It's interesting that you keep forgetting to mention CM in your lists even though you have him as:I think scum is fairly active this game and I think they're likely voting each other.
CM's probably 5th or 6th on my scumwatch list.
I read them, but usually I dismiss most of his posts because they are 80% babble, I think he's town though.I assume the others are ignoring you.
You post on dtr? Cool? Honestly, I don't know who posts there and who doesn't.
I actually read that site quite a bit but its mostly because a lot of the people I used to interact with on MTGS are over there.
It should be a privilege to post here
Post 113I don't have time to post a big, huge post right now, but I will say this:
Wraith, it is not a contradiction because imopen2 NEVER voted CM for doc hunting (Wrong, See post 113). And I STILL don't see how you can misrep "discuss doc targets" as "wanting to hunt the doc down." If you can explain that, it'd be lovely.
Not sure what you want her as doing one action leads to another for scum to benefit. It a similar action to discussing who is in witness protection among the whole justice system for everyone to hear. Not bright and still a great danger to those in witness protection. Thus even discussing Doc targets is the dumbest thing I have ever heard. I think you need to reread my posts on Iamopen2 and refine your questions.And I STILL don't see how you can misrep "discuss doc targets" as "wanting to hunt the doc down." If you can explain that, it'd be lovely.
You drive badass things.
nI think I'll stay in scummy water.Firstly, don't attack me for being gone. I told you guys my activity would be spotty, but I'm still here. Shit may be late, but it's not irrelevant.How is he minimizing your read?Captain Murphy seems to be minimizing my read and coming to the aid
of G_R. Hmmmmmm. Manders is on to something.
You took to long to respond to this. He found the silly trap card thing from Zem a misread cause I forgot about pre-game BS. This was already fleshed out.So far I am not impressed.
This I commented on, but look at what CM said again, then tell me how you got "I want to hunt the doc" out of that.Secondly, you say CM was minimizing your read of GR. Then, in your next post, you state CM's doc hunting. Where did you get that from? The only thing I see was where imopen2 said CM's wanting to fish for the doc target. How did you read that so incorrectly?That's where I got that from in post 102, and in post 107 you vote for C.M. as well. I saw it as Doc hunting. C.M. reminded me that G_R had made previous arrangements to fight with Stardust in the sign up section. Why are you lost on this?I think there needs to be a discussion closer to the end of the day deciding the 3 best doc choices so it isn't plundered on one of the 4 scum or someone who might not be supporting the town.
Ah, upon looking again, it's that you went on to talk about voting, then said that. It threw me off. I don't know why you're being so rude about it, though.You see, in my post (and right above the last response) where your name is blue? Click on it. It's a link. Thanks, I did not realize you could click that. Ok....I say it is a poor notion for C.M. to even present the idea of doc hunting. Could not have been any clearer.What's the poor notion?What a poor notion to event present.
Where did you this? I remember saying it, but can't find it. Give me the post number please.
This doesn't answer my question at all, dude. imopen2 hadn't even made his "SUPER SCUMMY POST" at that time, so he has nothing to do with this question. I'll try again.This doesn't mesh. If you're so sure about Murphy, why aren't you voting him? Why MUST GR respond before you can/will do so?Captain Murphy has lynched himself in my view. Still waiting for G_R to respond.
I was sure about C.P., but he is very hard to read with the shield of sarcasm. He is aggressive and plays gambits. The comment caught a few in his web, thus I am not sure it was scum post or a well played gambit to catch scum. I just don't know. My gut responded to Iamopen2's contradiction in his rationality followed with a vote. I could not ignore that as it is serious deviation from normal character. You raise a good point about how I should be after C.P., but I prefer to go after big scum posts as Iamopen2 threw out there. Catching him in the contradiction was stronger to me as we have 2 scum teams. It is hard to catch Iamopen2 in a lie or contradiction in last game I played with him, thus I went for it when I saw it. The big reason why I am putting C.P.
on the back burner is that he is very sarcastic and I find he may still be poking Stardust on the doc claim.
You voted GR for the doc thing with Stardust. Then you got suspicious of CM. So suspicious, that you seemed absolutely sure he was scum, whereas you were only waiting for a response from GR, but everyone else had already explained it pretty much, yet you continued to wait for GR instead of voting for CM. Then, when he (CM) did post again, he didn't say anything to show that he wasn't serious about his proposal, yet you backed off immediately. None of this makes sense to me from a Town PoV. Can you explain it to me?
Everyone's ignoring it because IT NEVER HAPPENED. He NEVER voted CM for doc hunting. He voted him for wanting to direct the doctor. TwoOMFG, dude, there was NO CONTRADICTION on imopen2's part. He's explained why this is the case several times, and you seem to be
simply ignoring the logic he's shown you. Please, for the love of God, go find one of the posts he made explaining why this wasn't a contradiction, quote it, and explain to me why his logic is flawed and it WAS a contradiction. I would love to see that.
I think you are in league with Iamopen2 and it is sad to have to carry that boat anchor. In Post 113, He votes C.M. for Doc hunting. Fate and Zem team up to pick apart Freedom with a votes (post 137 and 142). In post 150 he finds freedom and C.M. saying the wrong thing for town. He further attacks Zem for it with a vote. Why vote C.M. with a clear explanation and switch later on with vote that and rational that it is ok that freedom and C.M. just said anti-town posts. You can't have swing both ways and raise my suspicions. Why is everyone ignoring that?
totally different things. Other than that, the rest is unrelated. Hell, just from reading that description you wrote? I still don't get what you're fucking talking about with a contradiction. The only reason I spoke up is because I was sick of you talking about it and thought MAYBE you'd realize your mistake and get the fuck over it if someone else told you you read it wrong. Apparently not.
