R/b Aggro aka "Dos Rakis"
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Been doing some goldfishing with the deck and it is insanely powerful...
I will say I want to see Chandra more often, and might make it 2 chandra mainboard, although I'd want a whip or 2 in the side.
I think I'm going to grab up all the pieces to the deck at fnm and give it a try there, cause this thing ks silly strong.
Oh, and as far as consistency, it doesn't seem as inconsistent as I'd have thought. That is another reason I kinda want 2 chandra main though, as that psuedo card-advantage is just silly good. And the falter of course.
I will say I want to see Chandra more often, and might make it 2 chandra mainboard, although I'd want a whip or 2 in the side.
I think I'm going to grab up all the pieces to the deck at fnm and give it a try there, cause this thing ks silly strong.
Oh, and as far as consistency, it doesn't seem as inconsistent as I'd have thought. That is another reason I kinda want 2 chandra main though, as that psuedo card-advantage is just silly good. And the falter of course.
I, for one, would like to welcome our new firebreathing narwhal overlords.
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Thought I'd share my latest iteration to see if anyone has some comments.
[deck=Jdub's current Dos Packis]Creatures(22)
4 Rakdos Cackler
4 Spike Jester
4 Pack Rat
4 Chandra's Phoenix
3 Exava, Rakdos Blood Witch
3 Stormbreath Dragon
Spells (14)
//Removal
2 Dreadbore
2 Ultimate Price
1 Mizzium Mortars
//Burn
4 Lightning Strike
4 Magma Jet
//Misc
1 Whip of Erebos
Land (24)
7 Mountain
5 Swamp
4 Blood Crypt
4 Rakdos Guildgate
4 Mutavault
Sideboard (15)
3 Dark Betrayal
3 Thoughtseize
2 Devour Flesh
2 Doom Blade
2 Mizzium Mortars
2 Erebos, God of the Dead
1 Dreadbore
[/deck]
Biggest change is Seizes in the SB but I've found them to be invaluable in game 2s where you're on the draw or against passive counter-fests. Toil//Trouble was a favorite when I used it for card draw but y'all are talking Chandra additions main deck and I'm thinking that may be where I go too (in which case I
think Seize is stronger against control anyway).
[deck=Jdub's current Dos Packis]Creatures(22)
4 Rakdos Cackler
4 Spike Jester
4 Pack Rat
4 Chandra's Phoenix
3 Exava, Rakdos Blood Witch
3 Stormbreath Dragon
Spells (14)
//Removal
2 Dreadbore
2 Ultimate Price
1 Mizzium Mortars
//Burn
4 Lightning Strike
4 Magma Jet
//Misc
1 Whip of Erebos
Land (24)
7 Mountain
5 Swamp
4 Blood Crypt
4 Rakdos Guildgate
4 Mutavault
Sideboard (15)
3 Dark Betrayal
3 Thoughtseize
2 Devour Flesh
2 Doom Blade
2 Mizzium Mortars
2 Erebos, God of the Dead
1 Dreadbore
[/deck]
Biggest change is Seizes in the SB but I've found them to be invaluable in game 2s where you're on the draw or against passive counter-fests. Toil//Trouble was a favorite when I used it for card draw but y'all are talking Chandra additions main deck and I'm thinking that may be where I go too (in which case I
think Seize is stronger against control anyway).
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Quick report, with 1 Rakdos Return in SB in place of Toil/Trouble
Junk Midrange 2-0
Naya Midrange 2-0
Black Devo 2-0
Rw Devo 2-1
Rw Devo 0-2
Black Devo 2-0
Jund Midrange 2-0
UW Control 2-0
Red Agro 2-0
Esper Midrange 0-2
Rw Devo 1-2 (remember always kill on your turn. Got killed couse he had 3rd Nyktos and 2nd Fanatic on 2 cards and mana exatcly to cast both and pump weirds to kill me)
Wb Humans 2-0
Wb Humans 1-2
Mono U Devo 1-2
Rw Burn 2-1
Junk Midrange 2-0
Naya Midrange 2-0
Black Devo 2-0
Rw Devo 2-1
Rw Devo 0-2
Black Devo 2-0
Jund Midrange 2-0
UW Control 2-0
Red Agro 2-0
Esper Midrange 0-2
Rw Devo 1-2 (remember always kill on your turn. Got killed couse he had 3rd Nyktos and 2nd Fanatic on 2 cards and mana exatcly to cast both and pump weirds to kill me)
Wb Humans 2-0
Wb Humans 1-2
Mono U Devo 1-2
Rw Burn 2-1
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I've not played at all for a few days but reading through the thread I like where you are at with the list Pedros, even though I don't have any RR
Thanks to NerdBoyWonder for the awesome sig
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Wb humans I think I just had bad draw or some kind of bad play. I remember we traded so I was left with Exava(from priest) and he got Dryad, I unleashed exava and after combat he played 2 more guys plus he had spear on board, I just run out of removal and couldnt block (was at healthy 10 btw)
vs Esper Midrange I lost to double obzedat. This matchup is strange BTW, I dont really know how to sb. Should I be offensive or defensive? Is Rat good or not? (He has detention spheres and verdict so it seems bad)
vs Bw control he had 5 Blood barons in 2 games and I couldnt draw any removal for them...
