[Primer] Devotion Red
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- Tyrael
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I'm testing it as a one-of with my playgroup today, then going to States on Saturday. Also testing Twinflame to see what kind of ETB/Nykthos/BTE shenanigans I can make happen. Also testing Eidolon of the Great Revel too, since I noticed some other people having success with it.Testing on Cockatrice confirms that Dictate is hella fun
dunno how viable it actually is though
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- Jasper
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I played Rb Devotion at States, and went 0-3 to start the day off. Ended up winning the rest to hit top64 and win a playmat, lol. Twinflame is just AMAZING. I really can't stress enough how much better Twinflame makes Red Devotion. Currently playing it as a 3-of, and people just never see it coming. This deck often operates as a combo deck, and Twinflame lets it all go off so much more often.
I'm testing the blue splash again now that it has the proper lands, and a new god. Keranos as a curve topper is pretty mean, and overloading Cyclonic Rift just never felt so good, now that Banishing Light is a thing.
Edit: Thoughts on Keranos vs Purphoros for red devo?
I'm testing the blue splash again now that it has the proper lands, and a new god. Keranos as a curve topper is pretty mean, and overloading Cyclonic Rift just never felt so good, now that Banishing Light is a thing.
Edit: Thoughts on Keranos vs Purphoros for red devo?
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Hey guys, some of the seasoned Red Devotion players may want to shout at me, but hear me out. Can we play Xathrid Necromancer in Rb Devotion lists? The core I'm proposing is;
[deck]
Creature (26)
4x Ash Zealot
4x Burning-Tree Emissary
4x Rakdos Shred-Freak
4x Prophetic Flamespeaker
4x Xathrid Necromancer
2x Purphoros, God of the Forge
4x Stormbreath Dragon
Land (25)
4x Blood Crypt
2x Rakdos Guildgate
4x Temple of Malice
1x Mana Confluence
10x Mountain
4x Nykthos, Shrine to Nyx
Sorcery (4)
4x Mizzium Mortars
Enchantment (1)
1x Hammer of Purphoros
Flex (4)
4 ???
[/deck]
Picking up; another Hammer, more Purphoros, Chandra, and/or Dreadbore in the flex slots.
The biggest issue I came across with this deck is not being able to keep dudes on the board. Necromancer gives some protection in this regard, as 2/
2's can pick up the beats. They obviously don't provide devotion, but this deck is better prepared to pressure the life total with haste guys. I'm trying to not to focus on the magic Christmas land scenario of Necromancer and Purphoros, going straight to the face after combat or a sweeper (but my god, how sweet is that?).
If this strategy was trying to be a thing before Journey, Flamespeaker is the final human that was needed. The 2CMC humans seem reasonable to play in this deck, though they do lend it to a more hasty, aggressive strategy; better against control, worse against blockers? 4 Mortars maindeck allows for some big pushes in board stalls. Notably Fanatic of Mogis is missing, but that card has good and bad matchups so I don't mind excluding it.
With regards to the flex slots, I'm not sure how all-in on Purphoros I want to go. I often don't want lots of the guy, but could see 3 if the synergy with Necromancer is legit. This core has more haste guys than
traditional Devotion, so I'm worried Hammers will be redundant. I get that they serve an important role in the grind, but this list seems happy about the grind anyway. Chandra seems like she could be important in forcing all the dorky 2/2's through. I'm not sure I want Dreadbore before Mortars, but I'm happy to run it as addition removal.
So, how off the rails have I gone?
EDIT: I've gone with an extra Purphoros, a Chandra, and 2 Dreadbore for initial testing.
[deck]
Creature (26)
4x Ash Zealot
4x Burning-Tree Emissary
4x Rakdos Shred-Freak
4x Prophetic Flamespeaker
4x Xathrid Necromancer
2x Purphoros, God of the Forge
4x Stormbreath Dragon
Land (25)
4x Blood Crypt
2x Rakdos Guildgate
4x Temple of Malice
1x Mana Confluence
10x Mountain
4x Nykthos, Shrine to Nyx
Sorcery (4)
4x Mizzium Mortars
Enchantment (1)
1x Hammer of Purphoros
Flex (4)
4 ???
[/deck]
Picking up; another Hammer, more Purphoros, Chandra, and/or Dreadbore in the flex slots.
The biggest issue I came across with this deck is not being able to keep dudes on the board. Necromancer gives some protection in this regard, as 2/
2's can pick up the beats. They obviously don't provide devotion, but this deck is better prepared to pressure the life total with haste guys. I'm trying to not to focus on the magic Christmas land scenario of Necromancer and Purphoros, going straight to the face after combat or a sweeper (but my god, how sweet is that?).
If this strategy was trying to be a thing before Journey, Flamespeaker is the final human that was needed. The 2CMC humans seem reasonable to play in this deck, though they do lend it to a more hasty, aggressive strategy; better against control, worse against blockers? 4 Mortars maindeck allows for some big pushes in board stalls. Notably Fanatic of Mogis is missing, but that card has good and bad matchups so I don't mind excluding it.
With regards to the flex slots, I'm not sure how all-in on Purphoros I want to go. I often don't want lots of the guy, but could see 3 if the synergy with Necromancer is legit. This core has more haste guys than
traditional Devotion, so I'm worried Hammers will be redundant. I get that they serve an important role in the grind, but this list seems happy about the grind anyway. Chandra seems like she could be important in forcing all the dorky 2/2's through. I'm not sure I want Dreadbore before Mortars, but I'm happy to run it as addition removal.
