Fire and Ice Mafia - Game Over!

[Captain Murphy]

I even say "When you push a player to L-2 its because they are scummy"

The claim didn't make him scummy, the claim is a "meh, lets lynch then" response

[rcwraspy]

I even say "When you push a player to L-2 its because they are scummy"

The claim didn't make him scummy, the claim is a "meh, lets lynch then" response

fair enough.

[Kazekirimaru]

Vote Count 6!
meow

Stardust (0)
freedom (3) - Fate, Captain Murphy, Void
rcwraspy (0)
zemanjaski (2) - imopen2, freedom
Void (0)
Wraith223 (0)
Fate (0)
Captain Murphy (1) - Manders
DroppinSuga (0)
Manders (0)
rezombad (0)
(G_R) (0)
imopen2 (5) - Stardust, rcwraspy, Wraith223, zemanjaski, DroppinSuga

Not Voting (2) - rezombad, (G_R)

With 13 alive, it is 7 to lynch.

Deadline is: 30 January, 2014 11:59PM EST

Manders has been prodded.

[imopen2]

Stardust: I answered you in post 197

[Stardust]

Stardust: I answered you in post 197

You answered one of the three questions.

[imopen2]

I answered two of them.

1. I don't know if you are scum. It felt that was early, still feels possible (you certainly haven't convinced me you are town), but I don't know.
2. (This is the one I didn't answer) I dropped you for Murphy and Zem since they are much more scummy than you this game.
3. The reason I didn't ask you why you knew that I knew that you knew that I knew...is because I didn't see your post where you said "ohhhh pick me!!"

[imopen2]

It felt that way*

[Manders]

It's been a busy couple of days. I will catch up and post ASAP.

[Stardust]

So... imopen's the lynch today, right? He be postin' but he ain't helpin'.

[Captain Murphy]

I'm happy if it has more support but again, freedom is worse at this point

[zemanjaski]

Noob though I may be, I am more confidant about imopen2 than freedom.

[Stardust]

I'm happy if it has more support but again, freedom is worse at this point

I disagree. freedom's sincerity has given me pause and imopen has basically just been doing the ol' duck and cover the last couple days.

[( G_R )]

Mmm. I seriously doubt that sincerity. It felt fake then and it feels fake still. I'm not convinced imopen2 is scum and I don't feel comfortable lynching him D1. We'll see tomorrow.

Vote Freedom

[zemanjaski]

What about imopen2 looks Town to you?

[Void]

What about imopen2 looks Town to you?

What? Where did G_R state he is Town reading imopen2?

This is a huge jump from what G_R just posted.

[Wraith223]

When G_R thinks Iamopen2 is not scum; that is an auto find of town. Logic sir.

[Jack]

No, zem put a bit of a spin on his words. GR said that he was "not convinced imopen2 is scum." This doesn't mean that he thinks he is town. It doesn't even mean that he doesn't think he's scum. It just means that he has more conviction in his scum read on me than he does in his scum read on imopen2.

[imopen2]

So... imopen's the lynch today, right? He be postin' but he ain't helpin'.

Helping with what? Until the last few posts, no one seemed willing to consider me as anything other than scum. I've pointed out my issues with zem's behavior, and with Murphy's earlier. I can only say the same things so many times, and I'm not nearly invested in this game enough to change everyone's mind.

Lynch me and then find the scum. Or skip the lynch and find them right now.

[Wraith223]

So... imopen's the lynch today, right? He be postin' but he ain't helpin'.

Helping with what? Until the last few posts, no one seemed willing to consider me as anything other than scum. I've pointed out my issues with zem's behavior, and with Murphy's earlier. I can only say the same things so many times, and I'm not nearly invested in this game enough to change everyone's mind.

Lynch me and then find the scum. Or skip the lynch and find them right now.

Instead of being a huge ass as you were to me when I got wrongly shit on; I recommend you stop saying
that you are not invested in the game. If that is the case; quit and ask for a replacement as I did. It is poor character to say that you are not interested in this game, thus don't lynch me cause of my disinterest.

