[Primer] UR Delver

[zemanjaski]

Sure, but they are inherently different cards. Keranos doesn't stabilize a board and I think I am more in the market for that in this shell now.

[Jack]

I'm in agreement with that statement. Keranos is sweet, but you often need to wait until you have countermagic backup for him, and by that point, it's sometimes too late to be investing in something that can't block or gain life.

[zemanjaski]

Keranos is to wreck the midrange decks which could out attrition you ~ now we have U: draw 3 for those decks which is crushing.

[zemanjaski]

Remember, I am in the middle of testing, I know nothing; also different meta and playstyle etc etc

[LP, of the Fires]

I was gonna be against Skull>Keranos, but like z said, Cruise, etc. etc.

[zemanjaski]

They're both good, keep your meta in mind.

[LP, of the Fires]

Anyone feel brave enough to test monastery swiftspear?

I don't think it's the threat that fits modern as a format, but it's a brand new card, so it could end up being awesome and with it's ability, it's pretty reasonable to see people just not blocking it ever.

[Platypus]

It was good enough for Legacy this weekend: http://sales.starcitygames.com//deckdat ... ckID=73431

But Legacy is another beast entirely.

[Valdarith]

It doesn't work too well with the counterspells in the deck. Beyond that, this deck just likes playing at instant speed anyway. I know some people have considered Goblin Guide here like the Legacy list but it ultimately fell out of favor due to the playstyle of this deck and the nonbo with Leak. I do think that, much like Peezy, it's a build-around card that is worth exploring. Maybe we could go REALLY deep like the Legacy list and run a more proactive deck that fills the yard quickly and casts lots of Treasure Cruise?

[LP, of the Fires]

My list has the full playset of cruises which is already 12 cantrips, so if you can't killing stuff with bolts during my turn, that's about enough triggers to be reasonable. It's not a big stretch to go further into adding a flame slash and a forked bolt or 2.

I agree that it would be a different deck as it would be much more aggressive, but I like that it would have more proactive 1-mana plays. The deck seems like it loses mostly do to not having enough threats. Once you have something in play, you can really start to apply the pressure.

[Valdarith]

Maybe something like this?

[Deck]
Creatures (14)
4 Delver of Secrets
4 Monastery Swiftspear
4 Young Pyromancer
2 Snapcaster Mage

Spells (28)
4 Gitaxian Probe
4 Serum Visions
1 Thought Scour
4 Lightning Bolt
2 Pillar of Flame
1 Forked Bolt
2 Spell Snare
3 Mana Leak
4 Remand
3 Treasure Cruise

Lands (18)
4 Scalding Tarn
2 Flooded Strand
2 Misty Rainforest
1 Polluted Delta
4 Steam Vents
1 Mountain
4 IslanD
[/deck]

[Valdarith]

I was thinking of Flame Slash as a one of. Seems really good against Goyf and Courser and the deck doesn't mind Sorcery speed with Swifty.

[LP, of the Fires]

[deck]4 Monastery Swiftspear
4 Delver of Secrets
3 Young Pyromancer
2 Snapcaster Mage

4 Serum Visions
4 Treasure Cruise
4 Gitaxian Probe
1 Thought Scour
4 Lightning Bolt
1 Burst Lightning
1 Flame Slash
2 Forked Bolt
3 Mana Leak
3 Remand
2 Spell Snare

4 Scalding Tarn
4 Misty Rainforest
4 Steam Vents
4 Island
1 Mountain
1 Flooded Strand[/deck]

Yeah, Basically the same thing. This deck looks good to me. I don't know the archetype well enough to fully understand what's gained or lost, but this looks very good.

[LP, of the Fires]

Did some testing, swiftspear is also insane.

Not treasure cruise levels, but arguably better then delver in a lot of spots.

[Purp]

Did some testing, swiftspear is also insane.

Not treasure cruise levels, but arguably better then delver in a lot of spots.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yqyixwqiCag

say waaaaa

[Calamity]

Treasure Cruise and Swiftspear have made me want to play this deck again. I've been playing scapeshift but my local meta isn't too soft to it. This deck seems insane now with fucking ancestral recall (with threshold) basically, and swiftspear looks promising. Not sure what to cut for her though, looking at the lists you guys have been posting.

My initial thought is cutting some snappys and lavaman mainboard. Snapcaster mage is insane, but with treasure cruise he isn't quite as vital for CA since we have cruise now.

[Valdarith]

Just look at LP's and my list to start.

I have yet to test but I'm interested in whether or not 4 Cruise is too deep.

[zemanjaski]

I'm going to test Swiftspear but I don't think it has the support available in legacy (obviously). Modern is also more creature focused; but still, better to actually play with the card.

I *think* you can get away with 3 cruise, after playing more games. They chain pretty well.