So, how off the rails have I gone?
EDIT: I've gone with an extra Purphoros, a Chandra, and 2 Dreadbore for initial testing.
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- Toddington
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- Jasper
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I personally see no extra strength in your list over regular Red Devotion, but I'm not going to try to shoot you down before you test it and post some results.
I will say however, that Propetic Flamespeaker lacks any synergy in your list, besides cute zombies when it dies and providing mediocre devotion. I suggest that if you are still going to stick with it, that you add in some instant speed burn. Lightning Strikes would let him take down X/4's in First Strike phase, and trample for 1 to net the virtual CA.
Ditch Anger of the Gods in the side. The collateral damage is even stronger now that you don't run Frostburn, and you need your stuff to not get exiled.
Here's a suggestion that goes for any Red Devotion list. At States I played Rb devo, and found that running 2 Devour Flesh in the side was extremely good. It's obviously good against Hexproof, but it is also EXTREMELY good vs RW Burn. Against RW, you are
mainly just looking to gain 4 life off of a Frostburn Weird, or you are saving yourself from Searing Blood. If you Devour in response to a Searing Blood on a X/2, you are effectively gaining 5 life, since you avoid 3 damage and gain 2 life. I didn't lose a single game to Burn where I Devour Flesh'ed myself in testing or at the event.
Later today after I eat I'll post the Ru list I'm currently testing.
I will say however, that Propetic Flamespeaker lacks any synergy in your list, besides cute zombies when it dies and providing mediocre devotion. I suggest that if you are still going to stick with it, that you add in some instant speed burn. Lightning Strikes would let him take down X/4's in First Strike phase, and trample for 1 to net the virtual CA.
Ditch Anger of the Gods in the side. The collateral damage is even stronger now that you don't run Frostburn, and you need your stuff to not get exiled.
Here's a suggestion that goes for any Red Devotion list. At States I played Rb devo, and found that running 2 Devour Flesh in the side was extremely good. It's obviously good against Hexproof, but it is also EXTREMELY good vs RW Burn. Against RW, you are
mainly just looking to gain 4 life off of a Frostburn Weird, or you are saving yourself from Searing Blood. If you Devour in response to a Searing Blood on a X/2, you are effectively gaining 5 life, since you avoid 3 damage and gain 2 life. I didn't lose a single game to Burn where I Devour Flesh'ed myself in testing or at the event.
Later today after I eat I'll post the Ru list I'm currently testing.
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[deck]
Creatures 24
4 Ash Zealot
4 Burning-Tree Emissary
4 Frostburn weird
4 Boros Reckoner
4 Fanatic of Mogis
4 Stormbreath Dragon
Enchantments 4
2 Purphoros, God of the Forge
2 Hammer of Purphoros
Spells 7
3 Twinflame
2 Cyclonic Rift
2 Turn // Burn
Lands 25
4 Nykthos, Shrine to Nyx
4 Steam Vents
4 Temple of Epiphany
2 Temple of Enlightenment
11 Mountain
Sideboard 15
2 Turn // burn
2 Essence Scatter
1 Cyclonic Rift
2 Magma Spray
1 Harness by Force
2 Mizzium Mortars
3 Negate
2 Keranos, God of Storms
[/deck]
Anyone have any thoughts on how my list looks? Sideboard could use some work, as I'm not sure what I really need whenever I run the blue splash. I'm not too sure that Keranos deserves the 2 sideboard slots, but it seems good in long games.
Edit: Chandra, Pyromaster kind of does everything I want Keranos to do in longer games. May just replace the god with her.
Creatures 24
4 Ash Zealot
4 Burning-Tree Emissary
4 Frostburn weird
4 Boros Reckoner
4 Fanatic of Mogis
4 Stormbreath Dragon
Enchantments 4
2 Purphoros, God of the Forge
2 Hammer of Purphoros
Spells 7
3 Twinflame
2 Cyclonic Rift
2 Turn // Burn
Lands 25
4 Nykthos, Shrine to Nyx
4 Steam Vents
4 Temple of Epiphany
2 Temple of Enlightenment
11 Mountain
Sideboard 15
2 Turn // burn
2 Essence Scatter
1 Cyclonic Rift
2 Magma Spray
1 Harness by Force
2 Mizzium Mortars
3 Negate
2 Keranos, God of Storms
[/deck]
Anyone have any thoughts on how my list looks? Sideboard could use some work, as I'm not sure what I really need whenever I run the blue splash. I'm not too sure that Keranos deserves the 2 sideboard slots, but it seems good in long games.
Edit: Chandra, Pyromaster kind of does everything I want Keranos to do in longer games. May just replace the god with her.
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BBD's Br list, from a newer SCG Premium article:
[deck]
B/R Devotion
Brian Braun-Duin
0th Place at Test deck on 5/29/2014
Standard
Creatures (26)
4 Boros Reckoner
4 Burning-Tree Emissary
4 Fanatic of Mogis
4 Frostburn Weird
4 Stormbreath Dragon
4 Eidolon of the Great Revel
2 Purphoros, God of the Forge
Lands (25)
10 Mountain
4 Blood Crypt
1 Mana Confluence
2 Rakdos Guildgate
4 Temple of Malice
4 Nykthos, Shrine to Nyx
Spells (9)
2 Hammer of Purphoros
3 Dreadbore
4 Mizzium Mortars
Sideboard
3 Underworld Cerberus
2 Dark Betrayal
2 Doom Blade
1 Ultimate Price
1 Hammer of Purphoros
2 Rakdos's Return
4 Thoughtseize
[/deck]
And an excerpt from the article:
"This card is brutal. It's pretty disgusting when your opponent can plop this guy down on turn 2 and you realize that you're just actually dead to it. For example, the above Dredge deck has serious issues with ever
beating this card, as I fully experienced when playing in a Magic Online daily.
