[Fedoras of Salvation] - White Knights ITT

[redthirst]

If I play Black-based Rakdos, I'll certainly be testing about 4 of them.

[zemanjaski]

Haha, yeah, that's a good card.

[Kaitscralt]

I don't even like the artwork on Spiteful Returned, the way he is tilted combined with the aura coming off him make it look like he is beig afflicted by an enemy spell.

[Wraith223]

My condolences Zem on Phenax. I know you were looking forward to a GOOD mill boss. UB and red always getting the shaft.

Whelming Wave seems to printed for Kiora synergy. Whatever.

Spiteful Returned is cool, but needs recursion to be useful.

Thought I mentioned Herald of Torment earlier. Did not see it Zem? I might use it over Nightveil Spector to get that extra damage in or make Garry a dangerous clock late game.

[zemanjaski]

Yeah I must have missed the Herald being spoiled. Its pretty terrific.

[redthirst]

They're also like $1.00 on eBay and $1.50 at SCG.

[Kaitscralt]

Duno about terrific, I don't hate it though

[redthirst]

I'm a pretty big fan of cards that can fill multiple spots of your curve. A card that's hot on turn 3 and turns something else into a bomb on turn 5 is where I like to be.

I also like the fact that even though it's a psedo 5cc spell, it'll never cost you more than 3 life if you flip it with Pain Seer. That's not a huge deal, but it is a nice bonus. Also, regarding the synergy with Pain Seer, a 5/5 Flying Pain Seer is much more likely to continue to draw you cards past turn 3-4.

[TBuzzsaw]

I would be shocked if there isn't a Inspired red creature that deals damage when it untaps. I have a feeling it'll be over cost though.

[Pedros]

So tired on meta on mtgo.

Last 10 rounds was 8 black based devotion decks. I know it is good matchup for red decks (even more controling token versions), however it is frustrating to lose from 20 from 3 merchants with 2 assembles on board... (shocked once and he had connections 4 + 6 + 8 + 2 = dead...)

Hope something changes with new set.

Looking positive on Br based rakdos deck. HUGE curve possible:

1 drops: Cacklers / Tormented Hero
2 drops: Spike Jester / Pack Rat / Pain Seer / Rakdos's Shread Freak / Tymaret, the Murder King / Rix Maadi Guildmage /
3 drops: Herald of Torment/ Agent of Fates / Dead Reveler / Lifebane Zombie / Mogis's Marauder / Nightveil Specter / Xatrid Necromancer
4 drops: Exava / Desecration Demon / Lilianas Reaver/ Purporos / Erebos / Mogis / Chandra
5 drops: Gray Merchant / Dragon

@ Chandra and Dragon - according to Frank Karsten you need 18 red sources for 4 turn Chandra and 16 for
5 turn Dragon.

Plus a lot of awsome removal, discard. One of my friend said he won 200 tixes in 2 and 8 man queues in 2 days with mono black agro (with good sb plan vs black - he had ereboses, spectres and dark betrayals for this matchup). Finished X-4 in GP Vienna.

[Kaitscralt]

2 tix to enter with a prize pack being worth 3.3 tix, your friend is either exaggerating or needs to go outside

also mono black aggro? sounds shit.

[Jack]

Snowstorm; no school. Fuck yes. MAFIAAAAAA!

[MattT]

Not a fan of the creature mode and don't think it compares to Spike Jester. They both do 3 damage to an opponent on a clear board, but Jester does it one turn faster and trades with more - and I'll take likely trading up over guaranteed 2 damage to an opponent in most cases. Not really sure how good the Bestow is... my initial gut response is "not good enough", though.

Hence SR being the second choice. That said I think Dos Rakdos other 2 slot choices all are debatable for different reasons: Shred-Freak to weak, Ashley mana dependent, Pack Rat susceptible to the new black removal and slower. Trading is good and coveted, but this is also the deck featuring Chandra with Falter plus loads of removal.

[Kaitscralt]

Snowstorm; no school. Fuck yes. MAFIAAAAAA!

how old are you nucka

[Jack]

Seventeen.

[Kaitscralt]

I have a real question for you bums, why do you force BR aggro every season? It hasn't been a good deck since zombies and I am sure you didn't play that version back then because you couldn't call it a unique but bad deck name. This has been bothering me for a while. UW Control has always been my favorite color combination but I don't play it when it's not working.

[rcwraspy]

I have a real question for you bums, why do you force BR aggro every season? It hasn't been a good deck since zombies and I am sure you didn't play that version back then because you couldn't call it a unique but bad deck name. This has been bothering me for a while. UW Control has always been my favorite color combination but I don't play it when it's not working.

We always brew it, but that doesn't mean we always bring it to events.

[Kaitscralt]

As an outside observer, I get really tired of seeing it brought up, when even in MTGO Daily's it has put up basically zilch results since Pre-Av Restored Standard. I guess that's my fault for choosing to observe, but there's not fuck all else to do around here.

[TubeHunter]

implying that we've been around for more than 2 seasons to brew it

[redthirst]

Because it keeps working? Despite your claims that it's not a good deck, it does well enough and normally wins me money - like significantly more than the deck cost to put together. If it didn't, then I wouldn't play it. That being said, I don't play MTGO and rarely play in events larger than 50 people so I'm not sure how well it'd work there.

