[BNG] Flame-Wreathed Phoenix & Mogis, God of Slaughter

[Midnight_v]

You're all wrong and/or stupid since it's intrinsically obvious that this season is all about the Borderland Minotaur.

Needs haste, +2/+2, flying and indestructible before it's not trash.

Intrinsically good card though, because your opponent doesn't get to make a choice.

Barely witty at all... asshat there's NOTHING wrong with
wanting good cards.

Would we play a 5/5 flyer for 4 right now? Maybe.

Would we play a 3/3 flyer with haste and recursion right now? Definitely.

Does giving your opponent the choice diminish the viability of said card... yes.

Will we play it if given nothing else? Most likely, but its clear this isn't a card that makes you say. "FInnally! so good!"
So you can fuck all the way off.

"Bottom line, Hellrider and Falkenrath Aristocrat are naught but memories in the 4 slot...we all need to start looking at incoming cards in terms of what we are working with now, not our historical icons"

Those cards are some key things that brought R/x decks to the forefront ultimately (along with thundermaw). So of course thats the type of thing we're going to be looking for. So yeah were comparing good cards to mediocre cards. Thats all.

and there are currently playable cards in Standard (Hammer and Exava, for example) that can twist
the Tribute clause

I mentioned hammer earlier, but... yeah I'd like to see your theoretical Exava, Flame~phoenix deck also. Good luck!@

[Kaitscralt]

someone's humor gauge is broken

also, another onar variant from texas? does texas have a big russian population?

[Stardust]

[TubeHunter]

all hail the vanilla 4/3

[Midnight_v]

someone's humor gauge is broken

also, another onar variant from texas? does texas have a big russian population?

No.

[MattT]

I think Mogis may have some merit in the sb exchanging Erebos as he exaggarates the beatdown aspect of aggro. Building to animate him is a fools errand. I just want them to have to choose between taking two and worry about the burn in my hand or sac their blocker.

[Thrillho]

Fanatic of Mogis does something when it comes into play and sees play. Unless you're trying to tell me a 4-mana 3/3 haste or a 5/5 without haste that dies after entering the battlefield because your opponent isn't a rock somehow supplants cards in the current standard of red deck or is going to make an entirely new red deck on its lonesome, there is no argument.

Basically, do you think this card is better than the current 4cc+ cards in Standard red decks. I don't think it is. I don't know what's hard to see about it or how I'm being thick headed because this card seems obviously not as good as other 4cc cards you can play in red decks.

[Thrillho]

Here, there are 3 mono-red-ish decks in the top 8 of this premier event: https://www.wizards.com/Magic/digital/M ... rn/6654061

tell me which of those cards would be better as this phoenix.

[redthirst]

There's a difference between Red decks and Red Devotion. Fanatic of Mogis is a pile in any deck that doesn't want to put as many Red Mana symbols on the board as possible - it is absolutely unplayable except in that one deck.

So the argument that any deck that could play Phoenix will just play Fanatic instead is ridiculous.

[Thrillho]

Ok but how many of the players of red devotion even placed and how many players of ... Not red devotion I guess? Made t8?

[Thrillho]

Or is your assumption that a not aggressively costed 3/3 haste is going to put mono red devotion on the board? This is a serious not troll question, I am genuinely concerned that a 3/3 flying haste will make the difference between "a pile of aggressive red cards" and a deck where the goal is all of the red mana symbols.

[Thrillho]

I want to understand what it's like to live in a world where this card rocks your socks off. I was let down by Browbeat and Breaking Point at a young age and I want to recapture innocence lost.

[Mcdonalds]

Thrillo, I still haven't figured out if your serious or not

Perhaps it's best if I don't figure out

[redthirst]

I'm almost positive these posts are genuinely how Thrillho thinks, which is depressing. I mean, you wouldn't think anyone could seriously make the claim that literally any deck that might consider playing Phoenix would just play Fanatic instead since there are lots of ways to build red decks and only one single style of those red decks that wants Fanatic. In addition, you probably wouldn't think anyone could confuse "this card is fine" with "holy shit this card is bonkers!" Finally, you wouldn't think someone who thinks as much of his abilities to evaluate cards as Thrillho would confuse something like Phoenix (which gives your opponent the choice between two creature-based threats) with something like Browbeat (which gives your opponent the choice between two completely different effects).

But at least what they lack in quality and clarity they more than make up for in quantity.

[Mcdonalds]

I was talking about the capturing lost innocence part, not about whether the card was good or not.

[redthirst]

Gotcha. Well then that was probably just an asinine attempt to be condescending.