I've already told you more than I should for Today. You will have to wait until Tomorrow since no one else is interested in going after you and it's too late/I don't have the time to try a new wagon now.Oh, I don't think you're scum for having evidence against CM. I started the damn wagon on him. I think you are scum because you're playing like scum. A case on you won't benefit anyone but you Today, though, so that's not happening.You're scum with Freedom.My general Rule is that I don't bandwagons as they lynch often without evidence. I have hard/excellent evidence against Iamopen2 and am presenting my findings to group for evaluation.
PLEASE EVALUATE Iamopen2's posts: 113 and 150. Thoughts? Opinions?
Why? I find my evidence was sufficient for asking for evaluation and support. Why does this read
scum to you If I ask for those instead of demand them as others do? My distaste for poor rational bandwagons is known, but I noted that, presented my findings, and asked for support. Now why do you place me with Freedom? My first game with Freedom showed that he plays devils advocate alot and poor inferences in rationality which appear scum. He rolled town when the game ended. He is another player I am putting on the back burner for now as Iamopen2 is a stronger scum than C.P. or freedom at the moment. Please give me a well thought out post as to why I am scum, because I am solid town.
We all saw C.M.'s scummy post, but my evidence was against Iamopen2 not C.M. as it would be redundant. How am I playing like scum?
Try to flex those deductive muscles and tell me why. Your strong need to defend Iamopen2 is disturbing my gut.
Because I said so. It's my list. A list without explanation is hiding something from town. You are strong player the others are willing to follow or not piss off. No one is above scrutiny in my view. Please explain or sit in scummy water.Why am I scum to you(still no reason given)? Why is freedom the better choice? Why is Zem third?
The Town doesn't seem to give a hairy rat's ass why I think you're scum since no one else has asked me anything or even discussed it with me. So, no, I'll keep my reasons to myself for now on. It's good enough that they know who I suspect. When I die and flip Town, the other Townies will know to look into who I suspected.Why are you so worried about me thinking you're scum? Cause I don't understand why. The reasons explain your standings and associations for town to hunt
scum. If you find me scum; the town would like to know why for the campaign against 2 scum teams.
Yeah, you obviously haven't played a lot of mafia. The best players I know out there rarely give reasons for their suspicions. Some NEVER do cases. I will do cases, but not on the first Day. Pointless.Don't tell me what I NEED to do. I NEED to play the fucking game, which I'm doing. I thought the experienced players would post better reads and complete, fleshed out reasons votes for town. Instead I findAt this point, you have only given association calls (scum buddy), odd commentary (see responses to Stardust), conversation starters with DroppinSuga, and requests for more content from others. You NEED to post more and give reasoned reads on your scum picks as well.
children poking each other with emotional attitudes. At least Zem explains himself and he can barely do that on FoS. WTH? Hiding the ball from town with explained reads does nothing for town. If you play this way; what a waste for town. Unless you are in Iamopen2's scum team. Freedom does play oddy-poorly with responses cause he does not want to lynch town. Thus I am not seeing in league with Iamopen2 anymore. You are looking more like the accomplice now.
Am I "verdently" defending him? I was pretty sure I've only said, "Hey, let's hold off on that. I'd like to see more from him." Yeah, something along those lines.1) I told him that because it's true. So why defend Iamopen2 so verdantly if it is true?Lastly, Why did you tell DroppinSuge this: "Because more discussion could help scum, duh. Why keep talking if everything's decided?" It goes against your commentary and vote movement. DroppinSuga was responding to the Iamopen2 votes, not freedom. That statement from you was
admission that you might agree with Iamopen2 as being scum. Very strange.
Obviously you did. You said it didn't make sense to tell him I look forward to his contributions, then proceed to tell him he should NOT wait for more discussion, if the decision's made, go for it. I'm telling you it does because I LOOK FORWARD TO2) I didn't say I look forward to his contributions before this Day ended, did I? This is a misdirection question as NO one interpreted that. Try again.
HIS CONTRIBUTIONS. PERIOD. WHENEVER THEY HAPPEN.
I thought people would just get that was what I was saying. Others did. EXCUSE ME that you misread what I was saying.3) At the time his post was made that I responded to, it seemed pretty clear imopen2 was the lynch target, and he agreed and had voted him, but then decided not to because we needed more discussion. You should have lead with this grain of truth instead of number 1 question. Unfortunately, it the grain of truthe sales pitch to throw the weak minded off. Why did you per-sue this further? He must be ripe in your eyes for picking apart. Very strange.
Ok. I gave it to you. Now tell me how it was a contradiction. Show your work.Let me show you something. THIS IS FOR EVERYONE WHO AGREES THAT MORE DISCUSSION IS ALWAYS NEEDED.
Kaizers Mafia
The guys found scum
off his first post around post 10 or so. (indomitablebug is the scum in question.) We lynched him very quickly, caught scum, and eventually won the game. It is NOT always better to have discussion. The scum learned nothing about the Town D1, and it absolutely helped the Town. If that is the case here; why defend Iamopen2 with little or rational explinations besides "he explained it"? I want your explanation as his is tainted.
*sigh*Terrible idea. Huh? O...K not seeing the point of this?Post your case now since a few of us agree that Zem is scum
Apparently I have to spell it out for you.
If you suspect
someone of scum based on little tells they're doing, it's best NOT to tell them because, then, they'll stop doing it.
*GASP*
Shocking. I know.
The rest is just you responding to shit that wasn't even directed to you, so I'm going to ignore it. I did read it, but it'll get no response.
Who said I forgot it? I was showing evidence of him being Town.MINDSET TELL!!It also gives you the ability to tailor your case to whether I flip town or scum (I'm flipping town but if you are scum you know that already). I'd rather you get your stance out there withBecause if I post my case at this moment, it's just going to draw focus away from you, who should stay our target for today. Hence why I'm going to case Z tomorrow.
as little info as possible so you can't backtrack.
There's two scum teams. imopen2 forgot about that because he's Town and, really, there's just one scum to all. There's 4 scum we have to kill, we don't care what team they're on, we have to kill them.