Right now, I think the best deck to take advantage of the card is Red Devotion. While the Boros Burn decks also play the card, I feel like that deck is too much of a "known quantity" right now, which leads to people gunning to beat it. The Burn deck is best when it's unexpected and people aren't packing Bow of Nylea, Nylea's Disciple, Nyx-Fleece Rams, and all kinds of other cards to combat it.
Red Devotion, on the other hand, has essentially fallen by the wayside, but I think it could very well be good right now. I know players like Gerry Thompson and Michael Jacob have been experimenting with versions splashing black over white, and I like that general idea. The thought behind it is that Chained to the Rocks is much worse right now because of the presence of Abrupt Decay. People are also doing (not actually that) crazy things like maindecking Keening Apparitions, which makes me want to stay away from Chained
to the Rocks.
A black splash and a card like Dreadbore gives the deck the same capability to kill big baddies like Desecration Demon, but avoids the vulnerability to the plethora of enchantment removal that everyone is packing.
Underworld Cerberus is another card that I've seen Gerry and Michael talk about, and it seems like a great fit. The way games work with Red Devotion is that you are pretty much just always all-in. Each card in the deck builds off of each other to the point where the deck doesn't function that well if you slow-roll your threats. Cards like Supreme Verdict can easily be big blowouts for Red Devotion, but Underworld Cerberus lets you play into a Supreme Verdict with a big beater that's going to get you back all of your guys if it dies. Either they don't have it and you win, or they do have it and you can just immediately rebuild.
It's also a 6/6 that is hard to block, and it doesn't die to Doom Blade or Ultimate Price. This makes it an awesome threat against Mono-Black
Devotion."
[deck]
B/R Devotion
Brian Braun-Duin
0th Place at Test deck on 5/29/2014
Standard
Creatures (26)
4 Boros Reckoner
4 Burning-Tree Emissary
4 Fanatic of Mogis
4 Frostburn Weird
4 Stormbreath Dragon
4 Eidolon of the Great Revel
2 Purphoros, God of the Forge
Lands (25)
10 Mountain
4 Blood Crypt
1 Mana Confluence
2 Rakdos Guildgate
4 Temple of Malice
4 Nykthos, Shrine to Nyx
Spells (9)
2 Hammer of Purphoros
3 Dreadbore
4 Mizzium Mortars
Sideboard
3 Underworld Cerberus
2 Dark Betrayal
2 Doom Blade
1 Ultimate Price
1 Hammer of Purphoros
2 Rakdos's Return
4 Thoughtseize
[/deck]
And an excerpt from the article:
"This card is brutal. It's pretty disgusting when your opponent can plop this guy down on turn 2 and you realize that you're just actually dead to it. For example, the above Dredge deck has serious issues with ever
beating this card, as I fully experienced when playing in a Magic Online daily.
Right now, I think the best deck to take advantage of the card is Red Devotion. While the Boros Burn decks also play the card, I feel like that deck is too much of a "known quantity" right now, which leads to people gunning to beat it. The Burn deck is best when it's unexpected and people aren't packing Bow of Nylea, Nylea's Disciple, Nyx-Fleece Rams, and all kinds of other cards to combat it.
Red Devotion, on the other hand, has essentially fallen by the wayside, but I think it could very well be good right now. I know players like Gerry Thompson and Michael Jacob have been experimenting with versions splashing black over white, and I like that general idea. The thought behind it is that Chained to the Rocks is much worse right now because of the presence of Abrupt Decay. People are also doing (not actually that) crazy things like maindecking Keening Apparitions, which makes me want to stay away from Chained
to the Rocks.
A black splash and a card like Dreadbore gives the deck the same capability to kill big baddies like Desecration Demon, but avoids the vulnerability to the plethora of enchantment removal that everyone is packing.
Underworld Cerberus is another card that I've seen Gerry and Michael talk about, and it seems like a great fit. The way games work with Red Devotion is that you are pretty much just always all-in. Each card in the deck builds off of each other to the point where the deck doesn't function that well if you slow-roll your threats. Cards like Supreme Verdict can easily be big blowouts for Red Devotion, but Underworld Cerberus lets you play into a Supreme Verdict with a big beater that's going to get you back all of your guys if it dies. Either they don't have it and you win, or they do have it and you can just immediately rebuild.
It's also a 6/6 that is hard to block, and it doesn't die to Doom Blade or Ultimate Price. This makes it an awesome threat against Mono-Black
Devotion."
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I haven't really played against this deck. Just wondering what the strategy is with BTE. Say you have one in your opener, do you slow play it until you can chain a fanatic off of it, since otherwise you would just be wasting mana? If you have multiples in the opener I'm assuming you would just chain them on turn 2.
- Jasper
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1. No
2. Definitely no
The entire purpose of BTE is to get a free Nykthos activation. Playing it turn 2 is terrible, no matter how many you have. You are basically just looking to cast them on turn 3, when you have 2 lands and a Nykthos out, ideally. You'll also already have a 2-drop out from the previous turn such as a Frostburn Weird or Ash Zealot. This gives 4 mana for your turn 3, which will ideally go to a Fanatic or Purphoros.