Also dont get me wrong, today I probably played around 25 matches online, and I lost around 7 only. Deck works fine, need probably more tuning and better playing (I muliganed a ton today, mostly lack of lands)
vs Esper Midrange I lost to double obzedat. This matchup is strange BTW, I dont really know how to sb. Should I be offensive or defensive? Is Rat good or not? (He has detention spheres and verdict so it seems bad)
vs Bw control he had 5 Blood barons in 2 games and I couldnt draw any removal for them...
Also dont get me wrong, today I probably played around 25 matches online, and I lost around 7 only. Deck works fine, need probably more tuning and better playing (I muliganed a ton today, mostly lack of lands)
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- RaidaTheBlade
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Honestly, Pedros's manabase has been working great for me so far. Color screw has only rarely happened once or twice, and land screw occurs the same amount as in any of the other decks, though land flood is much easier to deal with because of the rat.
I'm away from my computer for a few days, so haven't been doing much besides grinding out solitaire with it. I will say that I like seeing chandra more then the whip, and little feels as good as continually pitching the phoenix to the rats, then recurring it with chana's +1.
I don't think there's space in the 60 to fit it to 2 chandra, 1 whip, so I personally am voting for 2 chandra main, and a whip in the side.
That said, I am definitely gonna try this deck out in person. The power-level of it just feels insane.
I'm away from my computer for a few days, so haven't been doing much besides grinding out solitaire with it. I will say that I like seeing chandra more then the whip, and little feels as good as continually pitching the phoenix to the rats, then recurring it with chana's +1.
I don't think there's space in the 60 to fit it to 2 chandra, 1 whip, so I personally am voting for 2 chandra main, and a whip in the side.
That said, I am definitely gonna try this deck out in person. The power-level of it just feels insane.
I, for one, would like to welcome our new firebreathing narwhal overlords.
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I, not sry, we would be really glad if can do so.Ill figure out the correct mana base when I sober up.
Probably will move whip to sb for agro matchups as it is needed in this version, so please adjust mana knowing that part.
We still need double black around turn 5 for rat.
What do we cut from sb to make a room for whip?
How was rakdos return everyone? I think I cast it once only, howerer dont know if i wabt ut vs devo midrange deck, as they rarely keep cards in hand, they often dump everything on board. So it is useful only vs junk, esper (both control and midrange), jund and orzhov control?
I think I lot too many games vs obzedat, need to keep dark betralay for him only.
How should play against esper midrange? As an agro or
control deck?
My movie crashed while uploading, so sorry guys, will try to record sth later today.
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Honestly, Mono U and Esper have been my hardest matchups (Although mono white control kinda threw me for a loop. How do I deal with Pacifism, Celestial Flare, Fiendslayer Paladin all maindeck?). Against Esper I've been trying to go as hard as possible while switching in 3 thoughtseizes to get rid of Jace/Spheres and have had middling success.
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@Pedros/LaZerBurn: Those were sorta my thoughts too. I think 2 chandra main, and the whip in the sideboard instead of the flames would be the best idea. As far as adjusting the manabase for that, i think just swapping one mountain/swamp would work fairly well. So a 9/4 split of them.
Against the esper midrange/humans deck, I definitely think we need to go control. Most of their stuff folds to our removal, and I really think that going with the more control-oriented plan, and then beating them down with exava or dragon is the way to go.
If obzedat is that huge a problem (Not saying he isn't, dudes a pain in the ass), should we go up to 3 dark betrayal's in the board? Gives us as good of chances to remove him as they have to draw him.