More and more sure he's Town, guys. How could you forget that? You should be screaming how "stupid" a statement it is to say that. Not knowing the rules hurts town. DroppinSuga has not deviated from his normal strategy. I find his delayed read stupid but it appears he is playing a small gambit. Still a null read from him. Iamopen2 has said many times he is disinterested in the game and apparently does not read the rules. How could you believe that crap? Scum has to fake it to the end. Why can't you of all people see that?
And, no, I'm not going to scream that it's a stupid
statement to make. I don't sit here telling myself "I gotta find the two Scum teams." I don't think about there being 2 teams. There's just scum. It's something completely natural. What he said reads as completely sincere to me and lends credence to my theory that he's Town. Period. Agree or disagree, but that's how I think of it.
Town slips can tell you just as much as scum slips. Playing Mafia is all about reading players' intents. Seeing their mindset. It's much more mind-intensive than a lot of people realize.Town Slip?Thought we were looking for scum slips? I can see the reverse being useful, but looking for town in a player that is being evaluated can lead you astray. Just agreeing with Stardust to make yourself look town or the top player is noticeable. Iamopen2 is an excellent scum player. DON'T TRUST THE HOLY DEER!
He can wait until Tomorrow. Two possible targets 5 days til deadline is plenty.I don't have time for a full case on Zem at this time, but it pretty much starts and ends with the fact that his cases are super weak. He's been basically grasping at straws this entire game and that's not like him. I would fully support a lynch of Zem today if people were so inclined, but I'll try to post a full case on him tonight. If you refer to I believe it was imopen's post earlier on page 10, you'll see him posting about Zem in much the same fashion and I believe it's something that we need to look at. If not during this day phase, than definitely tomorrow.
And I keep
dying they don't make sense because THEY DON'T MAKE SENSE. I'm one of several people that can't understand what you are trying to say with your gibberish. I assume the others are ignoring you.
I'm not ignoring him, but yes, Wraith. Your posts are very hard to read. Not that we can't understand your reads. We, literally, can't understand what you're saying sometimes. You throw words in where they don't belong and it's very distracting.@everyone else, are you guys really ignoring me now and find my reads that confusing?I already quoted the place where you said that, in my post 426
I can't tell if haters are scum or just assholes. My goal is not hide the ball as some do and present
everything I have to help town. If you don't understand my reads; ask more specific questions and I will try harder.
Wow. Just wow.Town-
Zem- nothing in his play style has changed, and he is scum hunting to me. Need others to role scum for me to get a better read.
Void- Attitude is very nice and is putting more content the boards, is getting more involved with town discussion.
Rcwraspy- posts with lots of well thought out questions, questions
everyone
Null (big pile)
Rezombad- lurking bad/no read, need more evidence
Freedom-could be playing devil's advocate poorly or is really good at scum. (very close to throwing him in scum pile)
Stardust- I don't care for claims that cannot be confirmed. (very close to throwing in scum pile for claims)
Captain Murphy- Plays gambits with the Doc hunting, has the shield of sarcasm. Not sure right now.
G_R- just has not posted anything lately that is not a summery, lurks, seems go against the grain with every vote.
DroppinSuga- Has not had any deviations from play styles, lurks somewhat, posts without significant reads. Seems to avoid Manders)
Scum
Fate- lurks, asks for votes with little or no rationality, Has not contributed any reads for town, bandwagon votes.
Manders- Lurks BAD, Defends Iamopen2 strongly with just far reaching "town slip" arguments, her targeting of DroppinSuga seems disingenuous.
Iamopen2- My strongest scum find, Contradictions, claims disinterest in game but still
plays, Claims to not know there are 2 scum teams, Snipes at anything to disprove my claims.
Scroll up in this post and find this sentence:Post 113I don't have time to post a big, huge post right now, but I will say this:
Wraith, it is not a contradiction because imopen2 NEVER voted CM for doc hunting (Wrong, See post 113). And I STILL don't see how you can misrep "discuss doc targets" as "wanting to hunt the doc down." If you can explain that, it'd be lovely.
Unvote
Vote: Murphy
Fishing for the doc target is a big no no in this setup. You're a much better player than that, Murphy.
Post 102
unvote
I think the important thing is not to getting too bogged down in silly things like a trap card comment of stardust being a cheeky joker
claiming cop. I think finding connections between players is going to be key.
I think there needs to be a discussion closer to the end of the day deciding the 3 best doc choices so it isn't plundered on one of the 4 scum or someone who might not be supporting the town.
Looking these posts backwards and in correct order shows you are not reading the posts, Lying to throw everyone off course, or in the scum team with Iamopen2.
From Manders-Not sure what you want her as doing one action leads to another for scum to benefit. It a similar action to discussing who is in witness protection among the whole justice system for everyone to hear. Not bright and still a great danger to those in witness protection. Thus even discussing Doc targets is the dumbest thing I have ever heard. I think you need to reread my postsAnd I STILL don't see how you can misrep "discuss doc targets" as "wanting to hunt the doc down." If you can explain that, it'd be lovely.
on Iamopen2 and refine your questions.
Before I start, how many games have you played Wraith? 4 Including this one. Please don't start the "I have experience crap cause you could be scum trying to lead us astray.
Throwing mud solves nothing. I showed you my findings and you disagree. Your questions were answered with detailed posts numbers and you respond with "take your snark and shove it up your ass". Not a good town response, nor does that answer the issue why you deny that Iamopen2 voted for C.M. for doc hunting. I find it very strange that you are arguing that piece of obvious intel. Also, Why bring up a past game not even on this forum? I don't give a shit about past games that only have you on them when Iamopen2 is the point of discussion. Patting yourself on the back does nothing for THIS game. PleaseI think I'll stay in scummy water.Firstly, don't attack me for being gone. I told you guys my activity would be spotty, but I'm still here. Shit may be late, but it's not irrelevant. So far I am not impressed.How is he minimizing your read?Captain Murphy seems to be minimizing my read and coming to the aid of G_R. Hmmmmmm. Manders is on to something.
