Mono Black Aggro

[AcidPith]

My thoughts for post rotation:

[deck] Creatures:26
4 Gnarled Scarhide
4 Rakdos Cackler
4 Tormented Hero
4 Pain Seer
4 Herald of Torment
4 Master of the Feast
2 Mogis's Marauder

Spells:11
4 Thoughtseize
2 Bile Blight
2 Ultimate Price
3 Hero's Downfall

Lands:23
4 Mutavault
19 Swamp

Sideboard:15
2 Dark Betrayal
2 Duress
3 Doom Blade
3 Gift of Orzhova
3 Lifebane Zombie
2 Erebos, God of the Dead[/deck]

Are Mutavault not rotating? Or are they being reprinted?

[dpaine88]

you know what he meant,dick

[Tanro]

I think he means for when Jou becomes standard legal. Because cackler is rotating at the same time mutavault would.

[AcidPith]

I think he means for when Jou becomes standard legal. Because cackler is rotating at the same time mutavault would.

Oh ok. Thanks.

you know what he meant,dick

Really? I'm sorry if I offended you. I am a newer player and I was just asking. And no, I didn't know what he meant. I was confused, so I asked. Should I not ask questions? Was there some way in which I insulted you?

[kahmos]

This is my list

[deck]Creatures (28)
4 Gnarled Scarhide
4 Rakdos Cackler
4 Tormented Hero
4 Pain Seer
4 Brain Maggot
4 Rakdos Shred-freak
4 Spike Jester
4 Mogis's Marauder

Spells (12)
4 Thoughtseize
4 Boon of Erebos
4 Madcap Skills

Lands (20)
4 Mana Confluence
4 Blood Crypt
12 Swamp

Sideboard
4 Duress
4 Dark Betrayal
4 Skullcrack
3 ?
[/deck]

I am a little uncertain about brain maggot/pain seer/rakdos shred-freak, but overall I feel rocksolid about the rest of the list.
The final card in the 75 could be anything, not sure about it. Maybe Dark Prophecy over Marauder for control, I hate playing against control.

[Aodh]

Needs 5 mountains for your red spells.

[Lightning_Dolt]

5 is a little extreme, but at least 3.

[Aodh]

The Karsten article suggests 13 sources for 2-mana spells, and since Spike Jester and Madcap Skills like being cast on-curve, I'd oblige. But yeah, you're right, AT LEAST 3.

[Self Medicated]

Honestly, you don't need 20 black sources. You don't have anything that costs [mana]bb[/mana]. If you replace 5 swamps with 5 mountains, you'll have 15 black sources and 13 red sources, which should be perfectly fine for casting everything in your deck on curve.

[Aodh]

He'd want 19 for HDF, HoT, MoF if they end up in the list, then we need more lands or some temples. :\

[Jedi_Knight]

Not for HDF. If you're going Br, play Dreadbore over it.

[Self Medicated]

He'd want 19 for HDF, HoT, MoF if they end up in the list, then we need more lands or some temples. :\

Yeah, if they end up in the list you need at least 18 red sources to cast MotF. And Jedi is right. Dreadbore over Downfall all day.

[rcwraspy]

I think he means for when Jou becomes standard legal. Because cackler is rotating at the same time mutavault would.

Oh ok. Thanks.

you know what he meant,dick

Really? I'm sorry if I offended you. I am a newer player and I was just asking. And no, I didn't know what he meant. I was confused, so I asked. Should I not ask questions? Was there some way in which I insulted you?

haha I'm sure DPaine was just sticking up for a buddy. For people who have been playing through a few rotations, what LD said is looked past as a
simple typo and we all know what he meant by it. So if someone knows what it should mean and makes an issue out of it, they're being a little dickish for no real reason. I'm guessing that's where DPaine was coming from.

I understand how a newer player wouldn't know exactly how rotation works and/or what LD actually meant, and I'm sure DPaine didn't realize it was a sincere question.

Questions are fine in these threads but you need to have a thick skin. Things will get glossed over and/or shot down with relative frequency and bluntness. Especially in an established thread with good players who are tuning with a new set's cards.