Also, Kamahl keeps thanking my posts on Sally and I find myself not hating his. I'm pretty sure we're BFFs now. Just so y'all know.

[Valdarith]

BR currently unplayable because Marauder is hosed by mono black.

RB on the other hand...

[Dechs Kaison]

So, unlike all you scrubs, I don't even play standard. I refuse to.

There's only one thing that would make me play Standard (and subsequently Modern, when it rotated out).

Hymn Reprint.

[rcwraspy]

Also, Kamahl keeps thanking my posts on Sally and I find myself not hating his. I'm pretty sure we're BFFs now. Just so y'all know.

Just proving that if you cockslap someone frequently enough they'll get used to it.

[Valdarith]

Guess you won't ever be playing Standard, Dechs.

I do love me some Hymn to Tourach though. Criminally underplayed.

[windstrider]

The big draw for Rb Aggro last season can be summed up in two words: Falkenrath Aristocrat. That card had so many good things going for it that it was pretty much irresistible for me.

This season? Dreadbore and other tasty options like Rakdos's Return, Thoughtseize, and even Duress are good against a lot of things. Exava is doing good at the 4-drop slot. She's not Aristocrat, but she does nicely against a creature meta and gets damage in against control.

It may not be tier 1, but it can certainly steal some wins.

[Kaitscralt]

Because it keeps working? Despite your claims that it's not a good deck, it does well enough and normally wins me money - like significantly more than the deck cost to put together. If it didn't, then I wouldn't play it. That being said, I don't play MTGO and rarely play in events larger than 50 people so I'm not sure how well it'd work there.

Also, Kamahl keeps thanking my posts on Sally and I find myself not hating his. I'm pretty sure we're BFFs now. Just so y'all know.

if it keeps winning for you it's probably because you're a better player than most at your lgs, or your lgs is a budg caj haven where the zemanwooski's of the world reign king

[Kaitscralt]

The big draw for Rb Aggro last season can be summed up in two words: Falkenrath Aristocrat. That card had so many good things going for it that it was pretty much irresistible for me.

This season? Dreadbore and other tasty options like Rakdos's Return, Thoughtseize, and even Duress are good against a lot of things. Exava is doing good at the 4-drop slot. She's not Aristocrat, but she does nicely against a creature meta and gets damage in against control.

It may not be tier 1, but it can certainly steal some wins.

Falkenrath made the deck tier one, for a time, no doubt about it

[windstrider]

That color combination also transitions easily between Aggro and Control, giving it a lot of options vs. a diverse field. I never felt outclassed by any decks while playing Dos Rakis last season. It remains to be seen if the same holds true this season.

[Purp]

Looks like I will be forced to try a new archetype when BnG comes out. Buying all the Mono B cards now.

[Helios]

As an outside observer, I get really tired of seeing it brought up, when even in MTGO Daily's it has put up basically zilch results since Pre-Av Restored Standard. I guess that's my fault for choosing to observe, but there's not fuck all else to do around here.

Well how many strong players are playing it on MTGO? The same thing was said about Walter White, but then Z & MDU started winning dailies with it. Two players proved it was a good deck, then people started taking it to SCG events and winning.

[windstrider]

Do not underestimate the power of the dark side.

[photodyer]

What redthirst and strider said, Kait...Dos Rakis (RtR set Standard) may not have been breaking big on the tournament circuit, but it was a damn strong deck and those of us who were brewing it were winning with it. After Gatecrash hit, it was substantially weaker within the meta, and even more so after DGM, but some were still winning with it because it had power and speed that had to be answered.

We tried going the same route in Theros Standard because again the combination allows for power and speed, but there was no getting past Devotion Black and Devotion Blue, so the deck has been a subject of fringe discussion and play. With BNG, Wizards is handing BR/RB some pretty kick tools to go along with remarkable black removal, so we will follow the power creep and see if we can unseat the meta-controlling decks...I have no doubt that some iteration of BR is going to be in the running, but it's still too early to know
whether to push aggro, midrange or control.

[Valdarith]

All I know is that I am net positive with RB on MODO with all the mono black, mono blue, and UW control running around. It attacks that meta quite well, much like MDU has shown with RW.

[DarthStabber]

Unless he's worth a lot of money I can see myself passing phenax, especially if there is some good removal in the pack.

If he's in my sealed pool then I will look more interested.

[rcwraspy]

also worth mentioning is that at the beginning of Theros pro players thought it was a good color combination too. B/r Demons and Dragons was attempted at the Pro Tour, but didn't do well against the debut of devotion decks.

[Dechs Kaison]

Phenax: I'm so happy to see that WotC is taking Dimir colors in a new and interesting direction.

[windstrider]

Compelling options for BR include Tymaret, the Burger King and Underworld Cerberus. We need to try those two out. If we can pressure them early, the Cerberus is a monster threat that even provides value after it's removed. Maybe lots of little hasty things that we can cast easily after the Cerberus is removed would be good. Throw in Hammer to make everything hasty and provide its own threats, and it gets better.

[Kaitscralt]

No brewing allowed

[rcwraspy]

brew you

[DocLawless]

I don't like R/B this season. I miss Falkenrath Aristocrat too much.