Freedom, Calling someone not scum is placing them in null or town. That is how logic works. You can't make a claim and not be called on the inferred findings. If you do not understand this; please continue to look scummy. Do you find Iamopen2 scum? Would you vote for him? Do find his contradiction voting weak scum or strong scum. If not scum; why is he town to you? Lastly, This post I responded to Iamopen2; do you find is reaction of disinterest very poor town or scum? Why?

[imopen2]

Please stop calling it a contradiction. There was never any contradiction.

Also, I'm not a quitter. I'm an ass. It means I'm stubborn. I'm not going to let you and Zem continuously misconstrue what I've said. I'm just going to keep pointing out your terrible reading skills and "logic" until I'm lynched and vindicated.

[Link]

Unvote
Vote: imopen

[Jack]

Wraith: now you're saying "null or town," when before you said "auto find of town." And why did you say "if you do not understand this; please continue to look scummy"? Those two things aren't related at all.

I don't find imopen2 scum. Here, I am saying what I mean. I'm not saying I find him town (though he is leaning that way), particularly because I know he has a really good scum game. The only reason I started calling him scum Day 2 of DTR was because Suga told me he was when I copped him. Before that, I couldn't get a read on him at all. So don't listen to me about imopen2 at all. I would not vote for him, but he can easily be lynched without my participation. I'm still not sure what you're talking about with a contradiction in voting. Most of his actions have revolved around zem's case against me, and I have already explained quite thoroughly that imopen would have
good reasons to defend me whether he was scum or town if he thought I was town. I find his disinterest pro-town, because scum really can't give up on the game, since their team is so small. It could be a bluff, but my best guess is that he has a few irl things going on that take higher priority than a game of mafia.

[Wraith223]

Wraith: now you're saying "null or town," when before you said "auto find of town." And why did you say "if you do not understand this; please continue to look scummy"? Those two things aren't related at all.

I don't find imopen2 scum. Here, I am saying what I mean. I'm not saying I find him town (though he is leaning that way), particularly because I know he has a really good scum game. The only reason I started calling him scum Day 2 of DTR was because Suga told me he was when I copped him. Before that, I couldn't get a read on him at all. So don't listen to me about imopen2 at all. I would not vote for him, but he can easily be lynched without my participation. I'm still not sure what you're talking about with a
contradiction in voting. Most of his actions have revolved around zem's case against me, and I have already explained quite thoroughly that imopen would have good reasons to defend me whether he was scum or town if he thought I was town. I find his disinterest pro-town, because scum really can't give up on the game, since their team is so small. It could be a bluff, but my best guess is that he has a few irl things going on that take higher priority than a game of mafia.

Thank you for the response.
Read my post on my findings and request for votes against Iamopen2. Summery- He votes Captain Murphy for doc hunting. You give a devil's advocate read. Zem attacks you it as he sees scum defending scum. Iamopen2 changes his vote to Zem for going after you. I call him on his contradiction in reasoning. He rarely does that.
Captain Murphy could be scum as well for setting up the opposite scum team , but I don't know. Indeed, we could vote for a lynch without
you. Stick to your guns if you find my findings wrong.

Fate, why change your vote with little or no explanation?

[Stardust]

Fate, I still want an answer to my question earlier.

[rezombad]

Too much fucking mafia to catch up on.

wraith is town
fate is town

cm is probscum
zem is probscum
imopen is probscum
freedom is probscum

everyone else is probtown by default.

I'll get a couple more concrete reads tomorrow.

May we know what your reads are based on?

Reading mostly.

I'm going to move Stardust into my town pile because reasons.

[imopen2]

But wraith, it's not a contradiction.

I vote Murphy for a reason
Freedom says "maybe that reason is not scummy, maybe it is"
Zem goes batshit insane and starts making terrible points against freedom for what seemed to me to be an innocuous comment.
You think this is some kind of contradiction and won't shut up about it.

If freedom had said "MURPHY IS INNOCENT! THESE ARE REASONS"
And I had agreed with him while leaving my vote on Murphy, that would be a contradiction.

In mafia people give reads, and sometimes they test reactions. Sometimes they even withhold their reads. Just because someone SAYS something that differs from someone else, doesn't mean they are one alignment or the other, or even that they actually believe what they said. You need to look for BEHAVIOR that stands out as contradictory, and voting for Zem was not scummy behavior, nor a contradiction.

nAssuming that people who have a different way of viewing the situation are scum is a poor strategy and I think you can attest to that fact.