You took to long to respond to this. He found the silly trap card thing from Zem a misread cause I forgot about pre-game BS. This was already fleshed out.
This I commented on, but look at what CM said again, then tell me how you got "I want to hunt the doc" out of that.Secondly, you say CM was minimizing your read of GR. Then, in your next post, you state CM's doc hunting. Where did you get that from? The only thing I see was where imopen2 said CM's wanting to fish for the doc target. How did you read that so incorrectly?That's where I got that from in post 102, and in post 107I think there needs to be a discussion closer to the end of the day deciding the 3 best doc choices so it isn't plundered on one of the 4 scum or someone who might not be supporting the town.
you vote for C.M. as well. I saw it as Doc hunting. C.M. reminded me that G_R had made previous arrangements to fight with Stardust in the sign up section. Why are you lost on this?
The first post C.M. had on Doc hunting is what matters as it was freely given without request or question. He fucked up, but he also caught many in the tar baby that followed.
Ah, upon looking again, it's that you went on to talk about voting, then said that. It threw me off. I don't know why you're being so rude about it, though.You see, in my post (andWhat's the poor notion?What a poor notion to event present.
Where did you this? I remember saying it, but can't find it. Give me the post number please.
right above the last response) where your name is blue? Click on it. It's a link. Thanks, I did not realize you could click that. Ok....I say it is a poor notion for C.M. to even present the idea of doc hunting. Could not have been any clearer.
If looked rude, forgive me as typing looses context. Although, I tend to write directly and without sarcasm, thus you should have interpreted the "Poor Notion" as its literal terms.
This doesn't answer my question at all, dude. imopen2 hadn't even made his "SUPER SCUMMY POST" at that time, so he has nothing to do with this question. I'll try again.This doesn't mesh. If youre so sure about Murphy, why aren't you voting him? Why MUST GR respond before you can/will do so?Captain Murphy has lynched himself in my view. Still waiting for G_R to respond.
I was sure about C.P., but he is very hard to read with the shield of sarcasm. He is aggressive and plays gambits. The comment caught a few in his web, thus I am not sure it was scum post or a well played gambit to catch scum. I just don't know. My gut responded to Iamopen2's contradiction in his rationality followed with a vote. I could not ignore that as it is serious deviation from normal character. You raise a good point about how I should be after C.P., but I prefer to go after big scum posts as Iamopen2 threw out there. Catching him in the contradiction was stronger to me as we have 2 scum teams. It is hard to catch Iamopen2 in a lie or contradiction in last game I played with him, thus I went for it when I saw it. The big reason why I am putting C.P. on the back burner is that he is very sarcastic and I find he may still be poking Stardust on the doc claim.
You voted GR for the doc thing with Stardust. Then you got suspicious of CM. So suspicious, that you seemed absolutely sure he was scum, whereas you were only waiting for a response from GR, but everyone else had already explained it pretty much, yet you continued to wait for GR instead of voting for CM. Then, when he (CM) did post again, he didn't say anything to show that he wasn't serious about his proposal, yet you backed off immediately. None of this makes sense to me from a Town PoV. Can you explain it to me?
I voted G_R cause he was playing some stupid agreement with Stardust to poke at each other day one for who was the doc (only among them). I forgot that from the sign ups page and pursued a vote. Others reminded me of said agreement and I backed off. Did
you read the sign ups pages?
Everyone's ignoring it because IT NEVER HAPPENED. He NEVER voted CM for doc hunting. He voted him for wanting to direct the doctor. Two totally different things. Other than that, the rest is unrelated. Hell, just from reading that description you wrote? I still don't get what you're fucking talking about with a contradiction. The only reason I spoke up is because I was sick of you talking about it and thought MAYBE you'd realize your mistake and get the fuck over it if someone else told you you read it wrong. Apparently not.OMFG, dude, there was NO CONTRADICTION on imopen2's part. He's explained why this is the case several times, and you seem to be simply ignoring the logic he's shown you. Please, for the love of God, go find one of the posts he made explaining why this wasn't a contradiction, quote it, and explain to me why his logic is flawed and it WAS a contradiction. I would love to see that.
I think you are in league with Iamopen2 and it is sad to have to carry that boat anchor. In Post 113, He votes C.M. for Doc hunting. Fate and Zem team up to pick apart Freedom with a votes (post 137 and 142). In post 150 he finds freedom and C.M. saying the wrong thing for town. He further attacks Zem for it with a vote. Why vote C.M. with a clear explanation and switch later on with vote that and rational that it is ok that freedom and C.M. just said anti-town posts. You can't have swing both ways and raise my suspicions. Why is
everyone ignoring that?
I layed out the evidence from post 102, 113, and 150. If you cannot see the issue here; your experience in playing mafia is lost on me. There are a few still voting for Iamopen2, thus there are some that might agree with me.
I've already told you more than I should for Today. You will have to wait until Tomorrow since no one else is interested in going after you and it's too late/I don't have the time to try a new wagon now.Oh, I don't think you're scum for having evidence against CM. I started the damn wagon on him. I think you are scum because you're playing like scum. A case on you won't benefit anyone but you Today, though, so that's not happening.You're scum with Freedom.My general Rule is that I don't bandwagons as they lynch often without evidence. I have hard/excellent evidence against Iamopen2 and am presenting my findings to group for evaluation.
PLEASE EVALUATE Iamopen2's posts: 113 and 150. Thoughts? Opinions?