On Topic:

I may be picking mono black aggro back up. I really enjoyed the last iteration of it (right when Born hit) but changes in the meta quickly outclassed the deck, imo. Now that we can run 12x 2-power one drops I think that puts the archetype right back on the map. Folks have mentioned a red splash. Any thoughts on a green splash for cards like [c:
3bbte9d5]Abrupt Decay[/c], Lotleth Troll, Dreg Mangler? Mangler probably doesn't make the cut with all the 3-drops but Troll gives you a little resiliency and something to do with late-game top-decks and Abrupt Decay is one of the better removal cards you can run. Green also allows for interesting SB choices.

[Lightning_Dolt]

I had a chance to jam some games with MBA between matches at FNM tonight (was playing burn in the event) and I really like the list I posted above. Master of Feasts was actually really good.

[dpaine88]

I think he means for when Jou becomes standard legal. Because cackler is rotating at the same time mutavault would.

Oh ok. Thanks.

you know what he meant,dick

Really? I'm sorry if I offended you. I am a newer player and I was just asking. And no, I didn't know what he meant. I was confused, so I asked. Should I not ask questions? Was there some way in which I insulted you?

My bad, took it the wrong way. Thought you were just being a prick about the exact way he worded it, saying "rotated" which in reality
nothing is rotating just a new set adding.

[ADarkConfidant]

This is my list

[deck]Creatures (28)
4 Gnarled Scarhide
4 Rakdos Cackler
4 Tormented Hero
4 Pain Seer
4 Brain Maggot
4 Rakdos Shred-freak
4 Spike Jester
4 Mogis's Marauder

Spells (12)
4 Thoughtseize
4 Boon of Erebos
4 Madcap Skills

Lands (20)
4 Mana Confluence
4 Blood Crypt
12 Swamp

Sideboard
4 Duress
4 Dark Betrayal
4 Skullcrack
3 ?
[/deck]

I am a little uncertain about brain maggot/pain seer/rakdos shred-freak, but overall I feel rocksolid about the rest of the list.
The final card in the 75 could be anything, not sure about it. Maybe Dark Prophecy over Marauder for control, I hate playing against control.

I think you're losing a lot of unnecessary life in this deck between Pain Seer, Boon, and Confluence.
nNot sure if this will work any good against Burn and other hyperaggro decks, as the less life-losey ones already have a tough matchup there.

Good luck, though.

[ADarkConfidant]

[deck]Creature (30)
4x Gnarled Scarhide
4x Herald of Torment
4x Lifebane Zombie
2x Mogis's Marauder
4x Pain Seer
4x Rakdos Cackler
1x Nighthowler
3x Thrill-Kill Assassin
4x Tormented Hero
Instant (7)
2x Bile Blight
3x Hero's Downfall
2x Ultimate Price
Land (23)
4x Mutavault
19x Swamp
Sideboard (15)
3x Doom Blade
4x Duress
4x Master of the Feast
4x Thoughtseize[/deck]

So I know I said that I'd run aggro again this week, but I had sooo much fun switching back to Black control after weeks of aggro."
However, I'm going to stick to my original plan and run aggro this Friday.
The list above is what I'll be using.
The 1 Nighthowler is because I still haven't been able to find a 4th Thrill-Kill Assassin. That card is great, so I don't blame them for being snatched up.

That's right, no mainboard thoughtseize anymore.
I don't think we'll need it.
Against U/W control decks I'll board in
+8 thoughtseizes( 4 seize and 4 duress ), and -2 Marauder, -2 Ultimate Price, -2 Bile Blight, -2 Thrill Kill.
Against Black control decks I'll board +4 Thoughtseize, +2 Duress, -2 Marauder, -4 Lifebane.
Against most creature based strategies, we'll board +3 Doom Blade, +4 Master of the Feats, -4 Pain Seer, -3 other cards (either Cacklers against blue devotion and green-based decks, hero's downfall against red,white and burn decks).

