[Primer] Boros Burn

[Guttler]

The Rabble Red match can often come down to your ability to play around Rubblebelt Maaka.

The worst thing you can do is let them declare attack and then try to burn an attacker only to let them blow you out withGiant Growth.

I recommend you add the following phrases to your arsenal when playing paper magic:

1. "In combat, before you attack,..."
This works wonders if they only have 1 creature or 1 relevant creature and the other is not as important. Just burn their attacker before they even attack and deny them the ability to bloodrush or if they opt to, it wont be as a way to protect their important creature and they'll just be giving the boost to a less important creature that you are set up to handle.

2. "I declare no blocks."
Always use this if you have no creature in play. [Obviously, if you have creatures in play to block
with you'll want to say "Go to blocks?"] If you aren't able to stop them from swinging with several relevant creatures and your field is empty you can put the play on them. If they have Maaka or [card]Titan's Strength[/card] they now have the last opportunity to use it, if they don't and you pass priority it'll be damage step with the numbers locked in. If they do decide to Maaka, you can blow them out with burn in response to 2 for 1 them.

Obviously, they can try to next level you by predicting you'll burn before damage and pass priority assuming you're going to burn and then Maaka in response, but then the ball is entirely in your court if they try this.

You can either:
1.) try to burn now and hope they don't have Maaka, which may be pretty likely because they passed priority to you with no effects when you declared no blocks. [Sometimes you will have to hope they don't have it to try and stabilize with enough life.]
2. You can just pass and go to damage
with their numbers locked in and deny them the opportunity to Maaka. [Sometime it's better to take more then you need to on an early swing like this to deny the blowout possibility.] You still have burn that you can play EoT to kill a creature without the threat of Giant Growth and the next turn starts the same combat dance, except this time you may be able to just mop up their other creatures making Maaka entirely irrelevant.

[magicdownunder]

Question:

Would you bring in [card]Wear // Tear[/card] vs U Devotion? If so would you rather bring in Deicide knowing that current U Devo decks run 1/1 Hall MD/SB?

[BlakLanner]

I would if I expected Domestication. They board out the Bident and often the Hall against Burn. I would rather have Deicide in that matchup to make Thassa go away for good.

[NotARobot]

So tomorrow is SCG Open DC, I'm expecting insane amounts of rabblered because the cards it uses are sold out everywhere.. Can you guys give me any suggestions to really shore up the matchup? Is dancer too slow in the sideboard for it?

[BlakLanner]

Dancer works pretty well but they do have removal for it so it can't be your only plan. I have been liking the Raise the Alarm tech in that match up. Other good options are Chains and Searing Blood.

[dauntless268]

Dancer is nothing more than a stopgap solution to Rabble Red if you don't have enough room in your SB. If you don't need to run dancer, you absolutely should try to control Rabble postboard, by boarding in a mix of cheap removal and CA engines (such as Chandra or Flamespeaker) for your Lava Spikes

If you want a true secret weapon in the MD against Rabble, give Raise the Alarm a try, because no one knows about it yet and it is insanely good in stopping early aggression. Another very good option either for MD or SB is Flames of the Firebrand.

Other than that, read LP's post and you have the best inside info you will ever get. Good luck!

[Guttler]

Question:

Would you bring in [card]Wear // Tear[/card] vs U Devotion? If so would you rather bring in Deicide knowing that current U Devo decks run 1/1 Hall MD/SB?

The way I prefer to play that match is via grinding. So I'd only consider bringing in a card like W/T if I was taking out all my Skullcracks and Boros Charms, but didn't have enough removal spells in the board to directly side in. I don't have this problem with my current board againt mono U, it's a clean 8 out 8 in; but if you did W/T can at least impact the board and deny them some devotion which Crack and Charm cannot. [I'm still on the Flamespeaker plan. PFS can run away with the game against mono U.]

The only W/T
targets against monoU are Hall and Bident for artifacts and Domestication and Bident for enchantments. Deicide can take out every single copy of Thassa in one swoop and also hit Domestication and Bident. The thing is that both cards seem very limited in use, you're either siding in a card that you play in the board for other matches against mono U because you have nothing better or you're going to try and side in the anti-god card against the best god deck just to improve that match.

It may be worth trying to add more Banishing Light to the board if you mono U is surging on MODO. Always happy to see an extra out for Master of Waves and it can nab Thassa regardless of their devotion.

[dauntless268]

Good point, Guttler. I agree Hall can be a problem for us but BL is an appropriate answer while being a good card in its own right.

[LP, of the Fires]

If you want beat rabble red, don't play firedancer, play Chandra and three drops. Reckoner and flamespeaker both work.

Don't ever burn creatures In combat. If you actively play around maaka, they'll eventually just hard cast it. Alternatively, if you tap out on your turn for whatever reason, expect to get maaka'd.

Also, don't play Dancer. That shit well get killed the in response to burn and your lightning strike becomes a lava axe.