2. Definitely no
The entire purpose of BTE is to get a free Nykthos activation. Playing it turn 2 is terrible, no matter how many you have. You are basically just looking to cast them on turn 3, when you have 2 lands and a Nykthos out, ideally. You'll also already have a 2-drop out from the previous turn such as a Frostburn Weird or Ash Zealot. This gives 4 mana for your turn 3, which will ideally go to a Fanatic or Purphoros.
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Unless you're trying to play around sorcery-speed removal, that makes no sense. if your ONLY 2-drops are BTE, you play them as early as possible. This doesn't happen often. But! BTE BTE on turn 2 is an attack of up to 4 and a Nykthos activation for 4 on turn 3, whereas BTE BTE on turn 3 is a Nykthos activation for 4 and no attack.
In summary, lead out other 2s then BTEs.
In summary, lead out other 2s then BTEs.
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- LP, of the Fires
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So let's talk about an interesting game. Game 2, vs. Mono-Blue on the draw. I keep triple burning tree, a mortars, land and dragon, turn 1 scry reveals nykthos. The game was interesting because I decided to do nothing for the first 3 turns of the game in the face of a 2/3 raptor, judges familiar, and frostburn weird to get the 3-for-1 off the mortars. I could have played BTE earlier, but I decided to hold them to play around rapid hybridization(sort of) and domestication.
I draw a magma spray which was great cause it meant I could off something if I needed to save life down the road but I maybe should have cast it on the bird when my opponents turn 4 was bident which makes my mortars less of a blowout.
Anyways, game actually ended up very close. The end board state was my opponent with master of waves and 4 tokens(plus 2 mutavaults) and cloudfin raptor(2/3) vs. my x bte and monstrous stormbreath dragon. I drew a mogis
warhound(experimental build) and had a tough choice.
Oppenents life: 8
My life: 12
The first choice is swing with dragon or bestow, swing with dragon. The bestow option is their because if I just swing, there's a chance my opponent just goes to 1 hoping I don't have it which leads me to casting mogis, entering chump everything mode and needing a live draw, where if I bestow, he HAS to block. I decide to not bestow since I didn't take long thinking about it and I figure if I attack confidently, he snap blocks(which happens) since he doesn't have quite have lethal and there's a number of cards that I can blow him out with for not blocking.
The next tougher choice is playing mogis as a blocker or holding it for lethal next turn. Doing the on board math, all my chump attacks leave me falling to 1 life and him needing to draw rapid, a flier, or cyclonic rift to win while also drawing ~3 cards from bident, but again, I'm better off hopeing he doesn't have it. He ends up peeling master of waves,
putting me to 1 on the swing and drawing islands.
Devo red for life
As far as that BTE argument, it all depends on the situation.
If you have no 2 drop, I just jam it most of the time. If I don't see a black land, I'll even just throw a bunch out there, depending on the context of my hand.
Or in the above game, I hoard them greedily for maximum value. Aodh's answer is a basic guidline and I'd default to that for all the newbies to the deck.
I draw a magma spray which was great cause it meant I could off something if I needed to save life down the road but I maybe should have cast it on the bird when my opponents turn 4 was bident which makes my mortars less of a blowout.
Anyways, game actually ended up very close. The end board state was my opponent with master of waves and 4 tokens(plus 2 mutavaults) and cloudfin raptor(2/3) vs. my x bte and monstrous stormbreath dragon. I drew a mogis
warhound(experimental build) and had a tough choice.
Oppenents life: 8
My life: 12
The first choice is swing with dragon or bestow, swing with dragon. The bestow option is their because if I just swing, there's a chance my opponent just goes to 1 hoping I don't have it which leads me to casting mogis, entering chump everything mode and needing a live draw, where if I bestow, he HAS to block. I decide to not bestow since I didn't take long thinking about it and I figure if I attack confidently, he snap blocks(which happens) since he doesn't have quite have lethal and there's a number of cards that I can blow him out with for not blocking.
The next tougher choice is playing mogis as a blocker or holding it for lethal next turn. Doing the on board math, all my chump attacks leave me falling to 1 life and him needing to draw rapid, a flier, or cyclonic rift to win while also drawing ~3 cards from bident, but again, I'm better off hopeing he doesn't have it. He ends up peeling master of waves,
putting me to 1 on the swing and drawing islands.
Devo red for life
As far as that BTE argument, it all depends on the situation.
If you have no 2 drop, I just jam it most of the time. If I don't see a black land, I'll even just throw a bunch out there, depending on the context of my hand.
Or in the above game, I hoard them greedily for maximum value. Aodh's answer is a basic guidline and I'd default to that for all the newbies to the deck.
You gotta understand, I love the beatdown. I really do. I always have.
Beatdown is hard, though.
Patrick chapin
Beatdown is hard, though.
Patrick chapin
- Jasper
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I played a couple games recently that had me feeling a lot better about Red Devotions matchup vs Mono Blue. I used to hate it, but now that I've gotten better as a player it doesn't seem too bad. Maybe not favored, but not too bad either.
There are so many factors that go into it that it's hard to really describe. On
the play, on the draw, if you're worried about Bile Blight/Detention Sphere. It also depends on what the rest of your hand looks like.