Also, I haven't tested rakdos return much, but it seems to me like it'd have the same problems as toil//trouble. It's really strong against the control lists, that are starting to
recede in use(b/x devotion aside), while against more aggressive decks it just doesn't really impact the board state much, we tend to have card advantage anyway, and they don't have many cards in hand.
Both cards seem good, but I just don't know if they're worth a full three slots. I'd personally maybe knock it to 2, and give that third to dark betrayal, which given how widespread black is atm, would be extremely relevant.
Like I said in an earlier post, most of this is just based off of theorizing and solitaire, since I've been away from testing methods. I really like the list though, and I'm gonna be doing some testing with it all weekend, and I'll be sure to post my results in detail.
Against the esper midrange/humans deck, I definitely think we need to go control. Most of their stuff folds to our removal, and I really think that going with the more control-oriented plan, and then beating them down with exava or dragon is the way to go.
If obzedat is that huge a problem (Not saying he isn't, dudes a pain in the ass), should we go up to 3 dark betrayal's in the board? Gives us as good of chances to remove him as they have to draw him.
Also, I haven't tested rakdos return much, but it seems to me like it'd have the same problems as toil//trouble. It's really strong against the control lists, that are starting to
recede in use(b/x devotion aside), while against more aggressive decks it just doesn't really impact the board state much, we tend to have card advantage anyway, and they don't have many cards in hand.
Both cards seem good, but I just don't know if they're worth a full three slots. I'd personally maybe knock it to 2, and give that third to dark betrayal, which given how widespread black is atm, would be extremely relevant.
Like I said in an earlier post, most of this is just based off of theorizing and solitaire, since I've been away from testing methods. I really like the list though, and I'm gonna be doing some testing with it all weekend, and I'll be sure to post my results in detail.
I, for one, would like to welcome our new firebreathing narwhal overlords.
- magicdownunder
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[deck]Lands 24
3 Mutavault
4 Swamp
7 Mountain
4 Blood Crypt
4 Rakdos Guildgate
1 Temple of Silence
1 Temple of Triumph
Creatures 22
4 Rakdos Cackler
4 Pack Rat
4 Spike Jester
4 Chandra's Phoenix
3 Exava, Rakdos Blood Witch
3 Stormbreath Dragon
Others 14
4 Lightning Strike
4 Magma Jet
2 Ultimate Price
2 Dreadbore
2 Chandra, Pyromaster
Sideboard 15
3 Toil/Trouble
2 Erebos, God of the Dead
3 Doom Blade
1 Whip of Erebos
3 Mizzium Mortars
3 Dark Betrayal[/deck]
Thoughts on Manabase:
13 Black Sources is correct if your aiming for 2 black lands by T5 (13 black sources = over 50% of hitting 2 sources in your opening hand, by T5 you have over 70% chance - good odds esp, if you factor in Scry).
Due to lack of 1-Drops running 2-3 Scry lands is also acceptable.
Your running a very colour dependent deck, seeing 2x vaults in your opening hand is almost an instant
mulligan so just run 2 or 3.
Thoughts on SB:
I put whip on the boards for those who like it, also guys you NEED to run 2x Erebos or 3x Skullcrack otherwise you will lose to control or Esper Aggro.
I added the 7th 5th removal for MoW because.... he is MoW
The 3rd DB is for Bx Aggro/midrange
(p.s. you may want to think about RB Charm, opposing whips are really hard for RB to beat)
- - - - - - - - -
Going back to PyroDragons - good luck with further tweaks guys.
3 Mutavault
4 Swamp
7 Mountain
4 Blood Crypt
4 Rakdos Guildgate
1 Temple of Silence
1 Temple of Triumph
Creatures 22
4 Rakdos Cackler
4 Pack Rat
4 Spike Jester
4 Chandra's Phoenix
3 Exava, Rakdos Blood Witch
3 Stormbreath Dragon
Others 14
4 Lightning Strike
4 Magma Jet
2 Ultimate Price
2 Dreadbore
2 Chandra, Pyromaster
Sideboard 15
3 Toil/Trouble
2 Erebos, God of the Dead
3 Doom Blade
1 Whip of Erebos
3 Mizzium Mortars
3 Dark Betrayal[/deck]
Thoughts on Manabase:
13 Black Sources is correct if your aiming for 2 black lands by T5 (13 black sources = over 50% of hitting 2 sources in your opening hand, by T5 you have over 70% chance - good odds esp, if you factor in Scry).