[NotARobot]

Chandra? Really? I feel like she will eat a stoke and then get ripped apart by something

[pikachufan2164]

Chandra? Really? I feel like she will eat a stoke and then get ripped apart by something

You need to have some board presence before playing Chandra, so that you have some creatures to protect her with. She's good at shooting down X/1 creatures, and works best when you've exhausted their hand (by that time, both players are close to being on topdeck mode) -- this gives you more opportunities to gain card advantage with her 0 ability, while poking away X/1 creatures with her +1 ability.

[magicdownunder]

I agree with LP and dauntless268 - dancer is horrible vs Rabble Red (they're good vs U, W and G) so don't use them unless you have no other option.

@NotARobot: If Chandra is being Stoke you just gained yourself 4 life and most likely another turn which is an achievement on its own, that said she works best with once you've exhausted your opponents hand.

[LP, of the Fires]

For you to pay Chandra, you have to have four mana in play. I imagine that you've been nuking dudes up to that point.

Chandra is broken in this matchup because both of her abilities read: draw a card and when she gets stoked, that's like drawing anywhere between a half and two cards depending on the game state.

[dauntless268]

Not to mention all the x/1s she can eat...

[Guttler]

I've been running into variants of a G/W/x Chord of Calling deck in my local paper meta. I've seen both Naya and Bant versions. Here is a decklist for the Naya deck: http://tappedout.net/mtg-decks/09-08-14-naya-chord/

I've had extreme frustration playing against this deck with R/W burn. It plays MD Trostani and AAoT which it can get with Chord. I've always tried playing the control game against them post board, dropping the 8 'player only' burn spells for 6 more removal and 2 W/T; but they always seem to come out on top. The hardest part of playing the grind game is that they always Chord for the lone Reclamation Sage which makes your chains weak.

Anyone else have experiences playing against a deck like this?

[pikachufan2164]

I've been running into variants of a G/W/x Chord of Calling deck in my local paper meta. I've seen both Naya and Bant versions. Here is a decklist for the Naya deck: http://tappedout.net/mtg-decks/09-08-14-naya-chord/

I've had extreme frustration playing against this deck with R/W burn. It plays MD Trostani and AAoT which it can get with Chord. I've always tried playing the control game against them post board, dropping the 8 'player only' burn spells for 6 more removal and 2 W/T; but they always seem to come out on top. The hardest part of playing the grind game is that they always Chord for the lone Reclamation Sage which makes your chains weak.

Anyone
else have experiences playing against a deck like this?

Haven't played this match-up before, but Hushwing Gryff embarrasses their creature line-up by turning off ETB triggers. Glare of Heresy is good here, as is Mizzium Mortars. Boros Reckoner attacks through early Caryatids and Coursers while holding off ground attacks later.

This particular deck seems very durdly and dependent on getting either ramp or defensive bodies to make it through the early game. If you can take care of the early Elves and Coursers, that puts you at an advantage. It will take a long time before they will be able to Chord out a finisher; the CMC+3 cost is prohibitive and lends itself only to grabbing utility creatures.

[HK1997]

Chandra is a powerhouse in the rabblered matchup.

Best case scenario: She takes completely over because he is already in top decking mode.

T4 scenario: She hits the board, eats two spells. I had a second to follow up once and both at high life totals, he conceded then and there. Knowing he took a gamble and ended up "wasting" 6dmg on a PW

Worst case: She has no impact on the outcome at all that only anger of the gods can save you or overloaded mortars. But every card has this issue.

[NotARobot]

Shoot, not gonna be able to make the open today after all

Thats disappointing. Hopefully someone else reps burn!

[magicdownunder]

Revisiting old tech: Mr Eidolon of the Great Revel

The last time I tested this cards I felt that it wasn't cutting the cookie vs Jund Monsters and Bx Devotion, for those who were (and still are believers in Mr Eidolon) would you recommend him against Jund Walkers (because Monster is all but dead) and/or B Devo / BW Devo?

I still think its bad because those list can just cast fat cards and ignore it (heck they can use it against you by ignoring). . .

[NotARobot]

I feel like he was always good vs all Bx variants. Not sure about walkers - they run caryatids and coursers which just stop him from swinging in, and the majority of their spells are 4 cmc + right?

[Toddington]

All of their interaction is 3 or less, if they aren't casting removal spells, they aren't taking damage off Eidolon. I guess they start Duress'ing after board? I like Eidolon out of Rabble Red against Jund Walkers, but isn't their strategy against Burn to race with Nissa and Xenagos?

[dauntless268]

Isn't Eidolon as horrible vs. Jund Walkers as he is vs Jund Monsters?

[emx]

Eidolon is quite bad against Walkers. Their win conditions are above cmc 3, in Xenagos, and other walkers. While they have Coursers and Caryatid that negate Eidolon as a creature. They quite simply will rarely have any reason to bother with removing it, and it will then just hurt you, until you decide to trade it for a Satyr token.
The strength of Eidolon lies in them being unable to use a lot of non-removal spells before they remove Eidolon. Like Thoughtseize, Duress, Azorius Charm, Counterspells, etc. Walkers just don't play a lot of stuff like that. Some play a few thoughtseize and/or read the bones, and they do bring in Duress and Thoughtseize post board, but I still don't feel it is enough to justify playing him. Then again, I don't play Eidolon at all anymore, so I might be biased.