Correct.Unless you're trying to play around sorcery-speed removal, that makes no sense. if your ONLY 2-drops are BTE, you play them as early as possible. This doesn't happen often. But! BTE BTE on turn 2 is an attack of up to 4 and a Nykthos activation for 4 on turn 3, whereas BTE BTE on turn 3 is a Nykthos activation for 4 and no attack.
In summary, lead out other 2s then BTEs.
There are so many factors that go into it that it's hard to really describe. On
the play, on the draw, if you're worried about Bile Blight/Detention Sphere. It also depends on what the rest of your hand looks like.
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Jasper are you the same Jasper thAt posts on salvation and was recently trolled about bte? If yes then good job at explaining obv facts I however found one mistake in that post - you can respond to bte mana trigger to stop you from using nykthos, but it is only technical point.
Which version of this deck is best positioned right now? The mogiis/1 drops version or stock list?
Which version of this deck is best positioned right now? The mogiis/1 drops version or stock list?
Sig by NerdBoyWonder
- Jasper
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Haha yeah, that's me.Jasper are you the same Jasper thAt posts on salvation and was recently trolled about bte? If yes then good job at explaining obv facts I however found one mistake in that post - you can respond to bte mana trigger to stop you from using nykthos, but it is only technical point.
Which version of this deck is best positioned right now? The mogiis/1 drops version or stock list?
I personally am still sticking with the stockish list. I've tried the 1 drops version before in the past and I just don't think it's good enough. The only change is that Eidolon may have helped it, but I'm also still not using Eidolon since I don't like killing
myself faster than I kill them.
Frank Lepore playing RU Devotion:
http://magic.tcgplayer.com/db/article.asp?ID=11847
He makes mistakes as he doesn't really play this deck much, but it's still interesting. He's also using the splash that I prefer.
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This is my first time listening to him and I don't hate him but his video would be kind of useless without her demonstrating how he's...a moron? I couldn't restrain myself.I used to hate Leopre Vids, but the Detorra commentary makes it worth it now.
"I don't know what you just did there"
On a more constructive point, does devotion really have to keep in reckoner vs control? I guess hammers make it suck less.
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Reckoner isn't that great but there usually aren't that many cards out of the board to replace it, especially when you're alreadyThis is my first time listening to him and I don't hate him but his video would be kind of useless without her demonstrating how he's...a moron? I couldn't restrain myself.I used to hate Leopre Vids, but the Detorra commentary makes it worth it now.
"I don't know what you just did there"
On a more constructive point, does devotion really have to keep in reckoner vs control? I guess hammers make it suck less.
siding out Chained to the Rocks...
But yeah, Hammer just obliterates control
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Depends on what you have in your board.
When I play Devotion Boros, I used to have like, 13 cards to bring in vs. control between artifact destruction, walkers, boros charm(sometimes), etc.
When I play Devotion Boros, I used to have like, 13 cards to bring in vs. control between artifact destruction, walkers, boros charm(sometimes), etc.
You gotta understand, I love the beatdown. I really do. I always have.
Beatdown is hard, though.
Patrick chapin
Beatdown is hard, though.
Patrick chapin
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Hey Guys! My first post in this forum. I've been enjoying lurking for quite a while now, and have been profiting a lot from reading the discussion. I'm very excited about my take on Mono Red Devotion, so I thought I'd share it.
[deck]RedDevoWins[/deck]
So to explain where I'm coming from with this: We all know how powerful the RDevo nut draw is. However, the deck has numerous ways in which it can fizzle.
With the land count, you
have to choose between being flooded and running out of gas easily (bad) OR being stuck on 2 or 3 lands with clunky cards (very bad). Another Issue is drawing zero Nykthos or two of them together with Reckoner.
The deck also gets its "engine" easily picked apart by control decks UW/x and MBD/x. That makes those matchup far from optimal, which really is a shame for a red deck.
This version is an attempt to rely less on Nykthos and (as good as they are) clunky stormbreaths, to provide early pressure via zealot, eidolon and phoenix while maintaining potential for boatloads of damage in the midgame. Postboard, we get to lower our curve significantly, and behave much more like a sligh deck against the control decks (we can board out a nykthos too). All our lands etb untapped and they hate seing all the early creatures, especially when backed up by hammer and skullcrack.
Magma Jet seems to be a great card for this deck: Gets you to the crucial 4th land, and ships them away later. Very often you
will be looking for a big play from the top of your deck once you have spilled out your dudes. Being able to get rid of lands and weirds to find your fanatic/stormbreath/mortars two turns earlier seems invaluable. The last point also stands for Chandra, which seems to be at her best here. Invalidating a blocker is very relevant, and you usually want to cast most of the things you reveal with her. Both Jet and Chandra get your phoenix back. Magma Jet also lets you keep you marginal hands much easier (like mountain, nykthos into three drop).
It would be great to hear what other people think about this build. While it has felt really powerful so far, i haven't had enough time to test it thoroughly. How well do you think does it fare against the field? It's possible that losing 2 stormbreaths will hurt us against MonoBlue and Monsters. Otherwise I don't think those (mediocre) matchups change much, since burning trees didn't attack into weirds and caryatids before either. Obviously the deck hates to see
Courser in any opponent's deck, but we can at least attack with Reckoner, Phoenix, Weird and Fanatic.
edit: apparently i'm to dumb to format the deck, sorry for that. i copied the template from the FAQ, can someone help?
[deck]RedDevoWins[/deck]
So to explain where I'm coming from with this: We all know how powerful the RDevo nut draw is. However, the deck has numerous ways in which it can fizzle.
