Gone Postal Mafia - Game Over - Scum Win

[Captain Murphy]

Hams statements weren't in RVS. RVS is random voting stage, there were no longer any random votes, you broke it with a vote on imopen and from that point on is real voting and discussion

[Captain Murphy]

I'd bet at least 1 scum was on hams wagon, regardless of his alignment though. Thats what should be looked at later

[Jack]

Could we get a vote count, please?

[rcwraspy]

@rcwraspy

Interesting that you unvoted immediately after I complained about everyone being too passive.

-Based on recent posts so far, who do you want to lynch today, and why?

If you don't have any real scumreads, you should ask someone a question.

I don't have any strong reads yet. But I'm not going to keep my vote on Ham even though I no longer think he's the top scumspect just because of your passive post.

Rez has done the most to garner attention so far, and I have a question for him in my next post.

[rcwraspy]

Ham is scum
LMD is scum

CM is town
imopen is town

What did you see from LMD? Why is imopen town?

[rcwraspy]

Should have prefaced: do you still stand by those reads?

[Cursed_Pride]

I disagree with almost everything Wrath is saying, but I think he's newbtown as opposed to newbscum. -He has a genuineness in his posts that I find hard to fake.

Uh, more people need to post.

hamfactorial (5) - rcwraspy, rezombad, DroppinSuga, Cursed_Pride, Lord_Mcdonalds

If hamfactorial is town, then it's likely that {rcwraspy, rezombad, DroppinSuga, Lord_Mcdonalds} is potentially somewhere we can look.

I'd like to hear from

Lynch Vote DroppinSuga

Hey, you.

Come out to play a bit, if you don't mind. -Name two people you'd scum read, even if it's just scummy side of null this early, with some reasons?

And yeah, if you don't have any scum reads, ask people questions.

Thanks, rc.

[rcwraspy]

Bluh.

-Can I kill hamfactorial and InflatablePie?

I've read the thread like 4 times trying to find this quote. I thought Rez said it.

CP, what do you see in Pie?

[Cursed_Pride]

Oh yeah.

Well.

I want to kill InflatablePie because I asked him why he said that he didn't like DroppinSuga, but then refused to commit to a vote. He brushed it off with

I'm sorry, I didn't know I was allowed to only suspect one person. my apologies.

He gave no reason to suspect imopen2 in his opening post; I thought it was RVS.

[rcwraspy]

oddly if you weren't mod-confirmed you'd be my strongest scum read.

[rcwraspy]

i think that's a sign of how little there is to go on so far

[Wraith223]

Oh yeah.

Well.

I want to kill InflatablePie because I asked him why he said that he didn't like DroppinSuga, but then refused to commit to a vote. He brushed it off with

I'm sorry, I didn't know I was allowed to only suspect one person. my apologies.

He gave no reason to suspect imopen2 in his opening post; I thought it was RVS.

That is something I missed. Hmmmmm. To early to tell as my only game with Inflateable was a disaster as flipped he town with his sarcastic posts. Good call for the watch list (null).

So far DroppinSuga has played the same and is close to a Ham vote to me as both are hard to get a read on. Later game correlations tend to give clearer
evidence. We have more info on Rez and Iamopen2. You raised a great question on InflateablePie. LMD's question to Red still remains ignored. A lot of work to do.

[rcwraspy]

imopen2 and LMD, what are your thoughts so far? Any reads?

[RedNihilist]

LMD's question to Red still remains ignored.

I missed those questions, I'll try to answer.

[RedNihilist]

I guess you're talking about this:

RIP C_P

Why ?

So I heard some people like to start by saying random things like còaiming unlynchable Miller or things like that just for the sake of start some discussion.
I hope we can move on now, I feared I missed some kind of *important* question, but being called back to that is really annoying.

[rcwraspy]

What do you think was random?