Due to lack of 1-Drops running 2-3 Scry lands is also acceptable.
Your running a very colour dependent deck, seeing 2x vaults in your opening hand is almost an instant
mulligan so just run 2 or 3.
Thoughts on SB:
I put whip on the boards for those who like it, also guys you NEED to run 2x Erebos or 3x Skullcrack otherwise you will lose to control or Esper Aggro.
I added the 7th 5th removal for MoW because.... he is MoW
The 3rd DB is for Bx Aggro/midrange
(p.s. you may want to think about RB Charm, opposing whips are really hard for RB to beat)
- - - - - - - - -
Going back to PyroDragons - good luck with further tweaks guys.
Last edited by magicdownunder on Sat Dec 28, 2013 12:47 am, edited 2 times in total.
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Adding 5 Movies to my channel, with win in 8 man queue:
[deck]
3 Mutavault
7 Mountain
4 Swamp
4 Blood Crypt
4 Rakdos Guildgate
1 Temple of Silence
1 Temple of Triumph
4 Rakdos Cackler
4 Pack Rat
4 Spike Jester
4 Chandra's Phoenix
3 Exava, Rakdos Blood Witch
3 Stormbreath Dragon
4 Magma Jet
4 Lightning Strike
2 Ultimate Price
2 Dreadbore
2 Chandra, Pyromaster
Sideboard
3 Toil/Trouble
2 Erebos, God of the Dead
3 Doom Blade
1 Whip of Erebos
3 Dark Betrayal
3 Mizzium Mortars
[/deck]
MTGO 5-3-2-2 Standard 26.12.2013 Dos Rakis Round 1
MTGO 5-3-2-2 Standard 26.12.2013 Dos Rakis Round 2
MTGO 5-3-2-2 Standard 26.12.2013 Dos Rakis Round 3
[deck]
3 Mutavault
7 Mountain
4 Swamp
4 Blood Crypt
4 Rakdos Guildgate
1 Temple of Silence
1 Temple of Triumph
4 Rakdos Cackler
4 Pack Rat
4 Spike Jester
4 Chandra's Phoenix
3 Exava, Rakdos Blood Witch
3 Stormbreath Dragon
4 Magma Jet
4 Lightning Strike
2 Ultimate Price
2 Dreadbore
2 Chandra, Pyromaster
Sideboard
3 Toil/Trouble
2 Erebos, God of the Dead
3 Doom Blade
1 Whip of Erebos
3 Dark Betrayal
3 Mizzium Mortars
[/deck]
MTGO 5-3-2-2 Standard 26.12.2013 Dos Rakis Round 1
MTGO 5-3-2-2 Standard 26.12.2013 Dos Rakis Round 2
MTGO 5-3-2-2 Standard 26.12.2013 Dos Rakis Round 3
Last edited by Pedros on Thu Dec 26, 2013 7:27 pm, edited 2 times in total.
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Here's what I ended up deciding on. I've been having quite a lot of success with it as it answers a lot of the issues I was having with spot removal and verdicts ruining my day.
[deck=Jdub's current Dos Packis]//Creatures
4 Pack Rat
4 Ash Zealot
4 Chandra's Phoenix
3 Xathrid Necromancer
3 Exava, Rakdos Blood Witch
3 Stormbreath Dragon
//Removal
2 Ultimate Price
3 Dreadbore
//Burn
4 Lightning Strike
4 Magma Jet
//Planeswalkers
2 Chandra, Pyromaster
//Lands
3 Mutavault
7 Mountain
4 Swamp
4 Blood Crypt
4 Rakdos Guildgate
1 Temple of Silence
1 Temple of Triumph
Sideboard
3 Dark Betrayal
3 Thoughtseize
3 Doom Blade
3 Mizzium Mortars
2 Erebos, God of the Dead
1 Whip of Erebos
[/deck]
I basically upped the curve a little in hopes of creating more strength against White Weenie, Esper, and U/W while still retaining the removal suite and "haste" feel of the deck. You run 10
humans and 12 assorted creatures. But your humans are likely to draw fire anyway.
PS:Sorry if my list posting is seeming like spam. If it's not helpful to anyone I'll gladly shut up and read more rather than talk.