Why? I find my evidence was sufficient for asking for evaluation and support. Why does this read scum to you If I ask for those instead of demand them as others do? My distaste for poor rational bandwagons is known, but I noted that, presented my findings, and asked for support. Now why do you place me with Freedom? My first game with Freedom showed that he plays devils advocate alot and poor inferences in rationality which appear scum. He rolled town when the game ended. He is another player I am putting on the back burner for now as Iamopen2 is a stronger scum than C.P. or freedom at the moment. Please give me a well thought out post as to why I
am scum, because I am solid town.
We all saw C.M.'s scummy post, but my evidence was against Iamopen2 not C.M. as it would be redundant. How am I playing like scum? Try to flex those deductive muscles and tell me why. Your strong need to defend Iamopen2 is disturbing my gut.
Because I said so. It's my list. A listWhy am I scum to you(still no reason given)? Why is freedom the better choice? Why is Zem third?
without explanation is hiding something from town. You are strong player the others are willing to follow or not piss off. No one is above scrutiny in my view. Please explain or sit in scummy water.
Go for it!
The Town doesn't seem to give a hairy rat's ass why I think you're scum since no one else has asked me anything or even discussed it with me. So, no, I'll keep my reasons to myself for now on. It's good enough that they know who I suspect. When I die and flip Town, the other Townies willWhy are you so worried about me thinking you're scum? Cause I don't understand why. The reasons explain your standings and associations for town to hunt scum. If you find me scum; the town would like to know why for the campaign against 2 scum teams.
know to look into who I suspected.
Or that you were missing the reads on Iamopen2. Scum have to fight to the end, thus that argument does not hold water.
Yeah, you obviously haven't played a lot of mafia. The best players I know out there rarely give reasons for their suspicions. Some NEVER do cases. I will do cases, but not on the first Day. Pointless.Don't tell me what I NEED to do. I NEED to play the fucking game, which I'm doing. I thought the experienced players would post better reads and complete, fleshed out reasons votes for town. Instead I find children poking each other with emotional attitudes. At least Zem explains himself and he can barely do that on FoS. WTH? Hiding the ball from town with explained reads does nothing for town. If you play this way; what a waste for town. Unless you are in Iamopen2's scumAt this point, you have only given association calls (scum buddy), odd commentary (see responses to Stardust), conversation starters with DroppinSuga, and requests for more content from others. You NEED to post more and give reasoned reads on your scum picks as well.
team. Freedom does play oddy-poorly with responses cause he does not want to lynch town. Thus I am not seeing in league with Iamopen2 anymore. You are looking more like the accomplice now.
Play styles are their own. I prefer to to flesh out all theories. The ones they don't refuse to discuss or contradict are generally the scum.
Or lead you astray while looking for evidence in a tainted mindset. I have been watching Iamopen2 for well explained reasons for what he did. I got denial, Non-interest in game, claims of rules unawareness (2 scum teams), and general sniping on anyone attacking him. At least I followed through with my claims of disinterest in the game.Am I "verdently" defending him? I was pretty sure I've only said, "Hey, let's hold off on that. I'd like to see more from him." Yeah, something along those lines.Lastly, Why did you tell DroppinSuge this: "Because more discussion could help scum, duh. Why keep talking if everything's decided?" It goes against your commentary and vote movement. DroppinSuga was responding to the Iamopen2 votes, not freedom. That statement from you was admission that you might agree with Iamopen2 as being scum. Very strange.[/quote:
tvche6px]
1) I told him that because it's true. So why defend Iamopen2 so verdantly if it is true?
More hand waving. When you say "it has pretty much been decided"; I take your statement at literal truth cause it makes you break down the pointless sarcasm.
Obviously you did. You said it didn't make sense to tell him I look forward to his contributions, then proceed to tell2) I didn't say I look forward to his contributions before this Day ended, did I? This is a misdirection question as NO one interpreted that. Try again.
him he should NOT wait for more discussion, if the decision's made, go for it. I'm telling you it does because I LOOK FORWARD TO HIS CONTRIBUTIONS. PERIOD. WHENEVER THEY HAPPEN.
Naturally, every question has an undertone. Otherwise, why say it?
I thought people would just get that was what I was saying. Others did. EXCUSE ME that you misread what I was saying.3) At the time his post was made that I responded to, it seemed pretty clear imopen2 was the lynch target, and he agreed and had voted him, but then decided not to because we needed more discussion. You should have lead with this grain of truth instead of number 1 question. Unfortunately, it the grain of truthe sales pitch to throw the weak minded off. Why did you per-sue this further? He must be ripe in your eyes for picking apart. Very strange.
Liers and/or scum tend to give the grain of truth at the end
of statement or list to hopefully put doubters at rest. Learned that technique from interrogation lecture. Works great.
Ok. I gave it to you. Now tell me how it was a contradiction.Let me show you something. THIS IS FOR EVERYONE WHO AGREES THAT MORE DISCUSSION IS ALWAYS NEEDED.
Kaizers Mafia
The guys found scum off his first post around post 10 or so. (indomitablebug is the scum in question.) We lynched him very quickly, caught scum, and eventually won the game. It is NOT always better to have discussion. The scum learned nothing about the Town D1, and it absolutely helped the Town. If that is the case here; why defend Iamopen2 with little or rational explinations besides "he explained it"? I want your explanation as his is tainted.
Show your work.
Indeed that was dumb. I will put C.M. in my scum list then, but I still like Iamopen2 better. If C.M. goes for a strong lynch movement; I will vote him.Some amount of info is better than a random lynch, right? And I'm not even the one that put him at L-2.
*sigh*Terrible idea. Huh? O...K not seeing the point of this?Post your case now since a few of us agree that Zem is scum
Apparently I have to spell it out for you.
If you suspect someone of scum based on little tells they're doing, it's best NOT to tell them because, then, they'll stop doing it.
*GASP*
Shocking. I know.
Playstyle. I prefer to have information on scum in hand.
NOW. If the stop or ignore the challenge; you can interrogate more with greater pressure. I can't read faces in online mafia.