With the land count, you
have to choose between being flooded and running out of gas easily (bad) OR being stuck on 2 or 3 lands with clunky cards (very bad). Another Issue is drawing zero Nykthos or two of them together with Reckoner.
The deck also gets its "engine" easily picked apart by control decks UW/x and MBD/x. That makes those matchup far from optimal, which really is a shame for a red deck.
This version is an attempt to rely less on Nykthos and (as good as they are) clunky stormbreaths, to provide early pressure via zealot, eidolon and phoenix while maintaining potential for boatloads of damage in the midgame. Postboard, we get to lower our curve significantly, and behave much more like a sligh deck against the control decks (we can board out a nykthos too). All our lands etb untapped and they hate seing all the early creatures, especially when backed up by hammer and skullcrack.
Magma Jet seems to be a great card for this deck: Gets you to the crucial 4th land, and ships them away later. Very often you
will be looking for a big play from the top of your deck once you have spilled out your dudes. Being able to get rid of lands and weirds to find your fanatic/stormbreath/mortars two turns earlier seems invaluable. The last point also stands for Chandra, which seems to be at her best here. Invalidating a blocker is very relevant, and you usually want to cast most of the things you reveal with her. Both Jet and Chandra get your phoenix back. Magma Jet also lets you keep you marginal hands much easier (like mountain, nykthos into three drop).
It would be great to hear what other people think about this build. While it has felt really powerful so far, i haven't had enough time to test it thoroughly. How well do you think does it fare against the field? It's possible that losing 2 stormbreaths will hurt us against MonoBlue and Monsters. Otherwise I don't think those (mediocre) matchups change much, since burning trees didn't attack into weirds and caryatids before either. Obviously the deck hates to see
Courser in any opponent's deck, but we can at least attack with Reckoner, Phoenix, Weird and Fanatic.
edit: apparently i'm to dumb to format the deck, sorry for that. i copied the template from the FAQ, can someone help?
Last edited by MrPonsen on Fri Jun 13, 2014 2:17 pm, edited 2 times in total.
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[deck]Creatures:
4 Burning-Tree Emissary
4 Eidolon of the Great Revel
4 Frostburn Weird
4 Boros Reckoner
2 Prophetic Flamespeaker
4 Fanatic of Mogis
4 Stormbreath Dragon
Engines:
2 Hammer of Purphoros
2 Purphoros, God of the Forge
1 Chandra, Pyromaster
Removal:
2 Mizzium Mortars
2 Chained to the Rocks
Lands:
4 Nykthos, Shrine to Nyx
10 Mountain
4 Sacred Foundry
4 Temple of Triumph
2 Boros Guildgate
1 Mana Confluence
Sideboard:
2 Elspeth, Sun's Champion
2 Chained to the Rocks
2 Mizzium Mortars
1 Wear // Tear
1 Deicide
1 Chandra, Pyromaster
1 Banishing Light
3 Anger of the Gods
2 Reprisal[/deck]
PERFECTION BITCHES!
4 Burning-Tree Emissary
4 Eidolon of the Great Revel
4 Frostburn Weird
4 Boros Reckoner
2 Prophetic Flamespeaker
4 Fanatic of Mogis
4 Stormbreath Dragon
Engines:
2 Hammer of Purphoros
2 Purphoros, God of the Forge
1 Chandra, Pyromaster
Removal:
2 Mizzium Mortars
2 Chained to the Rocks
Lands:
4 Nykthos, Shrine to Nyx
10 Mountain
4 Sacred Foundry
4 Temple of Triumph
2 Boros Guildgate
1 Mana Confluence
Sideboard:
2 Elspeth, Sun's Champion
2 Chained to the Rocks
2 Mizzium Mortars
1 Wear // Tear
1 Deicide
1 Chandra, Pyromaster
1 Banishing Light
3 Anger of the Gods
2 Reprisal[/deck]
PERFECTION BITCHES!
You gotta understand, I love the beatdown. I really do. I always have.
Beatdown is hard, though.
Patrick chapin
Beatdown is hard, though.
Patrick chapin
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Will take a spin of this then[deck]Creatures:
4 Burning-Tree Emissary
4 Eidolon of the Great Revel
4 Frostburn Weird
4 Boros Reckoner
2 Prophetic Flamespeaker
4 Fanatic of Mogis
4 Stormbreath Dragon
Engines:
2 Hammer of Purphoros
2 Purphoros, God of the Forge
1 Chandra, Pyromaster
Removal:
2 Mizzium Mortars
2 Chained to the Rocks
Lands:
4 Nykthos, Shrine to Nyx
10 Mountain
4 Sacred Foundry
4 Temple of Triumph
2 Boros Guildgate
1 Mana Confluence
Sideboard:
2 Elspeth, Sun's Champion
2 Chained to the Rocks
2 Mizzium Mortars
1 Wear // Tear
1 Deicide
1 Chandra, Pyromaster
1 Banishing Light
3 Anger of the Gods
2 Reprisal[/deck]
PERFECTION BITCHES!
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The following list got me to 6-3 at my last $5k, and 4-0 at yesterday mornings FNM, and got me to top 8 at yesterday nights FNM. I feel like this is very solid right now. My sideboard was different at the $5k, and I feel like I could have top 8'ed there if I used the sideboard I have now.