[Mcdonalds]

Asinine

Ass-i-nine

ASS-A-NINE

---

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cvhwMeHp1Yg

[Thrillho]

Redthirst, did you realize that my claim was this card doesn't require small novellas to evaluate and that my claim about the card was that it's worse than comparable cards available with it? Probably not because you are an illiterate buffoon.

Punisher cards have never been good. This card is a punisher card. Maybe it is in the realm of "best" punisher card. That does not make it less of a card that allows your opponent to choose whether or not the card is good and, assuming your opponent is a goldfish, they will probably err on the side of not screwing themselves. But I'm also sure Steam Augury's stock is going to skyrocket any second now. I wait on baited breath.

[redthirst]

If it doesn't require a novella to evaluate I'd appreciate it if you could keep your evaluations to less than a dozen posts.

Also, I can read your posts, it's you that seems to have an issue knowing what you've said. I don't hold that against you though because you're a great card analyst and your posts aren't worth reading the first time, much less remembering... which is why it's so annoying that you need a minimum of 3 different posts to cobble together something that resembles a card evaluation.

Here's my points simplified so even you should be able to understand them:
1. Not any Red deck will run FoM over this because not every Red deck wants to run FoM in the first place.
2. "This card might be okay" is not the same as "Holy fuck balls dat card so fucking ridic!"
3. The choice between a creature-based threat and another creature-based threat =/= the choice between a card effect and a
completely different card effect.
4. You're a great card analyst.

I don't think anyone can dispute any of those points.

[Mcdonalds]

You two need to hate fuck each other and get it over with

[Thrillho]

How's your job being a cardboard cutout for racist minority caricatures to shoot at going, redclosethomosexual?

[Thrillho]

I ask since nothing you said has anything to do with what I was saying, so I assumed you were making casual conversation.

[Thrillho]

You two need to hate fuck each other and get it over with

He couldn't please his ex wife, so it's not worth my time.

[Mcdonalds]

You two need to hate fuck each other and get it over with

He couldn't please his ex wife, so it's not worth my time.

Look I don't care how small he is, just fuck each other and get it over with, you two constantly releasing sexual tension via flinging poo at one another has got to end.

[redthirst]

You know how sometimes two people act like they hate each other but really there's a kind of grudging respect they share and, eventually, their relationship will mature to the point that, while they don't always agree, they do value the other's opinion?

This isn't like that.

Thrillho is just legitimately the dumbest mother fucker I've ever had the displeasure of interacting with.

[Kaitscralt]

I like the way he moves

[Checkbox]

You two need to hate fuck each other and get it over with

He couldn't please his ex wife, so it's not worth my time.

Look I don't care how small he is, just fuck each other and get it over with, you two constantly releasing sexual tension via flinging poo at one another has got to end.

just duck

[Kaitscralt]

It's true about the ex wife though.

[redthirst]

The Gutter uses Ex Wife!

It's not very effective.

[Kaitscralt]

It's super effective.

[redthirst]

You got me good.

[Kaitscralt]

I know.

[imopen2]

Well this has been fun

[imopen2]

Oops, wrong thread

[Schuesseled]

If you happened to have Exava out the opponent would be forced to give you the hasty 3/3 that goes back to your hand if/when it dies (or deal with a hasty 5/5 flier).

Even better is to play a haste enabler after casting the phoenix.

With the insane amount of mana G/R devotion decks can generate, it is not inconceivable to envisage a turn 4/5 play of Flame-wreathed phoenix, opponent pays tribute whilst examine his detention sphere in hand in loving detail. Only for his smarter gruul opponent to tap down nykthos shrine to nyx and cast Xenagos, god of revels, and swing in for 10 flying straight to his face.

[zemanjaski]

As much as I want the Phoenix to be good, it just isn't. There isn't an amazing 4 drop creature in red right now, so instead of trying to re-create decks of the past, something else needs to be found.

[zemanjaski]

Fanatic of Mogis isn't the reason that Red Devotion decks are good, but it is the best 4-drop in that shell.

[Kaitscralt]

i takes a big man to admit he is wrong

today that man was zem

[LP, of the Fires]

Fanatic of Mogis isn't the reason that Red Devotion decks are good, but it is the best 4-drop in that shell.

Devotion red wouldn't be close to playable without fanatic of mogis

[zemanjaski]

You're not actually disagreeing with me.

Playing is synonymous for "good". The other 4 drops would make the deck less good; hence Fanatic of Mogis is the best 4 drop in that shell. It is the sum of all the moving parts that make the deck good, not that 1 card.