The strategy here is to apply tons of pressure, and do our best to ignore our opponent's strategy. Hand disruption will come in to take out sweeper effects, and removal to take out key creatures.
Master of the Feats can be a blowout against decks that can't remove/block him, making the game end quicker, when we've started late or have run into walls.

[NerdBoyWonder]

[deck]4 Gnarled Scarhide
4 Rakdos Cackler
4 Soldier of the Pantheon
4 Cartel Aristocrat
4 Pain Seer
2 Athreos, God of Passage
3 Master of the Feast
3 Herald of Torment
2 Mogis's Marauder

3 Orzhov Charm
4 Thoughtseize

4 Godless Shrine
2 Mana Confluence
2 Mutavault
2 Plains
9 Swamp
4 Temple of Silence

Sideboard
1 Deicide
3 Devour Flesh
2 Lifebane Zombie
2 Sin Collector
7 ???[/deck]

Originally was playing B/W Athreos humans but the synergy didn't have the power I was looking for in the deck. So now I hopped over to the Black Aggro deck that I had been keeping an eye on but still am forcing Athreos to see how powerful he really is.

Swapped Tormented Hero for Soldier of the Pantheon because he is really good. My back up 2 drop Cartel Aristocrat partly because she is a carry over from my humans deck but also initial testing she is a pain in the ass to get rid of for
control outside of a wrath. Went with a 3/3 split with Master of Feasts and Herald of Torment. Master of FATS played a lot better than I had expected but I am leery of giving my opponents any cards.

Regarding my sideboard it is designed to attack my local meta. Lifebane is moved to the side since green decks have gone to the way side locally with one person playing some form of green creature deck only. Upped my devour flesh to 3 because everyone is playing Blood Baron decks. Also have a player piloting Hexproof. Sin Collector is for the control match ups. Still have 7 slots and unsure exactly what I will fit in.

Still testing Athreos and may eventually cut him. So far in testing I have activated him or have managed to force my opponent to take damage. Going to record these instances to see if any of it attributes to winning. If the results are poor I may actually hop off white all together and go the Rakdos route that Purp has posted previously as it looks extremely powerful.

[accpi]

ran a gauntlet tonight trying to decide a deck for scg knox, i played BR aggro and burn.

br deck

[deck]
4 Cackler
4 Gnarled Scarhide
2 Tormented Hero
4 Spike Jester
4 Pain Seer
3 Mogis Waround
2 Mogis Marauder
3 Heral of Torment
2 Master of Feast

4 Lightning Strike
4 Thoughtseize
2 Dreadbore

4 Blo0d Crypt
4 Temple of Malice
3 Mana Conflux
2 Mutavault
9 Swamp
[/deck]

All I can say is wow...this deck was no joke. Resilient as hell.

What are you running SB?

[ADarkConfidant]

Got really sick this weekend. Didn't get to play. Sorry for the lack of report guys.
Maybe this week..

[InflatablePie]

Probably running something close to this at FNM for a while:

[deck]
4x Gnarled Scarhide
4x Rakdos Cackler
4x Tormented Hero
4x Brain Maggot
4x Pain Seer
4x Spiteful Returned
4x Mogis's Marauder
4x Herald of Torment

4x Thoughtseize
2x Ultimate Price
2x Hero's Downfall

20x Swamp

Sideboard:
2x Duress
2x Doom Blade
3x Dark Betrayal
3x Master of the Feast
2x Devour Flesh
1x Erebos, God of the Dead
1x Whip of Erebos
1x ???
[/deck]

No Mutavaults, running 20 land because in an FNM setting (4-5 rounds) I'd rather have extra threats than 1-2 land. It worked out for me the other week (last pre-JOU FNM). Also not splashing a second color yet because I'm waiting for Mana Confluence to drop a bit.

Might fiddle with the numbers a bit. Maybe take out a single Brain Maggot/Mogis's Marauder/Spiteful Returned (I prefer Marauder the most out of the group). Only running 2 Hero's Downfall due to 20-land,
but I did do alright with a full playset on 20-land so I could possibly add one more (or if I drop two creatures, could run a 2/2/2 split by adding something like Bile Blight). Also considering a singleton Boon of Erebos - it did lots of work when I was able to play it, notably against Sylvan Caryatid decks. Might be too cute.

