[Primer] PyroRed

[zemanjaski]

There's Gor-Clan Rampager and that's it for green for premier cards worth splashing. The rest is ok but inferior to white overall. Also Chained is a dumb card. When they print cards like that, you play them. You can probably build a good Gruul Sligh deck, but I don't think you want a Pyromancer build.

[Helios]

I think my experiment for this FNM will be 1 dragon in the main. (Originally 3 Chandra, then 2 Chandra 1 Pyrewild, now 2 Chandra 1 Dragon). I'd like to see how well he runs, though I'm always nervous about 5 drops. Surely 23 land is enough for a single 5, yea?

[zemanjaski]

Yeah I like the 23 land with 1 dragon config, used 23 land with 1 conscripts a lot last season, it's good.

[Yarpus]

There's Gor-Clan Rampager and that's it for green for premier cards worth splashing. The rest is ok but inferior to white overall. Also Chained is a dumb card. When they print cards like that, you play them. You can probably build a good Gruul Sligh deck, but I don't think you want a Pyromancer build.

Probably, I also do prefer Gruul Deck Wins shell. When I've tried to squeeze in all of the cards I'd play in PyroGruul I just couldn't find slots.

[Helios]

Wizards needs to give us back Conscripts. Winning with her was just so satisfying.

[magicdownunder]

I think my experiment for this FNM will be 1 dragon in the main. (Originally 3 Chandra, then 2 Chandra 1 Pyrewild, now 2 Chandra 1 Dragon). I'd like to see how well he runs, though I'm always nervous about 5 drops. Surely 23 land is enough for a single 5, yea?

Sounds like a good plan, but is Dragon > Chandra? (also make her 0 ability more shaky)

- - - - - - - - - -

I decided to run Zemanjaski's PyroWhite list with some mild changes to combat the Big/Devo RW surge on the online meta game:

[deck=Zemanjaski's PyroWhite - MDU Tweaked]Lands 23
11 Mountain
4 Mutavault
4 Sacred Foundry
4 Temple of Triumph

Creatures 20
4 Ash Zealot
4 Chandra’s Phoenix
4 Firedrinker Satyr
4 Rakdos Cackler
3 Young Pyromancer
1 Pyrewild Shaman

Instants
11
4 Lightning Strike
4 Magma Jet
3 Shock

Others 6
3 Chandra, Pyromaster
2 Chained to the Rocks
1 Flame of the Firebrand

Sideboard 15
04x Boros Reckoner
03x Skullcrack
02x Chained to the Rocks
02x Mizzium Mortars
02x Fanatic of Mogis
01x Hammer of Purphoros
01x Rod of Ruin[/deck]

The MUs were:

G1: Cuneo's UW (2-1) <- this is a very hard MU
G2: BG Rock (1-2) - Poor SB'ing Choices
G3: Esper (2-0)
G4: Monoblack (2-1)

I recommend giving the list a shot if RW and Gx is giving you trouble.

[zemanjaski]

Rod of Ruin is SO tech.

[Yarpus]

Imo too tech, but as long as it works...

[zemanjaski]

So adorable I feel I should be wearing kitsune ears when I play it ^____^

[windstrider]

You mean you're not?

[Valdarith]

I feel like Ghor-Clan Rampager's value went way down after rotation due to all the removal being played in the format. That said, I've played the card in Modern and it has done well, and we all know how much removal is in that format.

[zemanjaski]

All the terror effects hurt the card a lot.

[Calamity]

Zealous conscripts allowed me to win some games I wouldn't (shouldn't?) have otherwise in a spectacular fashion. Card was sick and I hope they print something analogous to it. The dragon is kinda close but it still doesn't let you win out of nowhere.

[magicdownunder]

So adorable I feel I should be wearing kitsune ears when I play it ^____^

Its looks horrible but it solid tech, btw if anyone want to play a deck like UB fae from the old standard days I recommend UB MoW its has some disgusting plays.

Got another win with the Z's PyroWhite - MDU Tweaked list (it seems like the better choice right now for the DE's, only concern is which to play for the MOCS)

G1: Hexproof Auras (1-2)
G2: Gr Devotion (2-1, I mulled to 6 game 1 + 2, and mulled to 5 game 3)
G3: UW control (2-0, I think he just netdeck, because he had no idea how to play his own deck)
G4: UB MoW (2-0)

My sideboard plans have changed quite a lot since MOCS11, to work with my new approach to a few MUs.