Defending freedom also does not mean he is my scum-buddy. I actually think that in this setup I wouldn't miss my teammate that much if I were scum since I wouldn't have to worry about who I am interacting with. If freedom was my buddy I would be playing te worst game of mafia I've yet played

That being said, I don't know of freedom is town, just like he doesn't know if I am either, but I don't think he is a good lynch today.

[DroppinSuga]

I'd bet 100 bucks that Fate is scum.

[imopen2]

Then Unvote me before they quicklynch

[imopen2]

Hammer*

[DroppinSuga]

unvote

I want more discussion before we lynch, regardless of who it is today.

[rcwraspy]

Sell me a case, I'm listening.

I don't like his last self aware post ("look how confidant and Town I am now!") but otherwise he's pretty null.

There could be a bit of town motivation. He could just be a townie saying the wrong things, like I am. He could even be the doctor. But calling him scum is a good way to get more information from him.

Unvote, vote
Freedom

You were asking for it with this post. Scum no. 1 found. All aboard the wagon. Lynch lynch lynch lynch lynch.

Z I know others have hit on this, but I've got to come back to it.

What in the world convinced you so thoroughly in the span of 3 posts, and without Fate selling you on it like you asked? Fate asked Freedom about buddying you, but what did you dislike in his response that made you react this way?

[Stardust]

I'd bet 100 bucks that Fate is scum.

And I'd bet 100 bucks that you are town.

What is your reasoning?

[zemanjaski]

unvote

I want more discussion before we lynch, regardless of who it is today.

More discussion for you not to take part in? Continuing your trend of utter uselessness I see.

[zemanjaski]

Then Unvote me before they quicklynch

I'm probably misconstruing you because that's what I do, but yyoure going to call it a quicklynch after this many days?

[zemanjaski]

Sell me a case, I'm listening.

I don't like his last self aware post ("look how confidant and Town I am now!") but otherwise he's pretty null.

There could be a bit of town motivation. He could just be a townie saying the wrong things, like I am.[
/u] He could even be the doctor. But calling him scum is a good way to get more information from him.

Unvote, vote Freedom

You were asking for it with this post. Scum no. 1 found. All aboard the wagon. Lynch lynch lynch lynch lynch.

Z I know others have hit on this, but I've got to come back to it.

What in the world convinced you so thoroughly in the span of 3 posts, and without Fate selling you on it like you asked? Fate asked Freedom about buddying you, but what did you dislike in his response that made you react this way?

Because that's an enormously scummy response? You've read the thread, others have asked about it.

[zemanjaski]

What about imopen2 looks Town to you?

What? Where did G_R state he is Town reading imopen2?

This is a huge jump from what G_R just posted.

Only if your reading and posting too quickly. If GR doesn't think he his scum there must be some Town behaviour that he has observed. I certainly did not state that GR thinks imopen2 is Town; how you read that I have no idea.

[imopen2]

Then Unvote me before they quicklynch

I'm probably misconstruing you because that's what I do, but yyoure going to call it a quicklynch after this many days?

I quickly changed it to hammer. I was just referring to the fact that fate put me to L-1 and if suga was going to Unvote he Should do it now. I'm guessing at least 2 sum are on my wagon, maybe more, but there is probably 1 who is not so I didn't want that one to hammer me

[zemanjaski]

Fair enough.

[Stardust]

unvote

I want more discussion before we lynch, regardless of who it is today.

More discussion for you not to take part in? Continuing your trend of utter uselessness I see.

Lay off this crap. You don't need to attack people to be a good mafia player.

I quickly changed it to hammer. I was just referring to the fact that fate put me to L-1 and if suga was going to Unvote he Should
do it now. I'm guessing at least 2 sum are on my wagon, maybe more, but there is probably 1 who is not so I didn't want that one to hammer me

Probably the one who's not voting is your buddy, so you should be okay.

For context, I reread imopen's posts again and am just about 100% sure he's scum at this point. We should probably just lynch him before this Day gets stagnant.

[zemanjaski]

It's kind of ridiculous for a player who's added nothing to stall like that.