Surprisingly not running any LBZ; don't feel like dropping the money for them in paper. 3 Dark Betrayal for mono-B/mirror, Doom Blade for an extra Terror effect, 2 Duress and an Erebos for control, 3 Master of the Feast and a Whip for aggro, Devour Flesh for Hexproof (could also be Away) and the last slot will be... something. Probably an extra Duress or Master. Could also add a random one-of like Nighthowler (Dredge is semi-popular at my LGS).

[LP, of the Fires]

Throwing my hat in:

[deck]4 Rakdos Cackler
4 Gnarled Scarhide
4 Spike Jestor
4 Mogis Warhound
4 Prophetic Flamespeaker
4 Herald of Torment
2 Exava, Blood Witch

3 Lightning Strike
2 Dreadbore
2 Bile Blight

4 Thoughtseize

4 Blood Crypt
4 Temple of Malice
4 Mana Confluence
3 Mutavault
4 Swamp
4 Mountain

3 Lifebane Zombie
4 Master of the Feast
4 Duress
1 Dark Betrayal
2 Ultimate Price
1 Doom Blade[/deck]

Decks pretty fucking powerful. I've done more testing though and I've started to access the weaknesses.

For 1, thoughtseize and lightning strike don't really go in the same deck. 1 says I'm fine playing a little longer because I can dismantle your gameplan while beating down, the other asks you to dedicate all you've got to killing the other guy. Tension.

Secondly, as good as master of the feast is against most green decks, he actually falls short vs. Jund monsters. It's pretty awful
that postboard they have abrupt decay's, putrefy's, and golgari charms. Not really much that can be done about that, but maybe vs. Jund I board in duress instead of master? Maybe not all four, but 2 and cut the 4th master for the 4th zombie, depending on how much burn and mono-blue you expect.

I'm only playing 8 1 drops because...I don't really know why? Ok, basically 1 drops are mostly bad so I only wanted to play the best ones. Scardhide obviously gets the nod, but what about cackler and tormented hero? Well, cackler has 2 toughness and hero has one. That's pretty much it. One can attack into frostburn weirds, elvish mystics, elspeth tokens, and YP tokens and the other one can't. Also, I have FNM promos of one, but not the other so tidebreaker.

About those 7 removal spells. It may or may not be too many but for now, it seems fine. Dreadbore is obviously great, strike is whatever, but bile blight is interesting. It's a double costed 2 drop which makes it reasonably difficult to cast, and it
doesn't actually kill 4 ass guys, but it sweeps up pack rat which is a thing and blows up Elspeth. Maybe it's fine, but I plan on testing downfall in that slot. Downfalls slower and more expensive, but I know exactly what it does which is nice for a deck which I only have a week to test.

Lastly, Prophetic flamespeaker. So far, this seems like the best shell for the card, since your naturally boosting his power with cards I'd already play and not jumping through hoops to make him good. 4 may be too many, but the affect is VERY powerful and the curves low enough that I usually cast everything that he sees which is obviously great value. Since the deck is dual colored, I'm not really looking to play mogis' marauders, so I don't know what other card I'd add to the deck. Probably a 3rd Exava to strengthen the curve.

Lp, out.

[Pedros]

I totally agree with you on thoughtseize and lightning strike. When I was playing Dos Packis while preparing for btg and ptqs I played it in md and someone (probably Z) said they are not very good in this kind of deck. I agreed with him after testing and removed them from md. Didnt look back.

Hell, this deck is so similar to dos packis (other the fact that deck used pack rats and chandra phoenixes) and its 1-5 curve.

Did you think about going slightly bigger? I mean the fact that you can use low impact low drops such as scarhide, warhound or demon for bestow is amazing.

Curve:

4 1 Drops
8 2 Drops
8 3 Drops (+4 bestow)
3 4 Drops (+4 bestow)
3 5 Drops (+4 bestow)

is quite solid and flexible. Basicly it makes you play 4/8/12/7/7 so the curve is quite strong.