What are your SB plans? Do you guys
use the same tactics I use during MOCS11 or is it much different?

EDIT: How fun, so without DEs (I don't count 2-mans as practice) I won't get a chance to test the decks against "skilled" players with variety of decks, I'll just have to wing MOCS...

[Pedros]

When I come back today I will try this list also.

Last night I playtested with 20 lands build Boros. I still flooded really hard, didnt notice any screw, as most of the time we still muligan 1 land hands - only keep the one with 2+ one drop creatures, and it doesnt happen a lot.

Maybe it is just my bad luck variance - in 20 land deck I drew 9 lands vs my esper control op having only 6.

[Lightning_Dolt]

I miss zealous conscripts too. That can was good to me. It won me the game, nearly everytime I cast it, and it won me the biggest tournament I've ever won. Do you guys thing a one of Traitorous Instinct could fill a similar role? Obviously not as good, but I don't thing we'll get another card like that for a while.

[zemanjaski]

I think Zealous was so good because the format was defined by super powered 5 drops (Thragtusk, Thundermaw) or very good 4s (Aristocrat, Hellrider). That's not the case now, so the impact is way lower. Consequently I think the appeal of a maindeck threaten is very low.

[Yarpus]

I still can't forget about Conscript stealing Jace, ulting Jace to find the last Thragtusk and my Thundermaw Hellkite.
I won this game against Bant player who managed to get onto 60 life and casted 3 Thragtusks 3 Revelations.

[F.I.A]

Just to eliminate any wrong ideas, Rod of Ruin is a hate card dedicated for MoW. Though I suppose it can help against BR aggro.

After some rather embarrassing incidents involving Peak Eruption, I think I might reconsider and cut a Mutavault in place of a mountain. There was one game where the opponent blew out my only 2 mountains for the whole game, and the only thing left for me were three muta and a hand of [mana]rr[/mana] cards.

[magicdownunder]

Fairly old set of videos, I no longer use Act of Treason but Ash Zealot does shine against Midrange decks.

[deck]PyroWhite 2nd Test[/deck]

Standard Tournament: Daily Event 6267908 (3-1)

G1: Naya Control
G2:
MonoRed Devotion
G3: RW Tokens
G4: MonoBlack Devotion

Warning only 5 sets of videos remaining, with wizards killing MODO we may not see any new ones in awhile.

[Lightning_Dolt]

FFS > YP$?? Without BTE?

[magicdownunder]

FFS > YP$?? Without BTE?

Nope, not at all - in fact I'll argue that FFS is even worst without BtE .

This was during the phase when I still believe Gx Devotion was unbeatable, I only have two finishes recorded with this list before I swapped out.

[poppa_f]

There isn't a green spell that kills master, and the green cards are worse against mono black. Otherwise it's probably pretty even.

I'm about a day late with this comment, but this isn't 100% true, I've seen people use Polukranos to kill MoW and Time to Feed as a sideboard option.

Admittedly MBD is still a pretty bad matchup for Gruul overall though.

[Keftenk]

I can't tell if its just dumb-luck, but having success vs Junk with this setup:

[deck]
Creatures
4 Firedrinker Satyr
4 Rakdos Cackler
4 Ash Zealot
3 Young Pyromancer
4 Chandra's Phoenix
1 Stormbreath Dragon
1 Pyrewild Shaman

Land
13 Mountain
4 Temple of Triumph
4 Sacred Foundry
2 Mutavault

Other Spells
3 Shock
1 Flames of the Firebrand
4 Lightning Strike
4 Magma Jet
2 Chained to the Rocks

Planeswalkers
2 Chandra, Pyromaster

Sideboard
4 Boros Reckoner
2 Chained to the Rocks
2 Mizzium Mortars
3 Skullcrack
1 Assemble the Legion
1 Flames of the Firebrand
2 Boros Charm
[/deck]

[LaZerBurn]

@ MDU - I learnt a LOT about sequencing plays from these so thanks again for sharing them

@ Helios - given the tragic circumstances (5 sets of vids from MDU left and a probable drought ahead) I thought I'd scour the thread and watch the old ones again over the coming months but I then remembered that there is no need as the primer is so well maintained that they are all filed neatly on the first page! Thank you!