The rest is just you responding to shit that wasn't even directed to you, so I'm going to ignore it. I did read it, but it'll get no response.
Whatever.
Who said I forgot it? I was showing evidence of him being Town.MINDSET TELL!!It also gives you the ability to tailor your case to whether I flip town or scum (I'm flipping town but if you are scum you know that already). I'Because if I post my case at this moment, it's just going to draw focus away from you, who should stay our target for today. Hence why I'm going to case Z tomorrow.
d rather you get your stance out there with as little info as possible so you can't backtrack.
There's two scum teams. imopen2 forgot about that because he's Town and, really, there's just one scum to all. There's 4 scum we have to kill, we don't care what team they're on, we have to kill them.
More and more sure he's Town, guys. How could you forget that? You should be screaming how "stupid" a statement it is to say that. Not knowing the rules hurts town. DroppinSuga has not deviated from his normal strategy. I find his delayed read stupid but it appears he is playing a small gambit. Still a null read from him. Iamopen2 has said many times he is disinterested in the game and apparently does not read the rules. How could you believe that crap? Scum has to fake it to the end. Why can't you of all people see that?
And, no, I'm
not going to scream that it's a stupid statement to make. I don't sit here telling myself "I gotta find the two Scum teams." I don't think about there being 2 teams. There's just scum. It's something completely natural. What he said reads as completely sincere to me and lends credence to my theory that he's Town. Period. Agree or disagree, but that's how I think of it.
Not taking into account for scum hunting scum as well allows for scum to act town, thus false sincerity coupled with lack of interest in game spells scum to me.
Town slips can tell you just as much as scum slips. Playing Mafia is all about reading players' intents. Seeing their mindset. It's much more mind-intensive than a lot of people realize.Town Slip?
TRUST THE HOLY DEER!
He can wait until Tomorrow. Two possible targets 5 days til deadline is plenty.I don't have time for a full case on Zem at this time, but it pretty much starts and ends with the fact that his cases are super weak. He's been basically grasping at straws this entire game and that's not like him. I would
fully support a lynch of Zem today if people were so inclined, but I'll try to post a full case on him tonight. If you refer to I believe it was imopen's post earlier on page 10, you'll see him posting about Zem in much the same fashion and I believe it's something that we need to look at. If not during this day phase, than definitely tomorrow.
And I keep dying they don't make sense because THEY DON'T MAKE SENSE. I'm one of several people that can't understand what you are trying to say with your gibberish. I assume the others are ignoring you.I'm not ignoring him, but yes, Wraith. Your posts are very hard to read. Not that we can't understand your reads. We, literally, can't@everyone else, are you guys really ignoring me now and find my reads that confusing?I already quoted the place where you said that, in my post 426
I can't tell if haters are scum or just assholes. My goal is not hide the ball as some do and present everything I have to help town. If you don't understand my reads; ask more specific questions and I will try harder.
understand what you're saying sometimes. You throw words in where they don't belong and it's very distracting.
Is English your first language? I am a terrible at typing.
Wow. Just wow. I prefer to have all cards on the table for town.Town-
Zem- nothing in his play style has changed, and he is scum hunting to me. Need
others to role scum for me to get a better read.
Void- Attitude is very nice and is putting more content the boards, is getting more involved with town discussion.
Rcwraspy- posts with lots of well thought out questions, questions everyone
Null (big pile)
Rezombad- lurking bad/no read, need more evidence
Freedom-could be playing devil's advocate poorly or is really good at scum. (very close to throwing him in scum pile)
Stardust- I don't care for claims that cannot be confirmed. (very close to throwing in scum pile for claims)
Captain Murphy- Plays gambits with the Doc hunting, has the shield of sarcasm. Not sure right now. (Edit: NO longer Null)
G_R- just has not posted anything lately that is not a summery, lurks, seems go against the grain with every vote.
DroppinSuga- Has not had any deviations from play styles, lurks somewhat, posts without significant reads. Seems to avoid Manders)
Scum
Edit: Captain Murphy- asking for doc
hunting
Fate- lurks, asks for votes with little or no rationality, Has not contributed any reads for town, bandwagon votes.
Manders- Lurks BAD, Defends Iamopen2 strongly with just far reaching "town slip" arguments, her targeting of DroppinSuga seems disingenuous.
Iamopen2- My strongest scum find, Contradictions, claims disinterest in game but still plays, Claims to not know there are 2 scum teams, Snipes at anything to disprove my claims.Scroll up in this post and find this sentence:Post 113I don't have time to post a big, huge post right now, but I will say this:
Wraith, it is not a contradiction because imopen2 NEVER voted CM for doc hunting (Wrong, See post 113).
And I STILL don't see how you can misrep "discuss doc targets" as "wanting to hunt the doc down." If you can explain that, it'd be lovely.
Unvote
Vote: Murphy
Fishing for the doc target is a big no no in this setup. You're a much better player than that, Murphy.
Post 102
unvote
I think the important thing is not to getting too bogged down in silly things like a trap card comment of stardust being a cheeky joker claiming cop. I think finding connections between players is going to be key.
I think there needs to be a discussion closer to the end of the day deciding the 3 best doc choices so it isn't plundered on one of the 4 scum or someone who might not be supporting the town.
Looking these posts backwards and in correct order shows you are not reading the posts, Lying to throw everyone off course, or in the scum team with Iamopen2.
From Manders-Not sure what you want her as doing one action leads to another for scum to benefit. It a similar action to discussing who is in witness protection among the whole justice system for everyone to hear. Not bright and still a great danger to those in witness protection. Thus even discussing Doc targets is the dumbest thing I have ever heard. I think you need to reread my posts on Iamopen2 and refine your questions.And I STILL don't see how you can misrep "discuss doc targets" as "
wanting to hunt the doc down." If you can explain that, it'd be lovely.