[InflatablePie]

Agree with CaptainMurphy re: meta. I try my best not to let meta affect my judgement in general. To be fair, this site has fewer games going on and thus when you're playing with the same dozen of people it's kind of hard to block out using meta completely. Also agree re: scum on the ham wagon. Getting townreads from him here.

anyway, reasons for voting and staying on imopen2:
- "And unvote because RVS is stupid" reads really weirdly to me. that was the initial reason for me voting him.
- "Is there a game where you don't take everything at face value, Wraith? Don't answer that." - this might be a slip here, but I'm not sure how to explain it. Before this post, Wraith votes imopen for the 'confirmed town is
dead town' post. Read this sentence assuming imopen is town and does not know Wraith's alignment. Then read it assuming he's scum and knows Wraith is town. Which feels better? (not trying to use the logic of "scum would do this therefore he is scum", it's just the best way for me to explain)
- [url=viewtopic.php?p=214782#p214782]"My response of "why not" was me trying to show how asking vague and simplistic questions doesn't actually accomplish much." - to sum up, Red said "RIP C_P", Lord_M said "Why?", imopen said "Why not?", then after asked why C_P would auto-die, posted "Confirmed town is dead town, try and keep up". imopen was apparently trying to speak for Red, but it didn't come across that way initially, and the sort of backtracking here feels off.

that's all I have for now.

---

ham and his team-theory is weird, but I've done the look-for-pairings thing a lot in the past (and I don'
t think he was 100% serious) so shrug.

@rcw: why unvote without replacing your vote? I also agree with your "oddly if you weren't mod-confirmed you'd be my strongest scum read", glad I'm not the only one.

[InflatablePie]

I broke a tag, oops. must resist urge to edit D:

[imopen2]

I am not the best communicator since my thought process is clear to me and sometimes I forget to make it clear to others. when I said "confirmed town is dead town" it was in the way that CM phrased it. as a general rule of thumb, scum like to eliminate the confirmed townies and keep the suspicious ones around for mislynches. I did not mean to assume or imply that this was inevitable, only that red's statement was obvious to me, and that LMD's question was not a very good one.

anyways, wraith's posts feel a little different to me this game but it is probably just him playing more and understanding the dynamics a bit better. I think he is town.

rez's push on ham does not sit well with me, but I agree that ham was posting in a passive manner.

I think CM is town, but I also feel like he is buddying me a bit and I guess that could be to get my trust. he doesn't seem like the type to do that, however.

nnot a whole lot else as of now. red is probably town but it will be clearer when he posts more.

cursed does come off scummy but that is probably because he is mod-confirmed town and therefore can speak his mind freely and pressure as he sees fit. the game was not advertised as bastard iirc so we should just believe stardust that he is town.

[Jack]

Could we talk about the game dynamics a bit? It's pretty normal for a 12-person game of mafia (9 town, 3 scum, probably a few power roles), except there's the mail mechanic in place. However, I can't really see how that's exceptionally useful. As of now, I can't think of anything that I'd need to say that I wouldn't say in this thread. Do you ask a question? If you do, you either don't get an answer until the next Night via PM (at which point the person may be out of this game), or you get an answer in this thread the next day, which begs the question: why did you bother asking through the mail system? Do you confide in someone about your role? Do you blatantly lie to someone and see how they react?

[rcwraspy]

@rcw: why unvote without replacing your vote?

Like I told CP, I don't have strong reads right now.

Although I understand its use, I'm not one to blind-vote outside of RVS - I typically want a little more to go on.

[rezombad]

unvote
Vote Jack

I'll answer questions and respond to things in a bit.

[Wraith223]

Could we talk about the game dynamics a bit? It's pretty normal for a 12-person game of mafia (9 town, 3 scum, probably a few power roles), except there's the mail mechanic in place. However, I can't really see how that's exceptionally useful This sentence is questionable.. As of now, I can't think of anything that I'd need to say that I wouldn't say in this thread Another bad one.. Do you ask a question? If you do, you either don't get an answer until the next Night via PM (at which point the person may be out of this game), or you get an answer in this thread the next day, which begs the question: why did you bother asking through the mail system (
Use your imagination dude)? Do you confide in someone about your role (This question is a trap.? Do you blatantly lie to someone and see how they react? Do you plan on doing so?

Did you read your post before posting it? Please answer or explain the questioned and commented sentences.
I thought it was easy to understand, but here the quote for you.

Mod quote, "Every player can send a message to another target player each Night (through the mod)".

You can mail a player each night through the Mod. What is hard to understand about this? How you use it is up to you.

[Jack]

Mod quote, "Every player can send a message to another target player each Night (through the mod)".

You can mail a player each night through the Mod. What is hard to understand about this?