[deck]
Creatures 29
4 Rakdos Cackler
4 Firedrinker Satyr
4 Ash Zealot
4 Burning-Tree Emmisary
3 Boros Reckoner
4 Chandra's Phoenix
4 Fanatic of Mogis
2 Stormbreath Dragon
Other Spells 8
2 Chandra, Pyromaster
4 Magma Jet
1 Twinflame
1 Lightning Strike
Lands 23
4 Nykthos
19 Mountains
Sideboard:
3 Skullcrack
2 Hammer of Purphoros
2 Mizzium Mortars
2 Anger of the Gods
2 Stormbreath Dragon
1 Harness by Force
1 Peak Eruption
1 Pithing Needle
1 Mutavault
[/deck]
The Pithing Needle is a varied slot. My first FNM location was more aggro heavy, so I had Elecktrickery in that spot. Second FNM was more
control and mono black.
[deck]
Creatures 29
4 Rakdos Cackler
4 Firedrinker Satyr
4 Ash Zealot
4 Burning-Tree Emmisary
3 Boros Reckoner
4 Chandra's Phoenix
4 Fanatic of Mogis
2 Stormbreath Dragon
Other Spells 8
2 Chandra, Pyromaster
4 Magma Jet
1 Twinflame
1 Lightning Strike
Lands 23
4 Nykthos
19 Mountains
Sideboard:
3 Skullcrack
2 Hammer of Purphoros
2 Mizzium Mortars
2 Anger of the Gods
2 Stormbreath Dragon
1 Harness by Force
1 Peak Eruption
1 Pithing Needle
1 Mutavault
[/deck]
The Pithing Needle is a varied slot. My first FNM location was more aggro heavy, so I had Elecktrickery in that spot. Second FNM was more
control and mono black.
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Need opinions of people that specialized in this deck (Looking at you LP and Jasper )
[deck]
Creatures (34)
1 Scuttling Doom Engine
1 Soul of New Phyrexia
4 Ash Zealot
4 Boros Reckoner
4 Fanatic of Mogis
4 Frostburn Weird
4 Generator Servant
3 Hoarding Dragon
4 Soul of Shandalar
4 Stormbreath Dragon
1 Purphoros, God of the Forge
Lands (24)
16 Mountain
4 Temple of Malice
4 Nykthos, Shrine to Nyx
Spells (2)
1 Hammer of Purphoros
1 Mizzium Mortars[/deck]
What I found interesting is a choice of 2 drops available now for this deck:
Frostborn Weird
Ash Zealot
Eidolon of the Great Revel
Burning Tree Emissary
Generator Servant
I think Generator servant can act as Nykthos 5-8, allowing casting Dragon on turn 3. It is also great BTE followup.
Hoarding Dragon Toolbox is interesting, it is huge flying beater
or 2 for 1 engine tuttoring: Hammer, Soul of the New Phyrexia and Scuttling Doom Engine. I like this idea.
Someone would have to tweek this deck thou, as I dont think having only 1 removal preboard is ideal.
Thoughts? LP / Jasper?
[deck]
Creatures (34)
1 Scuttling Doom Engine
1 Soul of New Phyrexia
4 Ash Zealot
4 Boros Reckoner
4 Fanatic of Mogis
4 Frostburn Weird
4 Generator Servant
3 Hoarding Dragon
4 Soul of Shandalar
4 Stormbreath Dragon
1 Purphoros, God of the Forge
Lands (24)
16 Mountain
4 Temple of Malice
4 Nykthos, Shrine to Nyx
Spells (2)
1 Hammer of Purphoros
1 Mizzium Mortars[/deck]
What I found interesting is a choice of 2 drops available now for this deck:
Frostborn Weird
Ash Zealot
Eidolon of the Great Revel
Burning Tree Emissary
Generator Servant
I think Generator servant can act as Nykthos 5-8, allowing casting Dragon on turn 3. It is also great BTE followup.
Hoarding Dragon Toolbox is interesting, it is huge flying beater
or 2 for 1 engine tuttoring: Hammer, Soul of the New Phyrexia and Scuttling Doom Engine. I like this idea.
Someone would have to tweek this deck thou, as I dont think having only 1 removal preboard is ideal.
Thoughts? LP / Jasper?
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Holly Guatamolly this deck doesnt run BTE I just read it. So Generator, BTE, what is 3rd best 2 drop?
Splashing black, white or blue for removal? (that Master of the Waves and Desecration Demon!) I think you need removal somewhere here. Why blue? Cyclonic rift, Izzet Staticaster + global turn to frog, Keranos, turn/burn. Why black? Dreadbore, Doom Blade, Ultimate Price. Why White? Banishing Light, Reprisal, Chain to the Rocks.
Splashing black, white or blue for removal? (that Master of the Waves and Desecration Demon!) I think you need removal somewhere here. Why blue? Cyclonic rift, Izzet Staticaster + global turn to frog, Keranos, turn/burn. Why black? Dreadbore, Doom Blade, Ultimate Price. Why White? Banishing Light, Reprisal, Chain to the Rocks.
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Blue and white are strong options right now since we have the painlands and can avoid a loss of tempo that way
The problem I have with blue is that the color has no really good way of getting rid of MoW, just the tokens...
Pedros, white also gives us Assemble the Legion which is a real trump card vs mono black
The problem I have with blue is that the color has no really good way of getting rid of MoW, just the tokens...
Pedros, white also gives us Assemble the Legion which is a real trump card vs mono black
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Isnt the most popular version of black splashing green? It might be even better now if they have BG Painland and Urborg.