[LP, of the Fires]

Also after playing with my list a little bit, I feel that you can't play 4 cruise without 2 scour. I also think that if you're playing swiftspear, you want pillar of flame since you're gonna have less room to counter pods creatures for instance and you want more burn spells anyways with your more aggressive list.

[Valdarith]

That was my observation regarding Pillar as well. Flame Slash too.

[LP, of the Fires]

Flame slash being able to kill a goyf seems very good. Not sure if I'd play it over forked bolt though. It's possible that bolts only good against decks I'm strong against anyways, but I like that it goes to the face.

[zemanjaski]

Vapor Snag at sorcery speed seems pretty great if you're on the Swiftspear plan.

[LP, of the Fires]

I thought about vapor snag. It is nice that it's unconditional and resets snapcaster mages.

[zemanjaski]

Anyway, current list for testing tonight;

[deck=UR POWERFUL WIZARDS!]
Creatures
4 Delver of Secrets
1 Grim Lavamancer
4 Snapcaster Mage
3 Young Pyromancer

Non-Creature Spells
2 Burst Lightning
1 Electrolyze
4 Gitaxian Probe
4 Lightning Bolt
3 Mana Leak
4 Remand
4 Serum Visions
1 Spell Pierce
3 Spell Snare
1 Thoughtscour
2 Treasure Cruise

Lands
1 Flooded Strand
5 Island
4 Misty Rainforest
1 Mountain
4 Scalding Tarn
4 Steam Vents

Sideboard
2 Blood Moon
1 Combust
1 Counterflux
1 Dispel
2 Grim Lavamancer
3 Magma Spray
1 Negate
2 Spellskite
1 Treasure Cruise
1 Vedalken Shackles
[/deck]

Trying out some new cards. In particular I didn't like the 10th fetch and the second thoughtscour becauseoif running out of fetchable lands and too low impact respectively; I felt slightly removal
light too so opted for an Electrolyze over a 10th cantrip. SB is w/e, take what you like and adjust to your meta.

[Jack]

That main 60 is a work of art.

[Jack]

That KTK Island that shows up in card fetcher now is damn beautiful. It'll be a good 6 months.

[Jack]

The Mountain is pretty nice as well.

[Valdarith]

I thought about vapor snag. It is nice that it's unconditional and resets snapcaster mages.

Yeah, I think we're at the point with a Swiftspear list that the one damage is relevant while also bouncing fatties late on the curve. I know I've loved the card in my old lists for its versatility. I've also rebought Snapcaster a few times which was awesome. It even acts as a pseudo-counterspell to removal.

It could just be correct to jam in as many one-mana spells as possible and run all four Treasure Cruise with 2-3 Thought Scour and 0-1 Snapcaster Mage. The Legacy list that won the Open ran 0 Snapcaster but 1) it's Legacy, and ain't nobody got time for Snapcaster, and 2) they get to run Chain Lightning.

Can't wait to test more.

[LP, of the Fires]

its more along the fact that legacy has daze and brainstorm which means you don't need to every draw more lands in your delver deck.

[LP, of the Fires]

Since you're actively shuffling them away and resetting your land count.

[Valdarith]

Yeah, basically running 8 Ancestral Recall is kind of a big deal.

[zemanjaski]

That main 60 is a work of art.

Ty

Just wish I were a better player.

[zemanjaski]

3-1'd, Treasure Cruise was very impressive. Maindeck was fine, SB as usual ~ change for your meta!

[Zooligan]

That main 60 is a work of art.

if me maths are correct, that main 60 is actually 61...

[zemanjaski]

Yeah, incorrectly wrote 4 young Pyromancer.

[Kaitscralt]

That main 60 is a work of art.

if me maths are correct, that main 60 is actually 61...

lol

[Zooligan]

Yeah, incorrectly wrote 4 young Pyromancer.

I was wondering what the extra was. Do you plan on recording any matches with this deck once Khans is released on MTGO? I'd really like to see how this deck plays out.

[zemanjaski]

Seems likely, there's been a huge amount of interest from the Spikes community.

[Calamity]

The Delver archetype is probably one of the spikiest archetypes in the game since it's really strong and requires you to make correct decisions to win consistently

[Jedi]

Have any of you tested/considered Illusory Angel? Having played quite a bit of UR Delver (I've since switched to RUG Delver), I can tell you that having a 4/4 Flyer is pretty huge. I think the Angel fits nicely with this shell since there are so many 1cmc spells in it. That being said, throwing a Gut Shot or 2 in the mix is tech that most people aren't expecting and makes the Angel easier to cast as well. Basing off Z's list, I'd probably try dropping Grim Lavamancer and either Electrolyze or a Spell Snare for a pair of Angels. Thoughts?

P.S. I'm glad to see you guys talking about Treasure Cruise too! I've been excited to try it with Delver since I cracked it at the prerelease.