I understand that part.

How you use it is up to you.

I'm just wanted to start a bit of discussion that we would all come out of with a better idea on how to best use the mail system.

[Jack]

I don't know how to respond to the stuff you wrote in blue. You seem to know exactly what I said and what I meant, you just don't like it.

[Wraith223]

I don't know how to respond to the stuff you wrote in blue. You seem to know exactly what I said and what I meant, you just don't like it.

Unvote

I may have a scum read on Rez, but you just made my top list with that.

Vote Jack

You could have just simply answered the my questions and comments with some logic and failed badly to do so. Yeah, I don't like your responses and
the questions are leading.

[Jack]

Could I get some direct questions or specific list of concerns that you want me to address, then?

[Wraith223]

Mod quote, "Every player can send a message to another target player each Night (through the mod)".

You can mail a player each night through the Mod. What is hard to understand about this?

I understand that part.

How you use it is up to you.

I'm just wanted to start a bit of discussion that we would all come out of with a better idea on how to best use the mail
system.

The mail system is self explanatory, even to me. Your paragraph looks like serious fishing to me, and am not sure if it's a town mindset.

Looking forward to hearing Rez's opinion as he is holding back for some reason. I hate it when Manders did that and don't care for it now.

[Wraith223]

Could we talk about the game dynamics a bit? It's pretty normal for a 12-person game of mafia (9 town, 3 scum, probably a few power roles), except there's the mail mechanic in place. However, I can't really see how that's exceptionally useful Why? You can't think of any reasons for a use?.. As of now, I can't think of anything that I'd need to say that I wouldn't say in this thread We have confirmed town (Cursed Pride) to work with. It is good that you see the best course of action in saying your piece here, but this post is placing you as the one guy no one should mail to.. Do you ask a question? If you do, you either don't get an
answer until the next Night via PM (at which point the person may be out of this game), or you get an answer in this thread the next day, which begs the question: why did you bother asking through the mail system Use your imagination dude, Stardust would not have made such an interesting game if it the mail did not matter.? Do you confide in someone about your role (This question is a trap. Again, you seem to ostracizing yourself here.? Do you blatantly lie to someone and see how they react? Do you plan on doing so? This seals the deal and I wonder if you are giving a leading question here.

Did you read your post before posting it? Please answer or explain the questioned and commented sentences.

1. Do you plan on using the mail with this said?
2. Do you not want to participate in the mail system?
3. How would using or not using the
mail system help town in your opinion?

[Jack]

Thanks for clearing that up. Hate to leave you waiting, but it's midnight here on the east coast and I'd feel better answering this when I'm not so tired.

[Jack]

You're very town, btw.

[RedNihilist]

What do you think was random?

My first post

[Stardust]

Could we get a vote count, please?

I will usually not do votecounts over the weekend. However, I continue to follow the thread and will do one if we're getting close to a lynch or someone does something I need to resolve.


Official Votecount!

imopen2 (1): InflatablePie
hamfactorial (1): Lord_Mcdonalds
DroppinSuga (1): Cursed_Pride
Jack (2): rezombad, Wraith223

Not voting: Captain Murphy, Jack, imopen2, RedNihilist, DroppinSuga, hamfactorial, rcwraspy

With 12 alive, it is 7 to lynch.

[rcwraspy]

unvote
Vote Jack

I'll answer questions and respond to things in a bit.

talk to me, Rez. Convince me.

[rezombad]

Been busy. Gimme about 8 hours or so, been busy getting drunk.

[Wraith223]

Been busy. Gimme about 8 hours or so, been busy getting drunk.

Man with a mission there. Buzzed, Shit faced, or Fucked up? God forbid you attempt Khaos level.

[hamfactorial]

Good morning fellows. I've been reading along over the weekend, looking forward to what rez has to say about Jack. Any requests or questions for me?

[rcwraspy]

Good morning fellows. I've been reading along over the weekend, looking forward to what rez has to say about Jack. Any requests or questions for me?

Why are you sitting back waiting for people to ask you questions instead of asking other people questions?

It's like you've adopted the position of prey. Town are supposed to be HUNTERS!!!

[rezombad]

@Wraith: You are now officially on notice, make your posts coherent.