" In Post 113, He votes C.M. for Doc hunting. "
Who said that? Here is the complete Iamopen2 post going after C.M. for doc hunting. in reference to said Statement from you "Wraith, it is not a contradiction because imopen2 NEVER voted CM for doc hunting."And you can take your snark and shove it up your ass. I'm aware of why CM's proposal is a bad idea. Again...I STARTED THE WAGON ON HIM FOR IT.Unvote
Vote: Murphy
Fishing for the doc target is a big no no in this setup. You're a much better player than that, Murphy.
play THIS game.
You drive badass things.
The most recent lists were about whose recent posts I liked and didn't like. CM didn't fit in either category, so I didn't list him. Those weren't T/S lists.It's interesting that you keep forgetting to mention CM in your lists even though you have him as:I think scum is fairly active this game and I think they're likely voting each other.CM's probably 5th or 6th on my scumwatch list.
Son, I want you to know that no matter what happens between your mother and me, it's all your fault.
Discussing possible Doc players, players to not lynch, and discussing who has what roles. A simple Town, Null, and Scum list is what I find as safe.Wraith, what is your definition of doc hunting?
You drive badass things.
Everyone's a winner, we're making our fame,1 - Drunk, surly zem
2 - Nice, modest zem
3 - Bragpost zem
4 - Confident and funny zem
5 - Condescending jerk zem
6 - Self-aware zem
I'm going to break down your response:Wraith, what is your definition of doc hunting?
is actual doc hunting. This is the ONLY thing that is doc hunting. So, please, use the terminology correctly so you can stop confusing people.Discussing possible Doc players
: This is far too vague. I'm not sure how to classify it with the amount of information you provided.players to not lynch
: This would be fishing, unless the roles have alreadydiscussing who has what roles
That explains why people keep coming over for chicken nuggets
This makes no sense. If he forgot there were two scum teams (something that I think is extremely unlikely for a scum player to forget), then he couldn't have town slipped on purpose. If he forgot, then he wouldn't even knowYes.What? He forgot by accident then townslipped on purpose?
In a game with 1 scum team, what he said about scum knowing who is town is something that can be read as a purposeful town slip.
Everybody in this game is aware there are 2 scum teams. If someone is going to forget about it, I think it's equally likely coming from either faction.
Why are you still talking like you're going to be lynched today?I don't care much about this game, no, but I'm competitive and stubborn and I don't like being mislynched for stupid reasons. I'm trying to make my death worth something to the town
You're beginning to post because the pressure is not on you as much. This should be our lynch for toDay because of this one post. I would be very surprised if freedom flipped Town after this post.Nope. I had given up when I thought I was a for-sure lynch and I'd be pretty busy with other stuff, but now it looks like you're picking on other people and I'll have plenty of time for the game.Freedom, have you given up?
I appreciate the feed back and game terminology correction. I can see your points on the differences. I differ slightly as the last two definitions I gave can lead to the scum's target choice. Inverse relationships can be just as discovering direct relations in discussion, thus I find the other 2 points in definition to be very close to your main definition. I will take note of your point andI'm going to break down your response:Wraith, what is your definition of doc hunting?
is actual doc hunting. This is the ONLY thing that is doc hunting. So, please, use the terminology correctly so you can stop confusing people.Discussing possible Doc players
: This is far too vague. I'm not sure how to classify it withplayers to not lynch
the amount of information you provided.
: This would be fishing, unless the roles have already been claimed, in which case it is just discussion.discussing who has what roles
So now I know where the confusion came from, but regardless of if CM was doc hunting or not, I do not see whatever it is you see with imopen2. I've asked you several times to explain what you see, but you've refused/failed to do so, so I'm just going to drop it. I don't agree that imopen2 is scum (though his buddying post was super creepy), so I'll just continue with the game.
Saying "X" scummy statement as C.M. did is still scummy as said by freedom:No. All he is saying is that he is a townie who is saying the wrong things. What is scummy about that?
Zem just reacted to Freedom's bite on Captain Murphy's hook of stupidity. Nothing out of the ordinary there as Zem is shining light in Freedom the best way he can."There could be a bit of town motivation. He
could just be a townie saying the wrong things, like I am. He could even be the doctor. But calling him scum is a good way to get more information from him."
Iamopen2 is right about the speed which Zem is progressing as being overly aggressive, but here Iamopen2 says this:You can only say Murphy is scum if you think a veteran player would knowingly make that slip. Don't buy it.
Freedom is the lynch, go.
You can copy and paste from my post above.
Lynch!
Freedom is defending Captain Murphy's tar baby, but Zem is weak in arguement to think that slip up is "pro choice play". Zem might be in a scum team from this slip up on here, butWhy are you in such a hurry? I haven't seen anything scummy from freedom yet.
If someone admits to being scum; do we lynch? Sarcastic intentions or not? Zem is following his consistent attack with a call for votes. Nothing I have not seen before, and why are so many throwing scum posts out this game (fate, Freedom, Iamopen2, and Freedom)? Although, Zem does embelish the Freedom attack cause I did not see anything of claimed scum, but poorNo point to rush until I know who is scum. You told us you were and even your last posts were scum posts. Now that the direction is clear I can lynch with no fear.
Hang.
He is right, but does not recognize the fact that Freedom is defending or explaining away the unforgivable act of requesting for Doc hunting.He said nothing of the sort. You're making things up.
At this point, he has not explained himself properly for defending C.M. as Zem read "learning more" as confirmation of wanting to Doc Hunt.Tell me, what made you change your mind about this? Why'd you go from "let's learn as much as we can today before we lynch someone" to "get freedom, NOW!"?
Iamopen2 ends with,You've got to be kidding me. OMGUS. I absolutlely hate this damn logic. Say you well thought point and stop this preppy high school talk. It's crap.
Unvote
nVote: Zem He commits here to the contradiction.
How does it feel to be mafia for the first time? Trash talks.
