might have so I'll just say I lost to misplay, and game 3 I just didn't draw a counterspell off my dig to counter his dig. Oh well. Still did well and I get to make an elemental token with my face on it

From the pod games I played, both during the tourney and testing for top 4 it's unlosable if they don't draw pod.

[Jack]

I think snare is one of our best cards for game 1, considering it's one of our only ways to stop goyf on the draw and 80% of counterspells you see cost 2 mana. It's also a card that pretty much nobody will play around game 1, since doing so gives up a huge amount of potential tempo.

[DXI-Edge]

I'm also sticking with my 3 dig through times. Card is nuts

[zemanjaski]

I've had a few moments of "Dig, get Snapcaster and Dig, lament the foolishness of life"

[zemanjaski]

Delver wrecks Pod yeah.

[zemanjaski]

The feels when your mtg idol contacts you to discuss deck theory.

[Jack]

Who's your idol? I know you really only choose to give praise to those you feel truly have a gift for the game, so this is probably huge news.

[Sasky]

I am assuming Michael Jacob?