When you run cards like pack rat you can use lategame topdecked 1 drops such as rakdos cackler. In this type of deck maybe going slightly bigger would
be an option? Especially when the format centers around eficient cheep roadblockers (YP tokens, specters, rams, caryatid, coursers).

In more midrange version you dont focus on killing opponent as fast as possible, so you can play stuff like thoughtseize to open ways for exava and dragons.

Question is if Prophetic Flamespeaker good in this shell?

[LP, of the Fires]

Flamespeaker means you can play from behind and gives you lots of live draws to kill people. Sometimes you're dead on board, then draw and bestow a hearald of torment for 8 damage. Other times, you kill a dude, connect, and draw removal to kill another dude buying a turn.

And yeah Pedros, I was thinking about going bigger. I didn't think of pack rat because I didn't like it in mono-black aggro, but I'm not completely opposed to the idea and I'm always down to give stormbreath dragon a whirl.

Cutting Cackles and Lightning strike gives me 7 slots to play with which probably goes to exava, a dragon or 3, and some combination of pack rats, land and removal.

[Pedros]

I have to fetch my last Dos Packis list from RB thread, however we discussed removal suite to some extend and agreed on good combination of burn / dreadbores / hero's downfalls. However that amount of burn might not be needed when we dont have phoenix anymore.

Remember U devo was running rampant at that time, that is why we decided on downfall (plus if I remember correclty we didnt like playing ultimate price in that slot as it was dead in control matchup).

I liked Pack Rats as it made lategame lands a threat plus had synergy with phoenix and chandra. Dont know if it is needed here (I wrote about using lategame crappy cards such as cacklers. Here you dont need rats anymore as 12 creatures you can use as a pump enchantment or removal).

[LP, of the Fires]

I knew I like the way you thought pedros

[Pedros]

In this shell maybe even pain seer can shine as additional way to get CA.

I also always liked 1 offs such as Tymareth or Rix Maadi Guildmage.

[LP, of the Fires]

Tymaret would allow some powerful plays like saccing tapped guys with bestowed creatures on them for surprise blockers.

[NerdBoyWonder]

Mulling over my list and debating of swapping out Pain Seer for Thrill-Kill Assassin

My current B/w build is removal light with my only utility spell being Orzhov Charm. Pain Seer seems to work better in shells that can continue to get him to get through damage. Thrill-Kill can attack through things though with no need for removal. Carytids, Sheeps, and other road blocks mean nothing to her. Thoughts?

[LP, of the Fires]

I like the change, but I have an unnatural love for the card.

[Purp]

Ive jammed a lot of games with mono black, and have watched many players pilot it at my lgs..the deck needs lightning strike. I would rather play that than thoughtseize.

[LP, of the Fires]

Lies and slander.

[dpaine88]

Yeah for some reason this deck just isn't getting there....no top8 results at all really.

I myself tried Brad Nelsons Brave Naya to a 12th place finish at the TCG 5k in Boxborough last weekend.

Felt sooo much stronger than MBA ever did, and crushed that deck in the last round.

Since I was borrowing the cards for Naya, I am moving onto Burn but will keep an eye for MBA out there.

[LP, of the Fires]

Played MBA last night to a 3-1 finishing losing to burn. Burn matchup was certainly winnable, but I left my Masters of Feast at home so my sideboard was only duress.

Was supposed to test the Rakdos deck, but those cards where ALSO left at home. Overall, not a very productive night as I didn't learn anything I didn't already know(Esper and Black are byes, burn is unwinnable).

[NerdBoyWonder]

[deck]4 Gnarled Scarhide
4 Rakdos Cackler
4 Soldier of the Pantheon
4 Cartel Aristocrat
4 Thrill-Kill Assassin
2 Athreos, God of Passage
3 Master of the Feast
3 Herald of Torment
2 Mogis's Marauder

3 Orzhov Charm
4 Thoughtseize

4 Godless Shrine
2 Mana Confluence
2 Mutavault
2 Plains
9 Swamp
4 Temple of Silence

Sideboard
1 Deicide
3 Devour Flesh
2 Lifebane Zombie
2 Sin Collector
7 ???[/deck]

Tested this list tonight. Thrill-Kill over performed. Master of Feasts did as well. Cartel Aristocrat and Athreos under performed. Tested against Naya Hexproof and B/g Devotion tonight. I found out Athreos was either too slow or not needed in my match ups. B/g had too much removal for me to drop him and profit off him in any sort of way and preferred to have threats. Hexproof is just a race and definitely wanted an actual creature instead of drawing him. During sideboard testing I always boarded him
out and put in other things.

