[Primer] PyroRed

[windstrider]

Run the Guildgates. Sure, the Temples are really nice to have, but not having those extra white sources will hurt you in the long run.

[LaZerBurn]

Run the Guildgates. Sure, the Temples are really nice to have, but not having those extra white sources will hurt you in the long run.

This ^^^

[montu]

In regards to holding chained, i think depends on your hand and your opponent. Do you have burn to remove their t2 wall? Do you have answer to a turn 4 DD or Stormbreath? In my top 4 jund match, I had a Chained in my hand since opener. Once I realized I couldnt remove his Ooze, I decided to chained it.

Do you chain Voice of Resurgence on the spot?

My favorite plays from this past weekends IQ are swinging a Phoenix into SBD, then FoTF to ping it twice and the opponent one and recur phoenix.

Yeah, that's sweet. I also like Shocking a Fleecemane Lion after declare attack, and chump blocking with the newly-created
Elemental Token. (or Lightning Strike against Loxodon Smiter, etc.)

[Helios]

Montu - No. Voice is arguably their worst card against you. Smiter / Advent / Fleecemane / Trostani are all bigger threats. My rule of thumb is to save the Chains for a creature with Courage OR go with the "ima kill everything you play so that you can never play your Courage" plan.

[quote="[url=viewtopic.php?p=145864#p145864:25uq5mkb]poppa_f » Today, 07:08[/url:25uq5mkb]":25uq5mkb]No room for Boros charm at all? Have you changed your mind about this card since the Channel Fireball article?

There are [b:25uq5mkb]a lot of control decks in my local meta[/b:25uq5mkb], so I'm leaning towards playing it for the sweeper defence.
[/quote:25uq5mkb]No 75 posted here is set and stone - if you know for a fact you need a card for your local meta, play it. MDU is playing online, and that is what his builds are optimized for.

[BobMcFail]

So I feel like shocks are terrible what could I play instead of shock?

[Elricity]

In general, shock is a powerful card in this deck because of how it meshs with Young Pyromancer and Chandra's Phoenix and the amount of things it kills right now. You will board it out against some decks but game 1, you should have at least 3.

[windstrider]

No room for Boros charm at all? Have you changed your mind about this card since the Channel Fireball article?

There are a lot of control decks in my local meta, so I'm leaning towards playing it for the sweeper defence.

No 75 posted here is set and in stone - if you know for a fact you need a card for your local meta, play it. MDU is playing online, and that is what his builds are optimized for.

This, this, thisity, this!

The decks and discussions here are meant to give you ideas about the different options that you have. It
is absolutely up to you to customize the deck to 1) your playstyle and 2) your local metagame.

So I feel like shocks are terrible. What could I play instead of shock?

Explain, please. Why do you feel that Shock is terrible in this deck? How are you using it that it's been bad for you?

Edit: Corrected grammar.

[BobMcFail]

@Windstrider : I see, you are a grammar nazi . Just kidding. There are so many X/3s and X/1s that the two damage feels kind of weird. I haven't played shocks with YP yet, so maybe it is great with her?

How do I quote here. That is much harder than on mtgs.

[Calamity]

So I feel like shocks are terrible what could I play instead of shock?

You're really living up to your name here

Shocks are 1 mana instants for combat tricks with Young Pyromancer and they rebuy chandra's phoenix, both of which are key synergies that make the deck function.

[Helios]

Calamity, sometimes Shock is a terrible card. If the meta moves away from Shock = 1 mana terminate, then Shock is bad.

[windstrider]

@Windstrider : I see, you are a grammar nazi . Just kidding. There are so many X/3s and X/1s that the two damage feels kind of weird. I haven't played shocks with YP yet, so maybe it is great with her?

How do I quote here. That is much harder than on mtgs.

Yes, absolutely. I teach Composition at the college level. Sloppy writing is habit forming.

In most other decks and formats, it sucks, but Shock is an enabler in this deck. Shock + any of your 2-power creatures can kill x/3s and x/4s. Shock an x/3 with a Pyromancer on the field and use the token to block. With a Phoenix around, Shock becomes "Deal two damage to target opponent. Draw a card.
" Shock really is one of the best spells in this deck since it enables so much synergy.

The Quote button is in the top right of each comment. You can also click the Quote button while you are responding to someone else's post.

[montu]

So I feel like shocks are terrible what could I play instead of shock?

Shocks are 1 mana instants for combat tricks with Young Pyromancer and they rebuy chandra's phoenix, both of which are key synergies that make the deck function.

Shock also lets Ash Zealot eat 4/4 blockers for breakfast.

EDIT: Yeah, windstrider said that above.

[windstrider]

Calamity, sometimes Shock is a terrible card. If the meta moves away from Shock = 1 mana terminate, then Shock is bad.

Exactly. Shock is good right now because of all the low-toughness creatures running around, which is why Lightning Bolt would be overpowered in this Standard environment.