[deck=Jdub's current Dos Packis]//Creatures
4 Pack Rat
4 Ash Zealot
4 Chandra's Phoenix
3 Xathrid Necromancer
3 Exava, Rakdos Blood Witch
3 Stormbreath Dragon
//Removal
2 Ultimate Price
3 Dreadbore
//Burn
4 Lightning Strike
4 Magma Jet
//Planeswalkers
2 Chandra, Pyromaster
//Lands
3 Mutavault
7 Mountain
4 Swamp
4 Blood Crypt
4 Rakdos Guildgate
1 Temple of Silence
1 Temple of Triumph
Sideboard
3 Dark Betrayal
3 Thoughtseize
3 Doom Blade
3 Mizzium Mortars
2 Erebos, God of the Dead
1 Whip of Erebos
[/deck]
I basically upped the curve a little in hopes of creating more strength against White Weenie, Esper, and U/W while still retaining the removal suite and "haste" feel of the deck. You run 10
humans and 12 assorted creatures. But your humans are likely to draw fire anyway.
PS:Sorry if my list posting is seeming like spam. If it's not helpful to anyone I'll gladly shut up and read more rather than talk.
- magicdownunder
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Ooo look I'm back here again even though I said I wouldn't be working on this list...
Two things I wanted to say:
1) I'm glad my tweaks are working for you Pedros, if you happen to own Temple of Deceit and Temple of Abandon I would run those over Silence and Triumph for the psychological effect
2) Jdub: post away, its important for ideas to be diverse when your building a new archetype - that said you shouldn't play defense when your facing control so I wouldn't recommend Xathrid Necromancer and its not like Wx is into the whole Blocking or Trading game (its good vs Small Br and Rx decks though).
Two things I wanted to say:
1) I'm glad my tweaks are working for you Pedros, if you happen to own Temple of Deceit and Temple of Abandon I would run those over Silence and Triumph for the psychological effect
2) Jdub: post away, its important for ideas to be diverse when your building a new archetype - that said you shouldn't play defense when your facing control so I wouldn't recommend Xathrid Necromancer and its not like Wx is into the whole Blocking or Trading game (its good vs Small Br and Rx decks though).
Reid Duke on
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Nice Idea MDU about playing those scry lands They really might think I am splashing for something.
I also put you MDU in my "friends" column, also started to do this money thing - don't really know if it is working, but if I can earn anything, it would be awsome.
MTGO 5-3-2-2 Standard 26.12.2013 Dos Rakis Round 1
MTGO 5-3-2-2 Standard 26.12.2013 Dos Rakis Round 2 + Daily Event Round 1
MTGO 26.12.2013 Standard Daily Event Round 3 Dos Rakis
MTGO 26.12.2013 Standard Daily Event
Round 3 Dos Rakis
MTGO 26.12.2013 Standard Daily Event Round 3 Dos Rakis
MTGO 5-3-2-2 Standard 26.12.2013 Dos Rakis Round 1
MTGO 5-3-2-2 Standard 26.12.2013 Dos Rakis Round 2
MTGO 5-3-2-2 Standard 26.12.2013 Dos Rakis Round 3
I also put you MDU in my "friends" column, also started to do this money thing - don't really know if it is working, but if I can earn anything, it would be awsome.
Some more videos:Adding 5 Movies to my channel, with win in 8 man queue:
MTGO 5-3-2-2 Standard 26.12.2013 Dos Rakis Round 1
MTGO 5-3-2-2 Standard 26.12.2013 Dos Rakis Round 2
MTGO 5-3-2-2 Standard 26.12.2013 Dos Rakis Round 3
MTGO 5-3-2-2 Standard 26.12.2013 Dos Rakis Round 1
MTGO 5-3-2-2 Standard 26.12.2013 Dos Rakis Round 2 + Daily Event Round 1
MTGO 26.12.2013 Standard Daily Event Round 3 Dos Rakis
MTGO 26.12.2013 Standard Daily Event
Round 3 Dos Rakis
MTGO 26.12.2013 Standard Daily Event Round 3 Dos Rakis
MTGO 5-3-2-2 Standard 26.12.2013 Dos Rakis Round 1
MTGO 5-3-2-2 Standard 26.12.2013 Dos Rakis Round 2
MTGO 5-3-2-2 Standard 26.12.2013 Dos Rakis Round 3
Last edited by Pedros on Fri Dec 27, 2013 11:09 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Its good for Wx since they build a swarm position (12 1-drops much...), this deck is mainly 1-for-1 or 1-for-2'ing the entire time vs control - we don't get as much value from the necromancer.I've always been a fan of necromancer. It devalues the B/x players removal and can put control in positions where if they verdict, they just lose.