Btw, pretty sure Murphy is still scum since that explanation makes no sense (in this setup, giving the mafia any extra info is bad IMO). I don't understand your reasoning, and I will not participate in speculation on the doc target. This statement confuses me. Why vote against doc hunting with C.M. but vote for Zem who is hunting supporters/defeders (Freedom) of the Doc hunter (Captain Murphy). That is the contradiction that I find gives me evidence that Iamopen2 is scum.
Here is the post cliping to look at from Manders.Also, you say manders was the first to have a problem with your post. She also didn't say what the problems were. First is not always the best.
I believe that is your only response to Zem till this post from Iamopen2. I was unaware you had a problem with Zem at that moment. I find Iamopen2 to be making stuff up here.Zem wrote, Looking back,
I like imopen2's posts the least, so VOTE Iamopen2
Manders wrote, What don't you like about his posts?
You drive badass things.
You drive badass things.
Scum hunting is black and white in my view. I am not confused; focused, yes. Why you would not vote freedom without significant pressure is beyond me. If he flips scum; you are definitely next if a vote does not happen on you. I am concerned that scum has read DTR mafia and pushing a vote against freedom for his poor reads/calls in that/this game. Issue is that Freedom puts himself in these situations.The problem, wraith, and the reason you are so confused, is because you seem unable to see situations in anything other than black and white.
You see Murphy as committing an "unforgivable act," and you agree with my vote for him.
Then freedom makes a minor comment, playing devil's advocate.
Now, instead of pursuing Murphy, Zem goes nuts and tries to get freedom lynched.
I defend freedom because what he said is not something to be lynched for, especially before Murphy WHO MADE THE SUGGESTION TO DISCUSS DOC TARGETS.
You think that it is a contradiction to vote for Murphy and not vote for freedom; it is not. It is very hard to deal with you since your posts are unclear and your tunneling me for something that isn't even true.
I'm still
willing to lynch Zem or Murphy. I will not be voting freedom unless we get to the deadline without a consensus.
You drive badass things.
WTF does that mean? Seriously what does that mean?You're*
You drive badass things.
unvote@void, Indeed, Freedom is posting poorly for town, but if you read DTR mafia game; nothing has changed really. I don't see a problem voting for him as of now (last 2 posts were crap), but I REALLY want to go after Iamopen2. I don't want to let my gut feeling go against Iamopen2. If the vote for freedom increases significantly; I will support the vote for Freedom.
Ahhh, that makes sense. Thanks.It means that I incorrectly typed "your" instead of "you're" in my previous post and I was correcting it for clarity
You drive badass things.
I never said he was town, but in DTR mafia he posted very similar.unvote@void, Indeed, Freedom is posting poorly for town, but if you read DTR mafia game; nothing has changed really. I don't see a problem voting for him as of now (last 2 posts were crap), but I REALLY want to go after Iamopen2. I don't want to let my gut feeling go against Iamopen2. If the vote for freedom increases significantly; I will support the vote for Freedom.
Vote: Wriath
Wraith, why do you know that freedom is Town?
You drive badass things.
You drive badass things.
So to boil this down, you're hounding imopen for defending Freedom and not wanting to vote him.Scum hunting is black and white in my view. I am not confused; focused, yes. Why you would not vote freedom without significant pressure is beyond me. If he flips scum; you are definitely next if a vote does not happen on you. I am concerned that scum has read DTR mafia and pushing a vote against freedom for his poor reads/calls in that/this game. Issue is that Freedom puts himself in these situations.The problem, wraith, and the reason you are so confused, is because you seem unable to see situations in anything other than black and white.
You see Murphy as committing an "unforgivable act," and you agree with my vote for him.
Then freedom makes a minor comment, playing devil's advocate.
Now, instead of pursuing Murphy, Zem goes nuts and tries to get freedom lynched.
I defend freedom because what he said is not something to be lynched for, especially before Murphy WHO MADE THE SUGGESTION TO DISCUSS DOC TARGETS.
You think that it is a contradiction to vote for Murphy and not vote
for freedom; it is not. It is very hard to deal with you since your posts are unclear and your tunneling me for something that isn't even true.
I'm still willing to lynch Zem or Murphy. I will not be voting freedom unless we get to the deadline without a consensus.
Son, I want you to know that no matter what happens between your mother and me, it's all your fault.
Sure!So to boil this down, you're hounding imopen for defending Freedom and not wanting to vote him.Scum hunting is black and white in my view. I am not confused; focused, yes. Why you would not vote freedom without significant pressure is beyond me. If he flips scum; you are definitely next if a vote does not happen on you. I am concerned that scum has read DTR mafia and pushing a vote against freedom for his poor reads/calls in that/this game. Issue is that Freedom puts himself in these situations.The problem, wraith, and the reason you are so confused, is because you seem unable to see situations in anything other than black and white.
You see Murphy as committing an "unforgivable act," and you agree with my vote for him.
Then freedom makes a minor comment, playing devil's advocate.
Now, instead of pursuing Murphy, Zem goes nuts and tries to get freedom lynched.
I defend freedom because what he said is not something
to be lynched for, especially before Murphy WHO MADE THE SUGGESTION TO DISCUSS DOC TARGETS.
You think that it is a contradiction to vote for Murphy and not vote for freedom; it is not. It is very hard to deal with you since your posts are unclear and your tunneling me for something that isn't even true.
I'm still willing to lynch Zem or Murphy. I will not be voting freedom unless we get to the deadline without a consensus.
And then you're defending Freedom and not
wanting to vote him.
THIS is a contradiction. Care to explain?
You drive badass things.
Mannerisms (Freedom) and the points they choose to ignore when I show the evidence (Manders).Also, I will point out that defending someone or agreeing with them does not mean they are necessarily on the same team. For example, I defended freedom and manders defended me. How could we all be on the same scum team?
You drive badass things.
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