[Primer] UR Delver

[Valdarith]

I probably don't need it with all the one mana Terminates in the 75. I was running a singleton Shattering Blow for Tron and it was a nice card to have.

[zemanjaski]

Well, EE is insane vs affinity too; but I have Mutavault to threaten a block on etched champion whereas you don't, so I think you're kicked in to 3-colour anyway. I'd shave a copy anyway though.

[PrimalBurn]

Just started playing your list online Z and I love it! Im a sucker for UR control but do feel the lack of pressure annoying at times. Seeing as you have more or less combined aspects of delver and control really interested me. Having access to quick pressure really helps in a lot of matchups where traditional UR might struggle. Keep up the good work!

[zemanjaski]

Thanks

[zemanjaski]

Feedback welcome.

[PrimalBurn]

I will say telling time is real sweet. A reprint of that would make my day

[PrimalBurn]

Just beat UWR in a grindy one. Used a spreading seas to cut him off of white when he only had a fountain out, not sure if that was correct. Always assume I need to hold on to seas as long as I can to snipe his manlands

[zemanjaski]

Yeah I like Telling Time more than Think Twice after playing with both.

Keeling him off white seems fine I really like playing UWR, it's very challenging.

[PrimalBurn]

This deck is really giving me a nice crash course in patience. Slow and steady does in fact win the race

[Mr. Metronome]

The two decks I'm playing the most on 'trice at the moment are UR Delver and the RUG list Reid Duke has been playing. I put together a post with my thoughts on the RUG deck in the Control section, though it plays pretty similarly to Zems UR list.

[zemanjaski]

This deck would be absurd with decent cantrips.

[zemanjaski]

Spreading Seas is better against a tiered meta. Stone Rain has a little more synergy with the rest of the deck, but is a 1-for-1 instead if an 0-for-1 which is incredibly relevant against UWR / Jund.

[PrimalBurn]

Just demonished a infect player talk about a one sided matchup, almost felt bad for the guy

[Jack]

Don't. Infect's games are pretty much always 1-sided.

[PrimalBurn]

Im liking Caleb Durwards UR Pyromancer list on his last legacy weapon article. Mainboard blood moon and batterskull...yes please

[Mr. Metronome]

Yeah that's the only YP list I dont mind the look of.

[zemanjaski]

Looks pretty reasonable. I was tinkering with 4 Delver, 4 Snapcaster, 4 Young Pyromancer in this sort of shell, perhaps I should revisit it. YP gives a reasonable Tarmogoyf impression when they don't just kill it.

[Mr. Metronome]

If you played it in your list what would your cuts be to make room?

I am still in the process of convincing myself not to play junk at my ptq, but now that it's an option it's hard to say no.

[zemanjaski]

I think you have to overhaul the deck a bit to accommodate YP (eg: 4 Probe, more 1 mana spells) so I couldn't say without testing.

[zemanjaski]

I'm thinking of cutting clique for a second electrolyze, or 3rd Lavamancer. If I go to three Lavamancer, id switch telling time for two thoughtscour. It's a meta thing; turn 1 Lavamancer is brutal vs any non-combo, non-UWR decks; it's particularly nice vs. Jund since if they don't answer it you'll brutalize their creatures (it makes Goyf very killable).

[zemanjaski]

Drawing two Lavamancer early can be awkward; but after thinking about it:
- if they can kill the first one, then you want a second
- if they can't, they just lose

That does leave combo decks where it's awkward but it's a bit if pressure game 1 and you can board some out game 2+. Combo is favourable anyway.

[Valdarith]

I've been debating 3 Lavaman main too for the reasons you laid out. I'd have to go to at least 8 fetches which is fine but it makes Serum Visions slightly less effective. I think he has a similar effect to Electrolyze while being cheaper and that's what this deck likes.

[zemanjaski]

I was thinking something like this:

4 delver of secrets
3 grim lavamancer
4 snapcaster mage

2 burst lightning
1 flame slash
2 Gitaxian probe
4 lightning bolt
4 mana leak
4 remand
4 serum visions
3 spell snare
2 thoughtscour
1 twisted image

1 arid mesa
5 Island
4 Misty rainforest
1 mountain
3 Mutavault
4 scalding tarn
4 steam vents

The flex slot is the 3rd Lavamancer, which could be the first electrolyze

[Valdarith]

I think the third Lavaman is just better in the main, especially with your mana being tied up in Mutavault.

[zemanjaski]

I agree. I really like the openings with a 1 drop and Lavamancer is a quality card. My curve is also ultra-low now too

[Valdarith]

Against all the decks where Lavaman is good he's absolutely ridiculous. He's only subpar in a couple of matchups. I'm really high on him.

[zemanjaski]

It tested well tonight; I ran the 3rd Lavamancer and two thought scour. Twisted image was very average; ill switch it for something else.

[Valdarith]

I want Twisted Image to be good but it seems too fancy. I'd swap for a third Probe.

[zemanjaski]

Probe / Sleight of Hand / Telling Time / Vapor Snag are reasonable. Running all 1-2 cost spells was great.

[Jack]

What made you settle on Thought Scour over Telling Time?

[Platypus]

Grim Lavamancer synergy, I guess.

[LP, of the Fires]

How good is the second burst lightning. I always see 2 and it just seems extra redundant with bolts, flame slashes and triple lavamancer.

[zemanjaski]

It's better than the first Flame Slash, easily. Against creature decks it's mostly always the same as Bolt and the 4dmg mode comes up surprisingly often.

Most importantly, it's cheap interaction against Pod / Affinity / Twin. I really like it as Bolt 5-6. I can appreciate the concern but I wouldn't cut a single copy.

[Valdarith]

Over time I've found the deck wanting at least six one mana kill spells and Burst Lightning is the best fifth and sixth card you can run. This deck thrives on cheap interaction and having more ways to do things on turn one is huge.

[zemanjaski]

I'm considering 19 land + 2 aether vial and some other small changes.

[Purp]

I'm considering 19 land + 2 aether vial and some other small changes.

This sounds exciting.

[rcwraspy]

I'm considering 19 land + 2 aether vial and some other small changes.

Hrm, not sure about Vial in an 11 creature deck. No real synergy with Delver flips, etc.

If flashing in at instant speed is what you're going for, I don't have a replacement.

But if it's the uncounterable aspect, Delver, Lavamancer, Snapcaster, and Clique are all Wizards (and all but Clique are Humans). Hello Cavern.

[zemanjaski]

I didn't end up trialling Vial; but fwiw the idea of vial is to generate mana advantage.

I ended up running:
4 Delver
2 Lavamancer
4 Snapcaster
3 Young Pyromancer

With 1 Lavamancer in the board. Felt pretty solid.

[rcwraspy]

I didn't end up trialling Vial; but fwiw the idea of vial is to generate mana advantage..

That makes sense.

[rcwraspy]

This was my first real Modern deck and I also built Jund/BG variants that I've been taking to larger events recently. I'm thinking of paying more attention to Delver again. I had tried a white splash for Geist and Helix. It has more straight punching power but lacks the late game grindiness of UR versions. I'm going to be picking this back up, I think. I've always had either 3 or 4 Pyromancer in it, but I'm going to be experimenting with no Pyromancers also.