[Elricity]

@Windstrider : I see, you are a grammar nazi . Just kidding. There are so many X/3s and X/1s that the two damage feels kind of weird. I haven't played shocks with YP yet, so maybe it is great with her?

How do I quote here. That is much harder than on mtgs.

Lost my post and everyone else said what I was going to say so I'll just say the last part.

If shock stops becoming decent removal in this meta and there isn't a 1 mana burn to replace it, this deck will fall apart. It's that important to the curve of the deck. Someone feel free to disagree.

[InflatablePie]

Due to bike problems and stuff, I haven't played Magic in like two weeks. And I have a GPT on Saturday ;_;

Is Rod better than Last Breath because it can hit multiple MoWs and clock the Mono-U players once you wipe their board? I like the idea of the card, but I hate the amount of mana needed to go into it.

Is a singleton Stormbreath still an okay option in the 22 Land versions? I'm not sure if I want to buy a third Chandra (since I traded my third away a while back) but I just might pick up one dargon.

I'm running the 22-land, 4x Zealot 3x Pyromancer 3x FFS version, and I might drop a FFS for a Pyrewild. I'm also considering moving back to FoM but... I like Boros Charm ;_;

And lastly, I'm guessing it's too greedy to play 19 red sources+3 Mutavault?

[Purp]

Due to bike problems and stuff, I haven't played Magic in like two weeks. And I have a GPT on Saturday ;_;

Is Rod better than Last Breath because it can hit multiple MoWs and clock the Mono-U players once you wipe their board? I like the idea of the card, but I hate the amount of mana needed to go into it.

Is a singleton Stormbreath still an okay option in the 22 Land versions? I'm not sure if I want to buy a third Chandra (since I traded my third away a while back) but I just might pick up one dargon.

I'm running the 22-land, 4x Zealot 3x Pyromancer 3x FFS version, and I might drop a FFS for a Pyrewild. I'm also considering moving back to FoM but... I like Boros Charm ;_;

And lastly, I'm guessing it's too greedy to play 19 red sources+3
Mutavault?

1 Dragon is fine on 22 mana.

FFS without BTE is a bad idea imo.

The matchups where you would want Boros Charm, you should be winning anyway without it. FoM helps beat Mono U, Big Boros and Gx devotion

[montu]

If shock stops becoming decent removal in this meta and there isn't a 1 mana burn to replace it, this deck will fall apart. It's that important to the curve of the deck. Someone feel free to disagree.

Interesting question. A LOT of what I hit with Shock is a x/1. (There are obvious exceptions.) It would be interesting to test the benefits/tradeoffs of using, say, Spark Jolt as a replacement.

Benefits

• Scry 1
• Still kills Cloudfin Raptor, [card]Judge's Familiar[/card], Pack Rat, [card:
  2wgusrpk]Lifebane Zombie[/card], Firedrinker Satyr, Firefist Striker, Elvish Mystic, . . .

Downside

• Doesn't kill: Tidebinder Mage, Mutavault, Ash Zealot, Fanatic of Mogis, Burning-Tree Emissary, Rakdos Cackler, [card]Chandra's Phoenix[/card], Voyaging Satyr, Scavenging Ooze, Gore-House Chainwalker . . .

That's a lot of downside. On the other hand, the Scry 1 from the Spark Jolt would make it easier to curve out without the loss in
tempo you get with Temple.

Just thinking out loud . . .

[windstrider]

Spark Jolt doesn't help you kill bigger creatures like Loxodon Smiter, and that's a very big consideration. One damage is also much worse than two damage to the opponent, especially when recurring a Phoenix in the same turn to hit them for four total.

Just curious, have you tried the scrylands yet? I was hesitant at first, but now I don't want to leave home without 'em. The tempo loss is fairly easy to work around, and the white mana is invaluable since it opens up so very many possibilities for the deck.

[zemanjaski]

Ill put it simply.

Shock is good against aggro, because 1 mana terminate is good.
Shock is paradoxically good against control, because of the synergies.
Shock is bad against true midrange decks, as are most of the cards in this deck. Playing a bunch of 2/2s and 2/1s is not so flash against 3/3s and 4/4s.

If your meta is mostly midrange, then more cards than just Shock will be bad and you should really be looking at a substantial overhaul.

RE: scylands. I think 90% of people who don't like them haven't played enough with them. The other 10% are just terrible.

[Link]

I'd rather a singleton Pyrewild before a single dragon for 22 lands, Pie

[montu]

Spark Jolt doesn't help you kill bigger creatures like Loxodon Smiter, and that's a very big consideration. One damage is also much worse than two damage to the opponent, especially when recurring a Phoenix in the same turn to hit them for four total.

Yeah, I don't plan on playing Spark Jolt. It was just a mental exercise.