I know that I thank a lot; I'm English, we're nice like that Jokes aside I'm just a very forthright kind of a guy; if you help me I'll thank you, profusely On the other
hand if you are an ass I'll tell you that too

[FullofGravy]

You're English too LaZerBurn? Haha.
I lost to U/W Cuneo godhand in game 3, still rolled him game 2 with quick start. Hopefully Boros Charms/Skullcracks will be good enough this weekend versus that.

[RaidaTheBlade]

So, based on some testing I've been doing, I've been working on a build to try out at fnm in preperation for the IQ this weekend.

[deck]
Creatures:
4 Rakdos Cackler
4 Firedrinker Satyr
4 Young Pyromancer
4 Burning-Tree Emissary
4 Firefist Striker
4 Chandra's Phoenix

Spells:
4 Magma Jet
4 Lightning Strike
3 Shock
2 Mizzium Mortars

Planeswalkers:
2 Chandra, Pyromaster

Land:
20 Mountain
1 Mutavault

Sideboard:
3 Boros Reckoner
3 Skullcrack
3 Act of Treason
2 Mizzium Mortars
2 Flames of The Firebrand
2 Burning Earth
[/deck]

The biggest change from what I WAS running is switching from ash zealot to bte/ffs. I love Ashley, but I've been having problems with 3-color control/midrange, and G/W aggro.
The switch was because it gives me more momentum/tempo against the 1for1 control the 3colors (dega, mainly) are so fond of, while ffs can help push through the last little bit of damage. They
also help some vs G/W aggro, by helping me race game 1, and also push through more damage.

I also added burning earth into the sideboard, to try and grab a few more free wins against naya, dega, esper, and american.

I've also been contemplating adding in 1 or 2 pyrewilds, though they lose a tiny bit without ash, they are still good. I dunno what I'd pull out though, so ideas on that'd be helpful.


So yeah, there's that. Thoughts, discussion, etc?

[finn62]

Is riot control a viable answer to MoW?

[RaidaTheBlade]

Not really since it doesn't really answer it so much as delay it for a turn...

[finn62]

Yeah, you're right.

[Helios]

I know that I thank a lot; I'm English, we're nice like that Jokes aside I'm just a very forthright kind of a guy; if you help me I'll thank you, profusely On the other hand if you are an ass I'll tell you that too

I love you for it I'm from the southern part of the US, so thanks are a big thing here. Also FYI the latest bunch of videos haven't been added to the primer yet, I'll try and get them all up today.

[LaZerBurn]

@ Helios - Oxford Town in Mississippi? I lived in Dothan, Alabama and Bonifay, Florida for a couple of years a few years back so we were almost neighbours

@FullofGravy - certainly am From Hull originally, now living in Edinburgh

@ MDU, Zem, Pedros and anyone else who plays on MTGO and is interested in some hardcore play testing - read this please

http://community.ist.utl.pt/viewtopic.p ... 52#p140752

[Helios]

Yup, Oxford, MS. Home of all things good in the world. Except Khaos. And GSM employment protection. And alcohol shipping laws. And...wait.

At least it's a beautiful place.

[Valdarith]

Holy shit, you lived in Dothan? That's my stomping grounds.

[Zooligan]

GSM employment protection.

Groupe Spécial Mobile?? Gay Sado-Masochist?

[LaZerBurn]

Holy shit, you lived in Dothan? That's my stomping grounds.

I certainly did - in a trailer at Pecan Point RV Park on the 231

[Valdarith]

I know that place. Technically I live in Ozark (grew up there and moved back to the area recently) but no one knows where that is so I just say Dothan.

[Helios]

GSM employment protection.

Groupe Spécial Mobile?? Gay Sado-Masochist?

Gender/Sexual Minority. It's a better acronym than LGBTQ

[Helios]

Also, let's get back on topic and move this discussion to the clan thread

[LaZerBurn]

Control players are smart? Nah, they're just grumpy I had to wait 10 minutes for my booster