Though you do make a good point about Bx, it would 2-for-1 em.
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I'm thinking about going back to a 2nd Chandra myself. It just doesn't seem like I get the best value with RR when I compare it to other cards I could be using, such as Chandra. Iunno, Chandra could eat a HDF, which could be good (or bad lol). Though, so could RR...and more. Though Chandra can card draw too....and punch holes through defenses. Hrmm...
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Full write up will come in the morning/tomorrow, but went to a small-but-competitive thursday night magic, taking my fancy new Dos Rakis deck.
Went 2-2-1 overall, getting to the top 8. Still fairly happy, since first loss was vs mono-b devo, and the game three was me landstarved and him flooded, and there were aout three turns in a row, where any topdecked vurn would have won it.
Second loss was vs esper control in the top 8. First game I couldn't answer blood baron, and the second I mulled 5 lands, a chandra, and a erebos, cause it was way too slow, then had to ship a 6 with no land. Then got stuck with 5 cards, with no land.
Basically what I took away from the night was that the 2/2 dreadbore price split main wqs probaly better, though does hurt mono-u some. And then the second lesson was that if we can't remove a blood baron, it's gg. I took the slot that main-boarding a second dreadbore gave me, and went up
to all 4 mortars in the side.
Also, still not 100% on toil//trouble, just feels like it doesn't impact the board enough (at all really)... I haven't had any huge blowouts with it, so that might be why, but at this point I'm only running 3x in the side still because I trust y'all's thoughts on it Though it is tempting to take 'em out for more removal, or maybe some rakdos returns, cause those are amusing, right?
Went 2-2-1 overall, getting to the top 8. Still fairly happy, since first loss was vs mono-b devo, and the game three was me landstarved and him flooded, and there were aout three turns in a row, where any topdecked vurn would have won it.
Second loss was vs esper control in the top 8. First game I couldn't answer blood baron, and the second I mulled 5 lands, a chandra, and a erebos, cause it was way too slow, then had to ship a 6 with no land. Then got stuck with 5 cards, with no land.
Basically what I took away from the night was that the 2/2 dreadbore price split main wqs probaly better, though does hurt mono-u some. And then the second lesson was that if we can't remove a blood baron, it's gg. I took the slot that main-boarding a second dreadbore gave me, and went up
to all 4 mortars in the side.
Also, still not 100% on toil//trouble, just feels like it doesn't impact the board enough (at all really)... I haven't had any huge blowouts with it, so that might be why, but at this point I'm only running 3x in the side still because I trust y'all's thoughts on it Though it is tempting to take 'em out for more removal, or maybe some rakdos returns, cause those are amusing, right?
I, for one, would like to welcome our new firebreathing narwhal overlords.
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(View: POSTS_VIEWTOPIC /POSTS_VIEWTOPIC_INTO) - Joined: Sun Dec 01, 2013 11:53 am
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(View: POSTS_VIEWTOPIC /POSTS_VIEWTOPIC_INTO) - Joined: Thu Oct 24, 2013 9:20 am
At first I was playing thoughtseize, and afterwards I changed it to Toil/Trouble.
Toil Trouble is a card to win a game, not to help other cards win a game. I often also try to wait for 6 mana to also draw me some cards or after revelation (often cast on upkeep or before combat).
BTW I noticed people dont want to watch full rounds. I will probably just record fast forward replays + sideboard I used.
Toil Trouble is a card to win a game, not to help other cards win a game. I often also try to wait for 6 mana to also draw me some cards or after revelation (often cast on upkeep or before combat).
BTW I noticed people dont want to watch full rounds. I will probably just record fast forward replays + sideboard I used.
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(View: POSTS_VIEWTOPIC /POSTS_VIEWTOPIC_INTO) - Joined: Thu Oct 03, 2013 11:21 am
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@ Pedros - I much prefer full rounds but replays are still cool
EDIT - I prefer replays to double queuing, just my preference though, others might feel differently
EDIT - I prefer replays to double queuing, just my preference though, others might feel differently
Last edited by LaZerBurn on Fri Dec 27, 2013 1:39 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Thanks to NerdBoyWonder for the awesome sig
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(View: POSTS_VIEWTOPIC /POSTS_VIEWTOPIC_INTO) - Joined: Thu Oct 24, 2013 9:20 am
BTW I noticed I have too man cards for various control deck but not enough cards for agro decks (I tend to SB out 4 cacklers and 4 jesters, dont like sb out exavas or dragons as MDU pointed out. If u sb your high end then it is fine)
Mostly I SB -4 cacklers, -4 jesters and bring 3 doomblades/3dark betrayals, 3 mizzium mortars and 1 Whip of Erebos. That leaves me 1 slot that is not optimal.