That is why Assemble the Legion, Banishing Light and Chain to the Rocks werent as good as before.
White also gives Elspeth (I think LP used it in a sb for some time?)
We need our best devotion players to say something ;P
That is why Assemble the Legion, Banishing Light and Chain to the Rocks werent as good as before.
White also gives Elspeth (I think LP used it in a sb for some time?)
We need our best devotion players to say something ;P
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No, mono black without a splash is still the most popular version (top tier players like Owen Turtenwald are still advocating it)
this might change with the B/G painlands though, mind me
a good example: GP Chicago (http://www.mtgtop8.com/event?e=7647&d=243916&f=ST)
3 Mono Black Devotion
1 B/R Devotion
1 B/G Devotion
this might change with the B/G painlands though, mind me
a good example: GP Chicago (http://www.mtgtop8.com/event?e=7647&d=243916&f=ST)
3 Mono Black Devotion
1 B/R Devotion
1 B/G Devotion
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The only colors worth splashin imo are black and white since they give you the most efficient removal. White gives you the best mana with the pain lands and the most versatile(and biggest) sideboard cards.
Black Gives you a SWATH of removal options including the powerful dreadbore and Rakdos's return if you're in the market for that sort of thing.
I'm much less anti-black then I was before since I don't think you should care as much about the control matchup and there are enough tools to deal with the problems you'd face with the decline of detention spheres and such.
RE new cards worth adding to the main, I like Soul of shandalar a lot and generator servant not at all. All your 2 drops should be adding 2 red devotion. If you move away from nykthos, servant gets more interesting, but then you're building a different deck albeit with the same principles so it's probably worth exploring if you're interested.
n
Act of impulse is also a very interesting card as it digs towards more nykthos, and is pretty close to a draw three when you have a bunch of devotion in play which definitely happens in some matchups. I'm guessing that while the ceiling is high, that the floor is too low and the card is a very near miss.
Now as far as actually building the deck, regardless of which splash you like, I think the deck should go back to rakdos cacklers main with firdrinkers in the board because since picking the deck back up and experimenting with new cards, the black devotion matchup is a LOT harder then I remember it being and the 1 drop plan is very good against them. I want to say I like black devotion more since it's a lot better at killing a desecration demon, but the mana base of the white deck is so sexy now and playing more white sources without losing tempo is awesome.
I think to make room for cacklers and soul of shandalar, you have to shave a land, some removal and go down to 1 purphoros which all seems
fine. Purph isn't as good as he used to be and drawing multiples is basically the worst. Cutting removal isn't too big a deal since game one, everyone's generally just trying to play past each other and in that world, you only ever really want to draw 1 removal spell so having something like 2 chains, 2 mortars seems ok. I'd also probably cut down to 1 hammer main and 1 in the board since we're lowering the curve for the most part.
Pillar of light should absolutely be added to the board. It's more expensive then reprisal, but it can also hit courser which comes up once in a while. The monster matchup is basically a buy game one, then game 2/3 they board into a faster mono-black devotion with more desecration demons and having your offense stymied by a 2/4 is some BS.
Hope this helps. I may drop in later if I think of anything else particularly useful. Just remember; friends don't let friends splash blue in their red devotion decks!
Black Gives you a SWATH of removal options including the powerful dreadbore and Rakdos's return if you're in the market for that sort of thing.
I'm much less anti-black then I was before since I don't think you should care as much about the control matchup and there are enough tools to deal with the problems you'd face with the decline of detention spheres and such.
RE new cards worth adding to the main, I like Soul of shandalar a lot and generator servant not at all. All your 2 drops should be adding 2 red devotion. If you move away from nykthos, servant gets more interesting, but then you're building a different deck albeit with the same principles so it's probably worth exploring if you're interested.
n
Act of impulse is also a very interesting card as it digs towards more nykthos, and is pretty close to a draw three when you have a bunch of devotion in play which definitely happens in some matchups. I'm guessing that while the ceiling is high, that the floor is too low and the card is a very near miss.
Now as far as actually building the deck, regardless of which splash you like, I think the deck should go back to rakdos cacklers main with firdrinkers in the board because since picking the deck back up and experimenting with new cards, the black devotion matchup is a LOT harder then I remember it being and the 1 drop plan is very good against them. I want to say I like black devotion more since it's a lot better at killing a desecration demon, but the mana base of the white deck is so sexy now and playing more white sources without losing tempo is awesome.
I think to make room for cacklers and soul of shandalar, you have to shave a land, some removal and go down to 1 purphoros which all seems
fine. Purph isn't as good as he used to be and drawing multiples is basically the worst. Cutting removal isn't too big a deal since game one, everyone's generally just trying to play past each other and in that world, you only ever really want to draw 1 removal spell so having something like 2 chains, 2 mortars seems ok. I'd also probably cut down to 1 hammer main and 1 in the board since we're lowering the curve for the most part.
Pillar of light should absolutely be added to the board. It's more expensive then reprisal, but it can also hit courser which comes up once in a while. The monster matchup is basically a buy game one, then game 2/3 they board into a faster mono-black devotion with more desecration demons and having your offense stymied by a 2/4 is some BS.
Hope this helps. I may drop in later if I think of anything else particularly useful. Just remember; friends don't let friends splash blue in their red devotion decks!
You gotta understand, I love the beatdown. I really do. I always have.
Beatdown is hard, though.
Patrick chapin
Beatdown is hard, though.
Patrick chapin
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