[sirzevo]

Just dropped at 0-3 from a very disappointing $5k tourney.

Match 1: MUD

Round 1: Ran specters and never saw Lightning Strike, Helix, or Stoke. Stuck on 3 lands and couldn't stablize. Round 2: Kept a 1-land hand and was stuck on 3 lands. Was greedy and lost because of it. 0-2.

Match 2: MUD AGAIN

Round 1: 2x Specters hit me hard. Got a Master out and couldn't keep up. Round 2: Chains took care of Master and a Specter. Burned him out. Round 3: Never saw Chains. Banished a Specter but then he threw down Master and couldn't deal with it. 1-2.

Match 3: Rabble Red splash white

I've never played this version. Round 1: Get too many creatures out. Titan's Strength a creature, I respond, trying to zap it, he throws a Maaka on it, game over. Round 2: Had a good amount of Chains and burn. Was able to keep the board stable. Round 3: Had a huge board presence and opponent is stuck on 2 lands. Turn before he killed
me I swung in while a Phoenix, 2 soldier tokens and 2 elemental tokens. He zapped Phoenix. As soon as the attack was over, I realized it was a terrible play. I was tapped out. He swung with two creatures, Maaka'ed one and Boros Charmed my face.

Some misplays, bad draws and missed lands drops. Terrible day. I hope everyone else is doing better.

[Midnight_v]

I feel like I only lose to MUD consistently . . . I've been not playing for about a month now but I feel like I'd like to hedge against that match-up.
I think next week depending on how Tom Ross does over at scg that's going to cause people to main-deck hate vs Rabble Red, thus more Mono-U in existence.
As I've been out for a while... are we good vs jund walkers? I've not had a chance to test it.
I THINK I saw MDU play against it, but I mean overall?

[sirzevo]

I've never had a problem against walkers, unless they draw god-hands and top deck like it's nobody's business.

[Whole]

After playing EotGR in Rabble Red, I'm solid on my position that it is bad in burn. People leave in enough removal spells versus Burn to stave off a few Phoenix hits, deal with Young Pyro ASAP, and take care of Mutavaults. (Usually because they have worse cards to take out anyway) Adding Eidolon doesn't strain their removal at all. All it means is that you might get 1-3 more Phoenix or Mutavault hits in. In Rabble Red, it's excellent post board because their removal is extremely strained. And since we're playing a lot of "weak" cards, we can't afford to 1 for 1 against decks like mono black. We need card advantage in the form of Young Pyro, Phoenix, and Chandra to beat them.

[Jedi]

I haven't posted in here in some time as I haven't played Standard in probably two months (all Modern). There's a GPT tomorrow I'm planning on attending. Can anyone give me a solid decklist against an unknown meta? I watched MDU's latest videos and think the list seems pretty good. How has the Raise the Alarm testing been going?

[Midnight_v]

Chris Kemple is 7-0 scg right now. Playing vs U/W control.

Edit: Up 1 well played game 1.

[LP, of the Fires]

To everyone wanting to know how to play vs control, watch scg right now.

[NotARobot]

Managed to avoid the dreaded chain revs I always run into... this is gonna be a tough game 2/3 for him.

[Midnight_v]

Chandra ultimate.... my dick just exploded.

Didn't win, but don't see it very often tbs.

[dauntless268]

I actually think he played REALLY badly: Why on earth would you attack with a Mutavault in that situation???

EDIT: This is G2

[Whole]

I wish my UW control opponents would lead with Island-Mutavault-Island-Go to Discard

[NotARobot]

Well hes getting rewarded in game 3 Seth kept an abysmal hand. Can't believe he went for Chandra into island island mutavault, man.

[Midnight_v]

That was... an insanely terrible keep. Surprised. I just never count on my opponents to just punt like that.

He was certainly chock full of hate as well.

[dauntless268]

I'm not exactly sure what we learned from these games, LP....

[LP, of the Fires]

Idk, he played great game one, and fine game two.

Seth had a super greedy hand game three. I don't think it was wrong though. Just greedy. I've certainly argued with friends about those hands.

I would have mulled though.

[Midnight_v]

Idk, he played great game one, and fine game two.

Seth had a super greedy hand game three. I don't think it was wrong though. Just greedy. I've certainly argued with friends about those hands.

I would have mulled though.

I largely agree. Game 1 was very good. It was the iconic way that burn wants to play a match vs U/W/x control
G2... I'm not sure if there was anything Mr.Kemple could have done differently.
Terrible, that anyone walks away learning nothing from time spent.

Lastly... I hear MDU say it often "How greedy AM I?" some of that greed is needed.

[krose1313]

Burn into the top 8. I enjoyed watching but cringed at that Chandra being played in game 3. Wow.

Raise the alarm has been phenomenal in testing and I wanted to thank MDU for the recent video content.