Esper
-4 Pack Rat, -2 Ultimate Price, -1 sth, +3 Toil/Trouble, +2 Erebos, +2 Mortars (for barons)
I can see leaving 1 or 2 drops.
Thouhts? Should I cut card from a control package for sth like Dreadbore (it is still good vs stuff like UW) or Flames of the Firebrand ?
Mostly I SB -4 cacklers, -4 jesters and bring 3 doomblades/3dark betrayals, 3 mizzium mortars and 1 Whip of Erebos. That leaves me 1 slot that is not optimal.
Esper
-4 Pack Rat, -2 Ultimate Price, -1 sth, +3 Toil/Trouble, +2 Erebos, +2 Mortars (for barons)
I can see leaving 1 or 2 drops.
Thouhts? Should I cut card from a control package for sth like Dreadbore (it is still good vs stuff like UW) or Flames of the Firebrand ?
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(View: POSTS_VIEWTOPIC /POSTS_VIEWTOPIC_INTO) - Joined: Thu Oct 03, 2013 11:21 am
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Do you need 3 Dark Betrayal? Running 2 still gives you 6 answers to Demon and 6 answers to Spectre (more if you bring in Mortars) and would free up a slot for FotF or Shock or DB. Cackler's are decent defensively in the BR aggro match up too, especially if you don't have Shock. They trade with Jester and Hero, and chumping Exava is huge.
Another more radical possibility is to drop Erebos and Toil for 3 Skullcrack which frees up 2 SB slots. I would expect the deck to beat Control anyway (the Pyro decks do) so while Toil is nice I don't think it is essential. Skullcrack is more aggressive than Erebos, way easier to cast, can't be DSphered and generally stopping 1 Gary or Revelation is all you need to do. I like the card draw ability but as with Toil I don't think it is essential.
Another more radical possibility is to drop Erebos and Toil for 3 Skullcrack which frees up 2 SB slots. I would expect the deck to beat Control anyway (the Pyro decks do) so while Toil is nice I don't think it is essential. Skullcrack is more aggressive than Erebos, way easier to cast, can't be DSphered and generally stopping 1 Gary or Revelation is all you need to do. I like the card draw ability but as with Toil I don't think it is essential.
Thanks to NerdBoyWonder for the awesome sig
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(View: POSTS_VIEWTOPIC /POSTS_VIEWTOPIC_INTO) - Joined: Thu Oct 24, 2013 9:20 am
Dark betrayal is quite important now where we see resurgence of black based control with spectres, demoms, rats and obzedats (obzedats are impossible to kill otherwise) plus esper midrange is a deck of choice of some pros on mtgo.
I can see going down in toil/trouble for another dreadbore/flames.
I can see going down in toil/trouble for another dreadbore/flames.
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(View: POSTS_VIEWTOPIC /POSTS_VIEWTOPIC_INTO) - Joined: Thu Sep 26, 2013 1:12 am
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What about the whole zemanjaski no-reactive-sideboarding thing?Basically what I took away from the night was that the 2/2 dreadbore price split main wqs probaly better, though does hurt mono-u some. And then the second lesson was that if we can't remove a blood baron, it's gg. I took the slot that main-boarding a second dreadbore gave me, and went up to all 4 mortars in the side.
Last edited by Zooligan on Fri Dec 27, 2013 3:03 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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I still follow it (in my own way) I'm not in favor of trying to control a control deck, its like dropping your gun and picking up spoon because your opp. is waving a knife at you (No reason to bring the fight to their level and just lose because they're better suited at it).What about the whole zemanjaski no-reactive-sideboarding thing?
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That makes sense PedrosDark betrayal is quite important now where we see resurgence of black based control with spectres, demoms, rats and obzedats (obzedats are impossible to kill otherwise) plus esper midrange is a deck of choice of some pros on mtgo.
I can see going down in toil/trouble for another dreadbore/flames.
Thanks to NerdBoyWonder for the awesome sig
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