Just curious, have you tried the scrylands yet? I was hesitant at first, but now I don't want to leave home without 'em. The tempo loss is fairly easy to work around, and the white mana is invaluable since it opens up so very many possibilities for the deck.

I've been using them online for the last couple of days. I'm playing an exact copy of MDU's
Teak to Z's PyroWhite. It's treating me well so far (7 wins / 2 losses - Tournament Practice - so nothing to brag about). It's just that I've played Mono-Red exclusively for the past 4 months, so CitpT just takes some getting used to.

I only have 2 paper (Temple, that is . . . got most of the other Scry lands), and will probably give them a spin this Friday, either using Boros Guildgate for the other 2, or trading for them before FNM. I played a bunch of MTG during the original Ravnica block, so I already had a playset of Sacred Foundry and didn't need to worry about getting them for this deck.

[InflatablePie]

Pyrewild would be main, not side. Dargon would be side.

I tried the BTE+FFS combo and found it too... slow. Maybe my draws were bad, I just hated topdecking a BTE and FFS never really got online. I could grab my Chandra back and just run MDU's mainboard.

[Elricity]

RE: scylands. I think 90% of people who don't like them haven't played enough with them. The other 10% are just terrible.

"Man, scry 1 on a guildgate?! That's a shitty rare"



Falling in the black hole of trying to figure out mathimatically how valuable those scrylands are is the ugly part. It's like trying to explain delver's consistancy in SCM/Inn without saying "dahhh, you just have to try it".

[TBuzzsaw]

I'm definitely eating my hat on the scrylands. I thought they were retarded until I played them.

[Elricity]

I was quite happy to hear they were announced but I was using guildgates last season so I was already quite aware how to play/build around tapped lands.

[zemanjaski]

"The fix my colours AND my draws? Must be terrible"

[Helios]

Yea, they're total shit, haven't you heard?

[zemanjaski]

Also Chandra is terrible and YP is legacy only.

[vundo]

scrylands are still pretty shitty to have for rares. However, my first deck on MTGO was pyrored which I never played before since I went directly to pyrowhite on paper. Playing pyrored, I obviously missed chained to the rocks but I also missed the scrylands a lot. As been stated before, they fix draws and this deck has so many lines of play that coming in tapped rarely hurts you.

[zemanjaski]

Whether they're a rare or not is irrelevant for constructed.

[Helios]

YP in Legacy burn is my baby. Thread coming soon.

[Elricity]

Also Chandra is terrible and YP is legacy only.

You're doing it wrong. YP is awesome with Purphoros.

The hell were we all talking about again?

It would take a weird all in storm type build for me want to try spark jolt. I did have fun times with Flamespeaker Adept in the prerelease. And then I just looked her up and saw she costs 3. Thought she was 2, moving on.

[Valdarith]

He was being sarcastic.

[montu]

He was being sarcastic.

Oh, NOW you tell us . . . after I ripped up my cards. (Stupid people who don't use the sarcasm emoticons.)

[zemanjaski]

It's safe to assume that every comment I make is sarcastic.

[montu]

It's safe to assume that every comment I make is sarcastic.

I'm stuck in an infinite recursion with that statement.

[dpaine88]

We may have a few other IQ winners beside vundo, Pulp happen to be most vocal about it.

So I repeat, any other winners of IQ and GPT please let me know .

EDIT: I'm starting to believe it may just be Vundo and Pulp, but I could of sworn I read about other DtR players running these types of event in the clan thread.

If we are couting top4 split like Pulp then yea, I got a few. I usally just do SCG Opens and TCG 5k events though.

[magicdownunder]

If we are couting top4 split like Pulp then yea, I got a few. I usally just do SCG Opens and TCG 5k events though.

PM me the report, your placing and date.

[dpaine88]

Im a little confused at why the current lists run only 3 YP$, given he enables a lot of synergy in the deck and doesn't get worse in multiples really.

I would think he would be the last card you would want to cut..

I'm sure there is a good reason, could anyone clue me in?

[dpaine88]

If we are couting top4 split like Pulp then yea, I got a few. I usally just do SCG Opens and TCG 5k events though.

PM me the report, your placing and date.

Yea just looked it up and I just wrote down the matches, not really a report.

Maybe yalls GPT's are a bigger deal than mine but mine are like 30-50 people tops... Like 5-6 rounds tops. Basically like a TCG 1k. Still a great accomplishment.

I usually only write up full on big reports on here for events with 200+ people.

At least for me, I find it much easy to Win/Split top4 a 1k or GPT than it is to
top16 a 200-300 person 9 or 10 round event.

Like all you gotta do is win 4, double draw and you're in the top 8. The grind of a 10 round event can be really , really hard. I've kinda hit a wall with top16 and always seem to go 5-1 then end up 7-2 =(

something about this post just screams "douchebag" to me but I am really not trying to come off that way =D