-----

Is everyone interpreting this post as self-conscious? I was in the middle of antagonizing CM, stirring up shit to see what fell out. He leaned on me about active lurking, so I was loading up on the sarcasm, implying that my lurking was passive.

Sarcasm is scummy, by not being definitive you can just go back and say that you meant different things than what is obvious (which is you trying to appear more town instead of just being town).

Also, fuck, you guys are really sensitive about your proper mafia etiquette. Why can't I talk shit during RVS?

Because it doesn't help catch scum.

Notice that some players get actively annoyed when I post bullshit. A scum player is happy to let you guys pile on me while casting a vote or two, or just staying out of it. DroppinSuga and Jack have stayed out of it, so I'm suspicious of them.

InflatablePie says he doesn't see me as scum, but doesn't like Suga's vote very much[/url:
mgkv9r8n]. Is Pie scum? Is Suga his buddy? Public distancing in the early game is a useful scum tactic.

Pie + Suga + Jack scum team? gg game broken I'm town MVP

Who are you asking these questions tow ... 14 3:06 pm"] if you've already read me as scum, you'll find reasons to continue onward with that alignment.

What accountability does a game of mafia have? When you lynch me and I flip town, nobody is going to go "oh no, we killed our friend! I must be punished, lynch me next. I am ashamed"[/quote]

Another scummy post. You accuse CP of confirmation bias, but don't say anything to address his completely legitimate point:

Really don't like you proposing InflatablePie+DroppingSuga+Jack as a scum team, then not voting for any of them. Especially when picking off someone who hasn't posted once as scum - lets you avoid accountability for reads.

Really don't like.

-----

Jack REALLY needs to post or I vote him tonight.

Slip? (this is the kind of stuff I was talking about when I put him on notice)

-----

I'm here! While these posts from ham are very enjoyable, I don't think we'll get much out of them by pressuring him all Day.
He's very self-aware, but otherwise, there's nothing scummy about his
posts.
In my only other game with him, he was scum, and not very active. I'm pretty sure he was the same way in Theros (didn't really follow that one, jus glanced at the thread occasionally). So
I don't really know what these kinds of responses indicate.

He's very self-aware, but otherwise, there's nothing scummy about his posts.
I don't really know what these kinds of responses indicate.


-----

unvote

ham's past actions as town are comparable to his actions in this game, so i tend to believe he's probably town. at this point, i'm not getting any really good reads.

nso 2 games is an established meta?

-----

Can someone give me meta on hamfactorial?

he has 2 games completed.

-----

Ham's meta is that he either lurks hardcore or comes out gunning with sarcasm. The hardcore lurking is more of a tell of his scum game.

again, 2 games.

-----

Having time to think about the whole situation, my gut is giving me trouble with Rez. He really pushed Ham with poor evidence that he SHOULD have known better as he has played games with Ham before (Am
I correct?). When ham responded with anything, he called it mudslinging and did not even bother to consider Ham's responses beyond defensive reactions. Is Rez normally this pushy with crap evidence? I find his push on Ham was a gamble to get a bandwagon vote and I assume Ham apparently has a history of being pissed about getting day 1 lynched? That play on Ham smells of scum tactics.

Vote Rezombad

This is a poor vote at best and at worst is scum trying to protect a scumbuddy. I probably could have explained my vote better at the time, but his self-awareness, unwillingness to commit, and backpedaling are why he is definitely scum

also this:

I'm more concerned with not getting mislynched day 1.

he's ticking off all the items on my scum checklist.

-----

@
rcwraspy: My read on imopen is gut and is still mostly gut, since I'm not spending as much effort townclearing people as scumhunting. The post was early impressions plus I wanted to bait some reactions, hams was scummy to me so I went with that.

-----

re: jack IIoA, I think I overreacted though, and Wraith's vote on Jack is super bad.

Unvote

Vote: hamfactorial

-----

tl;dr
-ham is scum
-2 games is not a meta
-wraith needs to be better at words
-jack is a noob and i forgive him for now
-wraith is pinging me, but after a reread a little less so.

[hamfactorial]

If 2 games isn't meta, what do you think of 3? I've played and completed Ragnarok, DTR and Theros mafia.

Where is your meta barrier that, once crossed, allows players who have been in games with me to comment on my behavior and be judged legitimate?