Cartel Aristocrat also was under performing. The card did amazing against my brother's Grixis/Keranos control deck BUT against B/g Control and Hexproof I found the card hurting me more than helping me by either being forced to sacrifice board position OR creatures being removed before being able to utilize her.

Dropping the white splash and going to try out the red splash instead.

[Lightning_Dolt]

Yeah for some reason this deck just isn't getting there....no top8 results at all really.

I myself tried Brad Nelsons Brave Naya to a 12th place finish at the TCG 5k in Boxborough last weekend.

Felt sooo much stronger than MBA ever did, and crushed that deck in the last round.

Since I was borrowing the cards for Naya, I am moving onto Burn but will keep an eye for MBA out there.

Same. Just feels like something is missing.

[Aodh]

I'm running B, Br, Bw, or BW aggro at FNM. I'll write a report thenafter. Bg would be kinda' cool for Golgari Charm and Abrupt Decay... Is a 1-of Profit // Loss justifiable in Bw? Could shit on Elspeth, the mirror, YP$ burn?

[Pedros]

Played MBA last night to a 3-1 finishing losing to burn. Burn matchup was certainly winnable, but I left my Masters of Feast at home so my sideboard was only duress.

Was supposed to test the Rakdos deck, but those cards where ALSO left at home. Overall, not a very productive night as I didn't learn anything I didn't already know(Esper and Black are byes, burn is unwinnable).

So any thoughts on midrange rakdos?

[RedNihilist]

Yeah for some reason this deck just isn't getting there....no top8 results at all really.

I myself tried Brad Nelsons Brave Naya to a 12th place finish at the TCG 5k in Boxborough last weekend.

Felt sooo much stronger than MBA ever did, and crushed that deck in the last round.

Since I was borrowing the cards for Naya, I am moving onto Burn but will keep an eye for MBA out there.

Same. Just feels like something is missing.

Is it reach?
Is it "a good sideboard plan against control that doesn't just turn it into a bad B devotion deck with 1 drops"?
n
I mean, those are the impressions I had when I tried it out, I'm not trying to start any kind of commotion.

[Lightning_Dolt]

What if we took a look back in time to this:

[deck]Lands (24)
4 Blood Crypt
4 Cavern of Souls
4 Dragonskull Summit
1 Mountain
4 Rakdos Guildgate
7 Swamp

Creatures (26)
4 Diregraf Ghoul
4 Falkenrath Aristocrat
4 Geralf's Messenger
4 Gravecrawler
3 Hellrider
4 Knight of Infamy
3 Thundermaw Hellkite

Spells (10)
4 Pillar of Flame
4 Searing Spear
2 Victim of Night

Sideboard (15)
2 Appetite for Brains
3 Bonfire of the Damned
2 Cremate
2 Underworld Connections
4 Vampire Nighthawk
2 Zealous Conscripts
15 sideboard cards[/deck]



...and tried this:

[deck]
Lands (24)
4 Blood Crypt
4 Mana Confluence
1 Mountain
4 Rakdos Guildgate
11 Swamp

Creatures (26)
4 Gnarled Scarhide
4 Rakdos Cackler
4 Tormented Hero
4 Spiteful Returned
4 Herald of Torment
3 Exava, Rakdos Blood Witch
3 Stormbreath Dragon

Spells (10)
4 Shock
4 Lightning Strike
2
Dreadbore


Sideboard (15)
2 Duress
4 Thoughtseize
2 Underworld Connections
2 Whip of Erebos
2 Harness by Force
3 Master of the Feasts
[/deck]